Will Greer be too expensive to keep?

[Pyrite Gal]

Greer is gonzo at the end of his current contract. Someone's going to throw huuuge money @ him.

And based on how the Bills and the NFL have operated in the past this is exactly what should happen. Some folks on TSW will insist that Nate Clements was woth resigning for large dollars and even those of us who maintain that he was good and often very good would agree that though he was not worth top CB money he was very good.

 

However, the Bills were more than willing to let Nate walk for a larger contract (few saw how silly it would be with him getting the largest contract at the time ever given to a defensive player) simply because the way we use the CB in our version of the Cover 2 the CB plays an important role (as all starters do) but simply not a role that merits paying huge bucks to a player. The cover 2 the way we play it simply does not take maximum advantage of the playmaking abilities of the best CBs in this league as it is a use which emphasizes tackling ability and press coverage in the short zone. It is success at the glitzier duty of covering a WR deep and making INTs which sets the price for the best CBs.

 

Likewise other teams which employ a Cover 2 as their base D such as Indy were unwilling to pay their two relatively average CBs who hit FA at the right moment after Indy won the SB walk for the big bucks they could get rather than pay them. Players also feel the same way about the Cover 2 as players such as Dre Bly was public in his disdain for a Jauron designed Cover 2 which the Lions ran and he got out of Detroit as fast as he could (who could blame him for running from this Millen led monstrosity).

 

At any rate, both the the teams and the players agree that a CB who can get a big contract should leave a Cover 2 based team like the Bills and I agree that Greer is gonzo. The good news for us is that with the drafting of McKelvin (whose ST abilities made him worth a high draft pick), the development of Youbouty and McGee being signed long-term (again an ST add-on that made the extension contract make sense) we appear to be deep enough to let greer walk and we will look for a Will James level replacement when we need a dime to back-up McKelvin, Mcgee and Youbouty.

[Bleed Bills Blue]

Thanks, UConn, Rammy, bizell, nucci...I guess that's hard to argue with. If you don't deal with reality it will just bite you on the butt.

 

Is Greer a guy we might franchise next year?

[Bleed Bills Blue]

Good post, PG.

[Pyrite Gal]

Thanks, UConn, Rammy, bizell, nucci...I guess that's hard to argue with. If you don't deal with reality it will just bite you on the butt.

 

Is Greer a guy we might franchise next year?

For the reasons cited above, just as Clements is a good and often a very good player he simply is not used to his highest and best value as a CB in a Cover 2 based D. He is a playmaker and in a cover 2 use of the skills that Greer showed in the TD Sunday do happen sometimes but it is the exception rather thn the rule.

 

We do not generally use a CB like Greer, McGee or whomever in a manner that would justify devoting a franchise level cap hit to the player.

[bizell]

Thanks, UConn, Rammy, bizell, nucci...I guess that's hard to argue with. If you don't deal with reality it will just bite you on the butt.

 

Is Greer a guy we might franchise next year?

 

well, the franchise tag salary for a CB this year is $9,465,000.

 

Do you think that our FO thinks Greer is worth that much (probably more by next year)?

[Boatdrinks]

If he keeps playing like this he'll be one of the top FA CB's.

 

I think they will be able to retain Greer. Though he is well known, (Belichick has complemented him for several years) he doesn't have the measurables ( somewhat undersized) or draft status, which tends to follow you through your career. He will get a nice contract, but not the beaucoup $$$ you see given to high draft picks with good size that get lots of INT's.

[Captain Caveman]

well, the franchise tag salary for a CB this year is $9,465,000.

 

Do you think that our FO thinks Greer is worth that much (probably more by next year)?

 

Will anybody? Maybe we can franchise him, then trade him?

[Guest dog14787]

Find a way to keep Greer. Dont sit here and say well we have McKelvin & Corner waiting in the wings......

 

If the dude can play which Greer can, try your best to keep the guy. I get sick of seeing my team let good players walk. Seriously, Id love to see the front office do what they can to keep Greer.

 

He's also one of my favorite players.

 

I agree, but the better he plays, the less likely we will be able to keep him.

