RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 Of course not. Having to soak up huge salaries has no influence on signing or extending other players. Geez Louise.... if the Bills did not sign Evans many members of the StupidNation would start posting about how "the Bills never re-sign anyone, and that means say bye-bye to Stroud, Greer, [fill in blank here]." Are you people ever happy? Ever?
StupidNation Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 Geez Louise.... if the Bills did not sign Evans many members of the StupidNation would start posting about how "the Bills never re-sign anyone, and that means say bye-bye to Stroud, Greer, [fill in blank here]." Are you people ever happy? Ever? No clown, I was extremely happy we didn't pay Clements or Winfield. I don't fall into the resign him now club. Evans is great, but not at his salary. If he was an elite game-changing #1 pay him. He's not yet, but may be with better QBing, but even Steve Smith was extremely good without Delhomme and Evans hasn't proved he is a true #1 that gets first downs and gets open in all positions. He's a deep threat, which is great, but not for top 3 money in the NFL. When he averages 90-95+ receptions, 6 TDs+, and 1200 yards that's what will make him worth that kind of money. The stat line 6 receptions for 80 yards isn't sexy but it's what keeps the O on the field and spreads out the D. He's not worth that contract and stand by taking a guy like Roy Williams in the off-season than Lee Evans unless Evans proves he can consistently get first downs and go over the middle. I'm not saying he's not good, but I don't see that kind of money for a deep threat. Here are some things I believe true #1 should do that is worth that money: -Catch over the middle and keep Ds honest -Allow jump balls a chance of being caught with body positioning -Break a screen for a long run once in a while Lee so far as is a one trick pony who does catch curls but never breaks one after the catch, and his only trick is being fast enough with good routes. Sorry, I'm not impressed enough to give him top 3 money.
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 You do realize that this is the last year of Evans' contract, yes? And that he would be an UFA at the end of this season, which would drive up his price? The economic realities of the situation do require teams that want to lock up good players to take some risk. You seem to suggest that letting Evans walk if he does not hit your arbitrary measures would be a good thing, but that does beg the question of how he would be replaced.... I also find it amazing that someone who uses "stupid" in his own alias would call other people "clowns," but hey, whatever floats you.... No clown, I was extremely happy we didn't pay Clements or Winfield. I don't fall into the resign him now club. Evans is great, but not at his salary. If he was an elite game-changing #1 pay him. He's not yet, but may be with better QBing, but even Steve Smith was extremely good without Delhomme and Evans hasn't proved he is a true #1 that gets first downs and gets open in all positions. He's a deep threat, which is great, but not for top 3 money in the NFL. When he averages 90-95+ receptions, 6 TDs+, and 1200 yards that's what will make him worth that kind of money. The stat line 6 receptions for 80 yards isn't sexy but it's what keeps the O on the field and spreads out the D. He's not worth that contract and stand by taking a guy like Roy Williams in the off-season than Lee Evans unless Evans proves he can consistently get first downs and go over the middle. I'm not saying he's not good, but I don't see that kind of money for a deep threat. Here are some things I believe true #1 should do that is worth that money: -Catch over the middle and keep Ds honest -Allow jump balls a chance of being caught with body positioning -Break a screen for a long run once in a while Lee so far as is a one trick pony who does catch curls but never breaks one after the catch, and his only trick is being fast enough with good routes. Sorry, I'm not impressed enough to give him top 3 money.
Steely Dan Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 No clown, I was extremely happy we didn't pay Clements or Winfield. I don't fall into the resign him now club. Evans is great, but not at his salary. If he was an elite game-changing #1 pay him. He's not yet, but may be with better QBing, but even Steve Smith was extremely good without Delhomme and Evans hasn't proved he is a true #1 that gets first downs and gets open in all positions. He's a deep threat, which is great, but not for top 3 money in the NFL. When he averages 90-95+ receptions, 6 TDs+, and 1200 yards that's what will make him worth that kind of money. The stat line 6 receptions for 80 yards isn't sexy but it's what keeps the O on the field and spreads out the D. He's not worth that contract and stand by taking a guy like Roy Williams in the off-season than Lee Evans unless Evans proves he can consistently get first downs and go over the middle. I'm not saying he's not good, but I don't see that kind of money for a deep threat. Here are some things I believe true #1 should do that is worth that money: -Catch over the middle and keep Ds honest -Allow jump balls a chance of being caught with body positioning -Break a screen for a long run once in a while Lee so far as is a one trick pony who does catch curls but never breaks one after the catch, and his only trick is being fast enough with good routes. Sorry, I'm not impressed enough to give him top 3 money. I guess we've been watching different games.
