Booster4324 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 My clients percentage of profits? Well it's 100%....let taxes of course. If you mean ROR it varies depending on the client. I have no idea what you're talking about with regard to the rest of your post. Perhaps I phrased that poorly. What is your average rate of return for your clients. Say ytd, 3 year and 5 year. You really can't look up those figures? The rest of the post was directed to someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Perhaps I phrased that poorly. What is your average rate of return for your clients. Say ytd, 3 year and 5 year. You really can't look up those figures? The rest of the post was directed to someone else. No I can't look up those figures. I manage millions of dollars in various portfolios in all asset classes from 100% bonds to 100% equities, fixed and equity indexed annuities, REITS and everything in between. Sorry, I don't manage with a cookie cutter. I'm sorry but what are you getting at with your question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 No I can't look up those figures. I manage millions of dollars in various portfolios in all asset classes from 100% bonds to 100% equities, fixed and equity indexed annuities, REITS and everything in between. Sorry, I don't manage with a cookie cutter. I'm sorry but what are you getting at with your question? Odd, I thought you were in managing individual accounts that I would have assumed normally included ror (since you insist on being pedantic) in any sort of advertisement for your services. I was simply curious as to how well your expert management had performed. I wanted to know how your overall services did. Since you evidently are far past that point, one can only assume that those beneath you knew even less. So what is the name of your company so I can avoid it in the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Odd, I thought you were in managing individual accounts that I would have assumed normally included ror (since you insist on being pedantic) in any sort of advertisement for your services. I was simply curious as to how well your expert management had performed. I wanted to know how your overall services did. Since you evidently are far past that point, one can only assume that those beneath you knew even less. So what is the name of your company so I can avoid it in the future? What the hell are you talking about advertising rates of return. You show me any advertisement where an adviser lists his ROR for particular clients. ROR of particular investments yes but you didn't ask for particular investments. You asked what ROR my clients had. I can't give you that because they're all different. Please do avoid our company, that's fine by me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 What the hell are you talking about advertising rates of return. You show me any advertisement where an adviser lists his ROR for particular clients. ROR of particular investments yes but you didn't ask for particular investments. You asked what ROR my clients had. I can't give you that because they're all different. Please do avoid our company, that's fine by me. You mean your company doesn't break it down further than what they give the actual investor? If you advertise 10% on this particular mutual fund, 12% on this slightly more risky one, 6% (or whatever) on T Bills, and then you break it up 33/33/34 for a particularly simple example, what is the frigging rate of return? A spreadsheet can do this math. Fine and fair enough, has anyone made a profit over the last 3 years? If so, what were they in? Have any of your clients made a profit? 5 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 You mean your company doesn't break it down further than what they give the actual investor? If you advertise 10% on this particular mutual fund, 12% on this slightly more risky one, 6% (or whatever) on T Bills, and then you break it up 33/33/34 for a particularly simple example, what is the frigging rate of return? A spreadsheet can do this math. Fine and fair enough, has anyone made a profit over the last 3 years? If so, what were they in? Have any of your clients made a profit? 5 years? One more time, I don't create the same portfolio for all my clients. They're all different. They all have different goals and time frames. Some are saving for a home in 5 years and some are saving for retirement in 25 years some have been retired for 20 years. Some are saving your their kids college in 8 years. Is that too hard for you to understand that I can't quote you exact rates of return for clients. I can quote exact rates of returns for specific investments but that wasn't your question. My frigging rate of return depends on the frigging particular investment and I've got dozens of allocations out there. Has anyone had positive returns the last 3 and 5 years. Of course. Not the greatest but yes they've been positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 One more time, I don't create the same portfolio for all my clients. They're all different. They all have different goals and time frames. Some are saving for a home in 5 years and some are saving for retirement in 25 years some have been retired for 20 years. Some are saving your their kids college in 8 years. Is that too hard for you to understand that I can't quote you exact rates of return for clients. I can quote exact rates of returns for specific investments but that wasn't your question. My frigging rate of return depends on the frigging particular investment and I've got dozens of allocations out there. Has anyone had positive returns the last 3 and 5 years. Of course. Not the greatest but yes they've been positive. I am pretty sure my retirement stock fund return the year of the war and after (2003 and 2004) was pretty high... In the 20% range... No? I forget. Not sure, it was the opposite the years after 911 (2001 and 2002). Again... I forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I am pretty sure my retirement stock fund return the year of the war and after (2003 and 2004) was pretty high... In the 20% range... No? I forget. Not sure, it was the opposite the years after 911 (2001 and 2002). Again... I