Bailout vote

[molson_golden2002]

Interesting stat. While 2/3 of Republicans voted against it, of those Republicans that are retiring, they voted for it 18-4

 

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_stump/a...ted-for-it.aspx

[elegantelliotoffen]

While the Dow plummets Obama's Intrade stock has skyrocketed today and the gamblers are giving him the edge in Ohio, Florida, Virginia, Colorado, and Nevada.

[SDS]

 

I think he was referring to you....

 

 

 

 

 

 

[molson_golden2002]

Most people don't understand a bloody thing that goes on around them. "We should bail out the homeowner before banks!!!" Who the !@#$ do you think is going to refinance your home for you, dipshits?

 

 

 

I work on a Ginnie Mae project. Me and fifty other people. Including me, SIX of us understand what "credit markets" mean. I just had to explain it to four people, "No, we're not actually paying CEO's salaries with this bailout."

What about the lost tax revenue from the stock market? This can spirial out of control so quick. I have the TV on and the blame game is going on, the media is positively giddy over a cool story and I think I smell smoke as the nation burns.

[/dev/null]

What about the lost tax revenue from the stock market? This can spirial out of control so quick. I have the TV on and the blame game is going on, the media is positively giddy over a cool story and I think I smell smoke as the nation burns.

 

Of course they smell smoke. They're fanning the flames

[SDS]

If you care to listen to a smart person talk about this - Ric Edelman will be discussing this in just over an hour at 8:00 pm et. Here is the email I received:

 

 

===============

SPECIAL ALERT:

Ric Edelman to host one-hour special tonight on 630 WMAL-AM at 8:00 PM

Congress Rejects Bailout Bill – What Does it Mean for You?

===============

 

Tune in tonight to a special edition of The Ric Edelman Show on 630 WMAL-AM-Radio, Washington, D.C. as Ric explains what today's defeat of the financial markets' rescue bill and the plunging stock market mean to you.

 

Ric will discuss the impact of today's vote on retirement funds, mortgage financing, personal and business loan availability, and bank stability. He’ll also be taking your calls.

 

In the Washington D.C. area, tune to NewsTalk 630 WMAL-AM. Outside of Washington, listen to the streaming audio by going to: http://www.wmal.com/ or download the podcast later this week at http://www.ricedelman.com.

 

Call in with your questions to 888-630-WMAL (888-630-9625).

 

Ric will also share important "lessons" consumers should keep in mind during turbulent times, including:

 

1. When investing, assume the worst. Could you live with it?

 

a. Don't buy investments you don't understand.

b. Don't buy company stock in your retirement plan.

c. Don’t accept company stock as compensation instead of cash.

d. Don't buy a house you cannot afford.

 

2. Maintain diversification

 

a. Do not buy individual securities.

b. Never make big bets with your money. Putting it all in your home or all in the bank is as big a bet as putting it all in one stock.

c. Build a portfolio based on your situation.

 

3. Have ample cash reserves

 

a. Be sure the cash is safe. Use only Treasuries or funds of Treasuries, and stay under the FDIC limit.

b. Never chase yield.

 

4. Be skeptical about what you read, see or hear. The media isn't smarter than you.

 

5. Don’t panic. Have faith in our nation, in our financial system and in history. Maintain a long-term focus, and remember that wealth is created during periods of uncertainty.

 

If you follow the above, you have no need to panic.

[/dev/null]

I've been trying to connect to various Congressional Reps' web sites to see what I can learn but they all time out. Guess I am not the only one interested!

 

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080929/ap_on_...e_overwhelmed_1

 

[DC Tom]

What about the lost tax revenue from the stock market? This can spirial out of control so quick.

 

Obama's "tax the rich" plan is pretty much DOA. By the time he's in office, there won't be any.

 

I have the TV on and the blame game is going on, the media is positively giddy over a cool story and I think I smell smoke as the nation burns.

 

Repeat first sentence.

[Booster4324]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080929/ap_on_...e_overwhelmed_1

 

 

Ventura said the slowdown is expected to last until Tuesday, when demand is expected to decline with the House in recess. In the meantime, technicians planned to work through the night to fortify the system.

 

Yeah, them going home to lounge should reduce traffic.