[JStranger76]

Greer won't be franchised and traded. I'd bet anything on this planet on that. He'll be overpaid on another team next year.

[nucci]

I would love to keep him, but it's the nature of the game. You can't sign everyone and players will leave. That's why the draft is so important and it's great that we are drafting well again.

[SuperKillerRobots]

That would require a colossally stupid Greer and agent.

 

He will make far more money in UFA, where dollars flow like cheap beer at a Polish wedding, than what the Bills would offer him (what with our new surfeit of CBs). The only thing Greer would get by re-signing mid-year would be a relatively small cushion in the chance that he gets seriously hurt. In an era where Dre Bly (whose fundamental corner skills were iffy, but managed to have a monster INT year) several years ago got double-digit millions, you don't even consider it a gamble --- you test the market.

 

Greer played solid last year, and if he keeps up this level of play, well, good for him. It's win-win, at least this year. The Bills will get great production from a hungry player that could be a difference-maker come playoff-time, and he'll get a fat contract from someone next year. This won't be the Bills unless something drastic happens injury-wise, and probably not even then. We'll all wish him luck except when he's playing against us.

 

The FO drafted this year similarly to previous years; draft a year ahead to replace guys who you figure will be gone.

 

You say that now, wait until he signs with the Patriots* in the offseason.

[SuperKillerRobots]

Will anybody? Maybe we can franchise him, then trade him?

 

The only way it would be a thought would be if Evans is signed to a new deal. Even then it's tough cause I don't know if he is worth $9 million per, even with a monster year and you don;'t want to get stuck with him at that salary.

[Tcali]

Hmmmm...or we could resign him before the end of the year

way too sensible an approach.....dont mess with our formula of success for the past 10 years

[stuckincincy]

That would require a colossally stupid Greer and agent.

 

He will make far more money in UFA, where dollars flow like cheap beer at a Polish wedding, than what the Bills would offer him (what with our new surfeit of CBs). The only thing Greer would get by re-signing mid-year would be a relatively small cushion in the chance that he gets seriously hurt. In an era where Dre Bly (whose fundamental corner skills were iffy, but managed to have a monster INT year) several years ago got double-digit millions, you don't even consider it a gamble --- you test the market.

 

Greer played solid last year, and if he keeps up this level of play, well, good for him. It's win-win, at least this year. The Bills will get great production from a hungry player that could be a difference-maker come playoff-time, and he'll get a fat contract from someone next year. This won't be the Bills unless something drastic happens injury-wise, and probably not even then. We'll all wish him luck except when he's playing against us.

 

The FO drafted this year similarly to previous years; draft a year ahead to replace guys who you figure will be gone.

 

Right. They have big bucks forked over and promised to McKelvin. Unless McGee is totally shot, they won't pay big $$$ for Greer.

[jarthur31]

We can always draft his replacement on day one

 

I agree with the last two posters. Unless he takes a "hometown discount", he won't be a Bill next year. I'm just glad Ash has turned it on--it would be cheaper to extend him and draft another Buckeye CB next year.

[Bill from NYC]

Right. They have big bucks forked over and promised to McKelvin. Unless McGee is totally shot, they won't pay big $$$ for Greer.

 

No they won't which is fine in itself, because there are a ton of other places to spend that money.

 

If Peters comes back to form, he will get a raise. They will not want a repeat of this insanity. As each week passes, the chances of keeping Evans are shrinking. We saw this before with Clements and others. I wish they would offer Chambers 10 million or so for 4 years. This might seem high, but it will look a lot cheaper in a few short years.

 

Now...Trent? If he keeps playing the way he is now, we might have a situation on our hands.

Read 'em and weep. This is Marc Bulger's contract. It might be because I am a homer; I really can't say, but I prefer Edwards to Bulger, and he is just a kid. Trent just might want a new deal.

 

Finally, don't forget Whitner. The guys is playing well, and is a publicity machine.

 

Hopefully, these guys will want to opt for security and sign early. I also hope that Ralph will be willing to fork over the cash it will take to keep good players. Thats right....good players on the Bills. It feels good just to type that phrase.