forget. Yes, 2003-2004 equity portfolios were in the high teens low twenties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 One more time, I don't create the same portfolio for all my clients. They're all different. They all have different goals and time frames. Some are saving for a home in 5 years and some are saving for retirement in 25 years some have been retired for 20 years. Some are saving your their kids college in 8 years. Is that too hard for you to understand that I can't quote you exact rates of return for clients. I can quote exact rates of returns for specific investments but that wasn't your question. My frigging rate of return depends on the frigging particular investment and I've got dozens of allocations out there. Has anyone had positive returns the last 3 and 5 years. Of course. Not the greatest but yes they've been positive. I understand there are different portfolios for different clients. But... Well, if you have dozens of allocations (say 100 for simplicities sake) you could plug them into a spreadsheet easily enough. Might take you a bit, not sure if it would take you as long as you spent talking to me as you could simply pick representative investments and see where they ended up in a 3 year period, guesstimate from there. My guess is you are scared. You know the actual figures and you know how bad they are. You seem to be dodging the issue. In any case, I am sorry I gave you a hard time. Sorta nervous myself to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I understand there are different portfolios for different clients. But... Well, if you have dozens of allocations (say 100 for simplicities sake) you could plug them into a spreadsheet easily enough. Might take you a bit, not sure if it would take you as long as you spent talking to me as you could simply pick representative investments and see where they ended up in a 3 year period, guesstimate from there. My guess is you are scared. You know the actual figures and you know how bad they are. You seem to be dodging the issue. In any case, I am sorry I gave you a hard time. Sorta nervous myself to be honest. I can totally get you the annual rates of return for each fund in my TSP (fed) retirment fund since the inception back 20 years ago... Of course through the years new funds were added... I can get you all raw data... But, not now... I am on a slow dial up connection at home. Actually... It is all public... Go to: TSP (Federal Empoloyees Retirement) Again... all very public... Just click on rates of return... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I understand there are different portfolios for different clients. But... Well, if you have dozens of allocations (say 100 for simplicities sake) you could plug them into a spreadsheet easily enough. Might take you a bit, not sure if it would take you as long as you spent talking to me as you could simply pick representative investments and see where they ended up in a 3 year period, guesstimate from there. My guess is you are scared. You know the actual figures and you know how bad they are. You seem to be dodging the issue. In any case, I am sorry I gave you a hard time. Sorta nervous myself to be honest. Scared?? No not at all. I see this as a great opportunity for what I do. My services are needed now more than ever. I've been through this before with the bear of 2000-2002. The tech bubble crushed portfolios, 911 crushed portfolios but not the ones I manage. Did they lose money? Hell yeah, but they out performed the market as a whole due to conservative allocations. Our clients hated us in 1999 because we didn't have them loaded up with tech. The hated us in 2006 for not letting them load up in real estate and they're thanking us now. No, I'm not scared at all. I love the history of it. We'll get through, we always do. As I told one of my clients in order for the markets to go up they need to get beat up every now and then...maybe not this much but this just points to a pretty strong recovery. When? Who knows, but if your money is not needed for 15-20 years does it really matter? Now to your question. Why would I plug all my allocations into a spread sheet to get an average rate of return on all of them? That would be indicative of no portfolio I manage so would be an absolute waste of time. What I do is get people to do the right thing. Save their money. Reduce their taxes. Protect their assets. And make sure that when they die their estate moves to their heirs in a timely and cost efficient manner. Make sure they don't make any silly mistakes by taking the emotion out of their investing. It's not all about rates of return, it's about managing expectations. If their expectations are too high, I don't take them on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I can totally get you the annual rates of return for each fund in my TSP (fed) retirment fund since the inception back 20 years ago... Of course through the years new funds were added... I can get you all raw data... But, not now... I am on a slow dial up connection at home. Actually... It is all public... Go to: TSP (Federal Empoloyees Retirement) Again... all very public... Just click on rates of return... That has nothing to do with it brother. I started hacking on Chef (even though I like his very conservative ass) because he was still pimping the investment route. Sure that is probably the best route in the long term. But, no one knows for sure at this time and he was starting to sound like a shill. Much as you are for Obama. I understand being Liberal, but I lost faith a few years back. The insults didn't help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 That has nothing to do with it brother. I started hacking on Chef (even though I like his very conservative ass) because he was still pimping the investment route. Sure that is probably the best route in the long term. But, no one knows for sure at this time and he was starting to sound like a shill. Much as you are for Obama. I understand being Liberal, but I lost faith a few years back. The insults didn't help. Great. Here I am working with people making sure they're doing the right thing and putting them in a better place financially. And because I don't answer your