[DC Tom]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080929/ap_on_...e_overwhelmed_1

 

 

 

I wonder...will they allow an "Eat sh-- and die, you !@#$ing self-centerd dumbass pieces of rat-filth mother!@#$ers!" email to go through? Or do they just filter it out and put me on a terrorist watch list?

[Booster4324]

I wonder...will they allow an "Eat sh-- and die, you !@#$ing self-centerd dumbass pieces of rat-filth mother!@#$ers!" email to go through? Or do they just filter it out and put me on a terrorist watch list?

 

Might as well go for it now. That post probably got you on the list.

[Johnny Coli]

More irony....

MarketWatch

 

The S&P 500 Index ($SPX:1,106.42, -106.85, -8.8%) dropped 106.59 points, or 8.8%, to 1,106.42, with energy, financials and materials fronting sector losses that spread across all 10 of the index's industry groups.

 

The sell off is the largest percentage drop for the S&P 500 since Oct. 26, 1987. It also translates into a $700 billion loss for the day for the S&P, according to Howard Silverblatt, senior index analyst at Standard & Poor's.

[bills_fan]

So now what...

 

Basically, it appears likely that an attempt will be made later this week to revive some variation of the "Paulson Plan." The real challenge in this zero-sum political game is to fashion something that can pass the House and yet still get through the Senate in fairly short order.

 

One alternative that may emerge is to re-package EESA, in more/less the same form in which it came to the House floor this morning, with several other proposals popular among House Democrats and then simply rely on Democratic votes to get it passed. I have read all of the proposed bills. The original was far overreaching by Paulson, as the media has reported. The second Democratic bill had a lot of bullsh*t add-ons, that made it unworkable. This was the good bill (the one that failed today). Potential add-ons include the mortgage bankruptcy "cramdown" proposal championed in the House by Brad Miller and a second round of "economic stimulus." Of course, then you can forget getting Republicans in the Senate.

 

A last option is to let the consequences of inaction - today's nearly 780 point drop in the Dow and the increasing fallout from the credit market freeze (missed payrolls, etc) - trickle down to "Main Street," and hope that the grassroots uprising that spawned the demise of EESA I will do a 180 in support of EESA II. This, together with the beating the House Republicans already seem to be getting in the media, would, according to this theory, turn a sufficient number of Republicans around to pass essentially the same bill that failed this morning. It's not at all clear, however, that we have enough time to implement the trickle-down approach before the October 15 payroll, which some companies will miss, due to the freeze in the credit markets. Many companies are currently drawing down their credit lines with banks (thereby exacerbating the bank run that beat down financials recently) for the September 30 payrolls. If this is not resolved by the 10/30 payroll....

 

It now appears likely that House Democrats, working together with the Bush Administration and however many Republicans they can peel off, will take another run at this later in the week, although it's too early to tell exactly what form the bill will take or what parliamentary procedure/strategy will be followed. Chances are, however, that the revised proposal will, at its core, look much like the one that went down today in the House. Obviously, market developments over the next few days or so will also be critical, including the international ramifications of today's vote, which haven't really begun to sink in yet.

 

Basically...global financial meltdown. Say hello to Dow 8000 on October 16, absent a rescue. Also, borderline anarchy in the streets. We have enough societal acrimony bubbling just beneath the surface without the match that a couple missed payrolls will ignite.

 

What really pisses me off is that the extreme left and extreme right are basically holding the center hostage here. The center (and Congressional/Administrative leadership) have not done a good job in this by any means, but they arrived with a very workable bill, that was basically checkmated by the ignorant. If the ignorant had any clue that they may just miss payroll on 10/15 and/or 10/30, if this was not passed, then we may have had a very different discussion. Paulson needs to explain the ramifications of this vote and he is afraid to do that.

[taterhill]

Most people are too stupid. They don't realize their 401K and Ira are actually stock. Hell I am in the IT industry with a bunch of folks you'd think are semi-smart. I would guess at least 1/3 don't think the 401k they put money into actually has stocks behind it. They think they are in "mutual funds", not real stock. In fact, I've had this discussion regarding Oil company profits and most think that if the oil companies didn't make money their stock wouldn't be affected.

 

People are stupid and have not a single clue about reality and life. Most could be shot and dumped in the ocean and wouldn't be missed.

this is the first time I have ever agreed with you...this is really a crazy day

[DC Tom]

So now what...