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 I guess we've been watching different games. I am not sure he has been watching any games at all...
John from Riverside Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 No clown, I was extremely happy we didn't pay Clements or Winfield. I don't fall into the resign him now club. Evans is great, but not at his salary. If he was an elite game-changing #1 pay him. He's not yet, but may be with better QBing, but even Steve Smith was extremely good without Delhomme and Evans hasn't proved he is a true #1 that gets first downs and gets open in all positions. He's a deep threat, which is great, but not for top 3 money in the NFL. When he averages 90-95+ receptions, 6 TDs+, and 1200 yards that's what will make him worth that kind of money. The stat line 6 receptions for 80 yards isn't sexy but it's what keeps the O on the field and spreads out the D. He's not worth that contract and stand by taking a guy like Roy Williams in the off-season than Lee Evans unless Evans proves he can consistently get first downs and go over the middle. I'm not saying he's not good, but I don't see that kind of money for a deep threat. Here are some things I believe true #1 should do that is worth that money: -Catch over the middle and keep Ds honest -Allow jump balls a chance of being caught with body positioning -Break a screen for a long run once in a while Lee so far as is a one trick pony who does catch curls but never breaks one after the catch, and his only trick is being fast enough with good routes. Sorry, I'm not impressed enough to give him top 3 money. Well then I guess it isn't your money being spent....right?
MRW Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 When he averages 90-95+ receptions, 6 TDs+, and 1200 yards that's what will make him worth that kind of money. The stat line 6 receptions for 80 yards isn't sexy but it's what keeps the O on the field and spreads out the D. He's not worth that contract and stand by taking a guy like Roy Williams in the off-season than Lee Evans unless Evans proves he can consistently get first downs and go over the middle. I'm not saying he's not good, but I don't see that kind of money for a deep threat. That's a great idea. I'm sure the Bills would not face any competition for Roy Williams in the offseason, so it would make a great deal of sense to put all our eggs in that basket. So in your scenario, what happens next year after Roy Williams is signed somewhere else for $11mil/year and Evans has departed for greener pastures?
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 That's a great idea. I'm sure the Bills would not face any competition for Roy Williams in the offseason, so it would make a great deal of sense to put all our eggs in that basket. So in your scenario, what happens next year after Roy Williams is signed somewhere else for $11mil/year and Evans has departed for greener pastures? Well, silly.. in that case he comes on and complains about how dumb the Bills Front Office is for not having a better plan.
Saint Doug Posted October 4, 2008 Posted October 4, 2008 I really don't care what his stats are, if he keeps making game-changing catches, like the ones he had versus the Raiders and Rams in the 4th quarter, he is well worth the money. But, then again, Reed has also been having a bunch of game-changing catches.
Steely Dan Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 Well, silly.. in that case he comes on and complains about how dumb the Bills Front Office is for not having a better plan. The treadmill to nowhere keeps running!!
The Dean Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 Of course not. Having to soak up huge salaries has no influence on signing or extending other players. The decision on Greer's contract will have virtually nothing to do with whether or not they signed Evans, or for how much. That much you should simply accept. The decision on Greer will be based on how much he is likely to get in FA, how Leodis and Youboty fare the rest of the year, the availability of good defensive backs in the later rounds of the draft, etc. The Bills are unlikely to spend $X on a FA CB, and that has nothing to do with how much they are willing to pay a top notch WR. The Bills remain in excellent cap shape, and manage their cap well. They have shown, with Whitner and Clements, that, despite having a HUGE amount of available cap, that they will not overpay for a CB in FA. That isn't likely to change, and it will be unrelated to Evans' contract.