unanswerable question I'm a shill. If you have a problem with someone saying you should be investing your money don't come to me when in 20 years you don't have enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 That has nothing to do with it brother. I started hacking on Chef (even though I like his very conservative ass) because he was still pimping the investment route. Sure that is probably the best route in the long term. But, no one knows for sure at this time and he was starting to sound like a shill. Much as you are for Obama. I understand being Liberal, but I lost faith a few years back. The insults didn't help. Sorry. I thought you were looking at for rates of returns. I agree... Right now we have to individually protect ourselves first! Of course they don't want young people to pull out... It is all a confidence game. But, I am not going to put my real money in, just to watch it evaporate in front of my face... I would rather feed my family with it or pay tuition. A good gambler knows when he can cut his loses and have a cooling off period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Scared?? No not at all. I see this as a great opportunity for what I do. My services are needed now more than ever. I've been through this before with the bear of 2000-2002. The tech bubble crushed portfolios, 911 crushed portfolios but not the ones I manage. Did they lose money? Hell yeah, but they out performed the market as a whole due to conservative allocations. Our clients hated us in 1999 because we didn't have them loaded up with tech. The hated us in 2006 for not letting them load up in real estate and they're thanking us now. No, I'm not scared at all. I love the history of it. We'll get through, we always do. As I told one of my clients in order for the markets to go up they need to get beat up every now and then...maybe not this much but this just points to a pretty strong recovery. When? Who knows, but if your money is not needed for 15-20 years does it really matter? Now to your question. Why would I plug all my allocations into a spread sheet to get an average rate of return on all of them? That would be indicative of no portfolio I manage so would be an absolute waste of time. What I do is get people to do the right thing. Save their money. Reduce their taxes. Protect their assets. And make sure that when they die their estate moves to their heirs in a timely and cost efficient manner. Make sure they don't make any silly mistakes by taking the emotion out of their investing. It's not all about rates of return, it's about managing expectations. If their expectations are too high, I don't take them on. Because that was my question. I asked for ror in my first post and you were condescending (totally cool as we have done that tons of times and I used the wrong term) and changed the topic off the bat. I totally understand what your job is even if I couldn't do it without a lot of training. No worries and best wishes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Because that was my question. I asked for ror in my first post and you were condescending (totally cool as we have done that tons of times and I used the wrong term) and changed the topic off the bat. I totally understand what your job is even if I couldn't do it without a lot of training. No worries and best wishes. But you do understand that I can't answer that question right? My clients don't give a rats ass what the RORs are for any other allocation than theirs so why would I give them an average of every possible scenario. It's all about them and I treat it that way. So if you came to me and said you had $100k to invest I'd ask you what it was for, what your time frame was, what your risk tolerance was and then I'd run you some potential numbers. Long term (beyond 10 years) we still look at 8% but we make sure that all our clients realize that that is a hypothetical rate of return. But if I put them in a mutual fund I will quote that funds actual 10 year ROR and run their projection with that, most of which are still in the 8-10% range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Great. Here I am working with people making sure they're doing the right thing and putting them in a better place financially. And because I don't answer your unanswerable question I'm a shill. If you have a problem with someone saying you should be investing your money don't come to me when in 20 years you don't have enough. A guesstimate would have helped as I said. Look, I am sorry. I know you have a job, I know you have your beliefs and frankly I agree with some of what you say. I have my own small nest eggs in several places invested in different things. I don't look at them too often because I don't know enough. The CFO of our company manages them and until this year managed about 12%. Mind you, I went conservative. My mom just lost 30k in "conservative" investments. She got bad financial advice actually. She wasn't a Sarah Palin Type. She will get by, but that was a huge blow to her since her financial adviser essentially parroted you. Maybe you told your older clients that they needed to move their funds face to face. You said nothing of the sort on this board as far as I recall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 You want me to put together every conceivable allocation to come up with an average annual rate of return over three and five years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 You want me to put together every conceivable allocation to come up with an average annual rate of return over three and five years. I simply find it hard to believe your company never crunched those numbers. I would accept a guesstimate if you are willing as I trust you mostly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Look at these actual and shocking numbers the past 10 years. This the TSP retirement fund... G fund is the no risk gov't fund. 10-Year Summary of TSP Individual Funds Annual Returns. Historical The previous 10? 1989 was a great year... Followed by 1990... The 1991= 1995= almost 40%! Same with 1997. The mid 1990's dems was the years baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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