[colin]

i think we can lose one or two corners and be good, just like it looks like we have have a fall off in peters' play and still be good.

 

whitner is more of a leader, but has a couple years left and as a safety will be cheaper than a corner. lynch and edwards are our real stars, but are in the 2nd year of 5 year contracts, i think evans gets done this year.

 

so while i'd rather keep greer, if we get a solid interior o lineman, te, or pass rusher in place of him i think we make our team better.

 

although bill is against it (maybe he will come around one day) having depth at corner is important because you might need to put 4 of them on the pitch at once. two all world guys are great, but if your 3rd and 4th guys are crap then you are up a creek (look at denver).

[UConn James]

No they won't which is fine in itself, because there are a ton of other places to spend that money.

 

If Peters comes back to form, he will get a raise. They will not want a repeat of this insanity. As each week passes, the chances of keeping Evans are shrinking. We saw this before with Clements and others. I wish they would offer Chambers 10 million or so for 4 years. This might seem high, but it will look a lot cheaper in a few short years.

 

Now...Trent? If he keeps playing the way he is now, we might have a situation on our hands.

Read 'em and weep. This is Marc Bulger's contract. It might be because I am a homer; I really can't say, but I prefer Edwards to Bulger, and he is just a kid. Trent just might want a new deal.

 

Finally, don't forget Whitner. The guys is playing well, and is a publicity machine.

 

Hopefully, these guys will want to opt for security and sign early. I also hope that Ralph will be willing to fork over the cash it will take to keep good players. Thats right....good players on the Bills. It feels good just to type that phrase.

 

Yep. That's the cost of getting your hands on some good players. You might get a couple of years from them on the cheap and then it's time to pay the piper once they've performed... or they go elsewhere.

 

Sadly, that's right about Evans. I don't know if the Bills would use the franchise tag on him. But the fact that he says they're close gives me some hope he'll be here for a while.

 

You've seen this before wrt the Edwards situation. Dude is playing his butt off for us at, what $400K/yr, and should be rewarded with a big contract. That's just how it goes for QBs, and if he's a good QB you don't flinch. Ralph seems to get this, and after the RJ debacle's lesson was learned, Edwards has sufficiently shown, to my eyes at least, that he's a keeper. This is a nice situation b/c the Bills have some leverage and therefore TE would want to get a new deal as security, but then again, you don't want to lowball your starting QB. The longer it goes w/o giving him a big contract, the more it'll take to sign him.

 

Not so sure about Peters. At this point, what he did to himself, and thereby did to the team still doesn't sit right to me. And the fact that he's still not playing overwhelmingly well --- is he tanking it, even unconsciously? --- doesn't bode in his favor. He might get a token raise, but this season needs to play out with him playing better. Else, shifting Walker to LT and signing Chambers looks better and better to me.

 

If Ralph wants to keep this nucleus together in the next few years, cash to cap is probably going to have to be scrapped.

[Bill from NYC]

Else, shifting Walker to LT and signing Chambers looks better and better to me.

 

I know he filled in, but you don't see many LTs in the league built like Walker. I for one don't believe his listed weight any more than I believed that of Pat Williams. One year, we sat in the front row directly behind Williams, and I would believe 400 pounds, but I digress.

 

Walker is far more suited to RT imo, and Chambers to LT because he is a better pass blocker than run blocker. Peters can do it all, so what we really need is for him to get it together.

 

Btw, I agree that the cash to cap policy will almost certainly have to go if we are to keep our best players.

[bowery4]

Well, I for one could see the team putting a tag on Greer. Have to think it is expensive but his position takes a few years to learn and develop into. It is a big price tag but only for one year, one more year for the rookie would be great. I think we will know more as this Mcgee injury plays out though, too. How will Youboty and Mc Klevin do? It would of course be great if he was willing to stay with us and reup now but is that likely??? I doubt it but maybe. We would be short at depth at his position if someone else was injured IMO. Next year I can see it but not yet.

I would love to see him stay on the team, one of my favorite players. Hope they can and do get Evans and Jason done during the season becuase I can't deal with reading the board all off season with the business issues hanging.