Steely Dan Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 The decision on Greer's contract will have virtually nothing to do with whether or not they signed Evans, or for how much. That much you should simply accept. The decision on Greer will be based on how much he is likely to get in FA, how Leodis and Youboty fare the rest of the year, the availability of good defensive backs in the later rounds of the draft, etc. The Bills are unlikely to spend $X on a FA CB, and that has nothing to do with how much they are willing to pay a top notch WR. The Bills remain in excellent cap shape, and manage their cap well. They have shown, with Whitner and Clements, that, despite having a HUGE amount of available cap, that they will not overpay for a CB in FA. That isn't likely to change, and it will be unrelated to Evans' contract. Well stated. It is possible he'll stay with the team by accepting a lesser contract but with McKelvin likely to start next year he'll probably want to go somewhere that will give him a starting role.
Whites Bay Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 Well stated. It is possible he'll stay with the team by accepting a lesser contract but with McKelvin likely to start next year he'll probably want to go somewhere that will give him a starting role. And who could blame him, really? The kid walks on as an UFA, and plays himself into a respectable starter. Which is to say, of course, that he's better than probably about 2/3s of the CBs on the field in the NFL at this point. He'll command a big payday, and at 5 years in the league, he's got to think about taking it. Because he's only going to have 2-4 years left.
BillsVet Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 This is what the salary cap era is all about and that whole parity thing. I honestly don't know our salary cap situation but I don't think that is to bad from what I remember. You can't be scared to pay top players good money. If you don't pay your top players and let them walk, then you do become a "farm team." This is part of changing the culture back to a winning culture. What happens with Edwards if Evans walks? Perhaps he gets frustrated, they can't get another wideout of his caliber in here, his performance suffers, and that frustration leads him to walk at the end of his contract anyway. If you can find another wideout of his caliber than it's all a moot point. I like the signing, I think it goes back to changing the culture and direction of the franchise. Bingo. Having lived in WNY most of my life, it always seems like people who've always lived in WNY can't understand that life is cheap here as compared with most places in the US. I see it all over the place, especially when an athlete in Buffalo gets a big contract. Vanek, Dockery, Schobel, and now Evans all are getting paid big dollars to play a game. Except it's not a game anymore, it's a business resembling a game. (I think someone once said that on this board) A lot of WNY's complain about players, especially when that highly paid athlete is anything less than stellar. I would hope fans don't come here and complain if Evans isn't dominating every game, but it'll happen. Besides, it's a WNY thing anyway. Evans' contract was based on other WR deals across the league, and whether people like it or not, the money in the NFL is still far below that of MLB and especially the NBA. Had Evans walked out the door, the writing on the wall about being a farm team would have been in black paint on a huge white canvas in front of RWS. And then the big b**ching would have started. As much as I've ripped the front office for their ways in the past, they knew it was absolutely necessary to re-sign Evans without paying through the nose. I think they did fine on this one. The Bills personnel folks will have several tough decisions in the next 2-3 years as they hopefully become a better team. Having Evans for four more seasons gives them some stability at WR, which is still the position that busts more than just about any other in the NFL. 9M per ain't bad.
murra Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 Getting your franchise WR out of the way is imperative to this team. Having done that, you can debate and bicker between apples and oranges, but even if you want to classify Evans as a strictly, "deep threat", that's fine with me. He has proven enough to me. Our game plan doesn't revolve around him, and that might seem unfortunate to all of you naysayers (and by all I think I'm speaking to only StupidNation), but let's be real here, most of these unbelievable stats you dream of come in situations I am glad to not have to bare: With Roy Williams. Yeah, he's all over the place, makes great plays. There is a reason for his stats. His team is often down, they're a pass-happy Martzonian who happens to have a WR tandem straight out of an ALL-MADDEN 96 team. With Randy Moss, you have a special case where the plays being called were a direct result of the talent level of the quarterback and the mentality of the coaching staff (ie, run up the score at all costs). Without Brady, Moss will collapse. With Steve Smith and the Panthers, you have a team that probably uses their undersized, gritty WR to perfection. So if there is a bar that I want Evans to reach, that's probably it. But again, we have such a relaxed, balanced offensive style that we're TRYING to maintain, that it seems comical to imagine Evans ever really having 10+ catches in a game. I just re-read my post and don't know why I rambled for so long, especially since it made little sense...I apologize and next time I'll simply post: "Evans is worth the money"
Wilson from Gamehendge Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 Tell me that when Stroud, Edwards, Greer, and Peters wants to get paid and we don't have the money. Well first off, I would say that Jabari Greer can go. We have Youboty, who has stepped his game up to a whole new level. We have McKelvin, who is supposed to be the next big thing, and I TRUST our Front Office. Reggie Corner was highly praised coming out of college, as he also showed nice progress in his skills this Pre-Season. I believe that McGee is locked up for a little while too. That right there is FOUR good quality Cornerbacks, who could become great. We could possibly give Greer the Franchise Tag and then trade him, but it is very unlikely (would anyone else pay him that much?). Next, I firmly believe that Stroud likes playing here. He is in position to succeed and to WIN. He is getting up there in age, and would probably sign his next contract for a little discount. He has A LOT to prove, and he can do that here. Edwards will NEVER be let go of. He loves playing here, he is winning (not only games, but the respect and trust of his teammates/friends/brothers), and he will stay with the team that gave him a chance. He is in a nice place. Peters...I really don't know what to say about this one. I honestly loved the guy coming out of Arkansas. When I saw a Tight End, who was 6-4 300lbs, I had a "Man Crush." I kept telling my buddy, who is a huge Bills fan, "We gotta get him, he will be a great asset to some team. He is versatile and athletic." A few days after the draft, he called to tell me that we signed Jason Peters as an UDFA. I saw him blocked the punt for a TD in Cincinnati, then catch a TD pass from Losman (both of their 1st TDs). I was going to even buy an Offensive Lineman's jersey. However, this offseason really left a sour taste in my mouth, and I no longer really think he is worth it. Bottom line is that I don't like his attitude. Now, I could sit here and say that his agent was pulling the strings, but he seemed to make NO effort, at all. From what I have seen of Langston Walker playing LT and Kirk Chambers stepping in at RT, I think if we wanted to improve our line with Peters' money, we could find a C and RG (although I DO like Brad Butler). Unless he turns things around and starts performing like a Pro-Bowl LT, I say trade him. One last thing...WE DO HAVE MONEY! We will also have MORE after the season, including incoming revenue from the series in Toronto. We can pay these guys. We see that the Bills are willing to pay players, in order to improve.
StupidNation Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 Well, silly.. in that case he comes on and complains about how dumb the Bills Front Office is for not having a better plan. At least you admit you are a homer. I'm a realist. I never said the Bills don't have a plan either if they don't sign Evans. What I said is that I don't like the signing for that kind of money. Evans is on course for 56 receptions. Sure he might have over 1,000 yards, but that isn't how this offense is made to run.
Wilson from Gamehendge Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 Evans is on course for 56 receptions. Sure he might have over 1,000 yards, but that isn't how this offense is made to run. I'll take 50 receptions for 1,000 yards...if it keeps us winning, no need to fix it. Just keep it around a while longer. Edwards and Evans are still building a soild connection in live game conditions, since they didn't have much time together in the Pre-Season. The Offensive Line has not been playing very well, especially in the passing game. Our Rookie receiving Tight End has not played at all yet. Our Running Backs have not been picking up the blitz pressure very well, and Lynch has not been getting many passes. Roscoe has also been missing from the Offensive game plan, and James Hardy has not impressed since Week 1. Our Offensive is just not clicking on all cylinders yet. They are all still trying to put EVERYTHING together, so when they can execute the whole gameplan together, they will be close to dominant. Just give it time people, wait and see what happens until you jump down the throats of the Front Office. Evans is paid, he is here for a while, there is nothing anyone can do now. It was a good move. It WILL pay dividends, now and in the end.
Wilson from Gamehendge Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 This story completely sums up how I feel about this...and how we all should look at this move. http://www.wgrz.com/sports/story.aspx?storyid=61192
Steely Dan Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 At least you admit you are a homer. I'm a realist. I never said the Bills don't have a plan either if they don't sign Evans. What I said is that I don't like the signing for that kind of money. Evans is on course for 56 receptions. Sure he might have over 1,000 yards, but that isn't how this offense is made to run. Yeah, this offense doesn't benefit at all from those long strikes TE's throws to him down the sidelines. How does field position help a team?
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