 

Basically, it appears likely that an attempt will be made later this week to revive some variation of the "Paulson Plan." The real challenge in this zero-sum political game is to fashion something that can pass the House and yet still get through the Senate in fairly short order.

 

One alternative that may emerge is to re-package EESA, in more/less the same form in which it came to the House floor this morning, with several other proposals popular among House Democrats and then simply rely on Democratic votes to get it passed. I have read all of the proposed bills. The original was far overreaching by Paulson, as the media has reported. The second Democratic bill had a lot of bullsh*t add-ons, that made it unworkable. This was the good bill (the one that failed today). Potential add-ons include the mortgage bankruptcy "cramdown" proposal championed in the House by Brad Miller and a second round of "economic stimulus." Of course, then you can forget getting Republicans in the Senate.

 

A last option is to let the consequences of inaction - today's nearly 780 point drop in the Dow and the increasing fallout from the credit market freeze (missed payrolls, etc) - trickle down to "Main Street," and hope that the grassroots uprising that spawned the demise of EESA I will do a 180 in support of EESA II. This, together with the beating the House Republicans already seem to be getting in the media, would, according to this theory, turn a sufficient number of Republicans around to pass essentially the same bill that failed this morning. It's not at all clear, however, that we have enough time to implement the trickle-down approach before the October 15 payroll, which some companies will miss, due to the freeze in the credit markets. Many companies are currently drawing down their credit lines with banks (thereby exacerbating the bank run that beat down financials recently) for the September 30 payrolls. If this is not resolved by the 10/30 payroll....

 

It now appears likely that House Democrats, working together with the Bush Administration and however many Republicans they can peel off, will take another run at this later in the week, although it's too early to tell exactly what form the bill will take or what parliamentary procedure/strategy will be followed. Chances are, however, that the revised proposal will, at its core, look much like the one that went down today in the House. Obviously, market developments over the next few days or so will also be critical, including the international ramifications of today's vote, which haven't really begun to sink in yet.

 

Basically...global financial meltdown. Say hello to Dow 8000 on October 16, absent a rescue. Also, borderline anarchy in the streets. We have enough societal acrimony bubbling just beneath the surface without the match that a couple missed payrolls will ignite.

 

What really pisses me off is that the extreme left and extreme right are basically holding the center hostage here. The center (and Congressional/Administrative leadership) have not done a good job in this by any means, but they arrived with a very workable bill, that was basically checkmated by the ignorant. If the ignorant had any clue that they may just miss payroll on 10/15 and/or 10/30, if this was not passed, then we may have had a very different discussion. Paulson needs to explain the ramifications of this vote and he is afraid to do that.

 

Sounds like election cancelling time...

 

I'm seriously considering putting your entire post in a "forward to everyone you know" email. You know, there's so much this affects that people don't realize. Health care (you think health coverage pays out cash from a big stack of twenties they have in a back room somewhere?) Gas prices (oil companies are buying oil and chemicals on a "pay as you go" basis from point-of-sale receipts? I don't think so). Food prices (I doubt farmers buy seed and fertilizer in March with cash, and grocery stores certainly don't have piles of cash laying around). But no one cares, because they're afraid some executive somewhere is going to get a $20M bonus.

 

 

The original was far overreaching by Paulson, as the media has reported. The second Democratic bill had a lot of bullsh*t add-ons, that made it unworkable. This was the good bill (the one that failed today).

 

 

:lol:/:blink: Great !@#$ing leadership.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

I'm seriously considering putting your entire post in a "forward to everyone you know" email. You know, there's so much this affects that people don't realize. Health care (you think health coverage pays out cash from a big stack of twenties they have in a back room somewhere?) Gas prices (oil companies are buying oil and chemicals on a "pay as you go" basis from point-of-sale receipts? I don't think so). Food prices (I doubt farmers buy seed and fertilizer in March with cash, and grocery stores certainly don't have piles of cash laying around). But no one cares, because they're afraid some executive somewhere is going to get a $20M bonus.

 

And yet, the bailout may not work. What then?

[DC Tom]

And yet, the bailout may not work. What then?

 

Uhhh...I don't know. We're !@#$ed?

 

Gee, you're right. Let's just not do anything.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Uhhh...I don't know. We're !@#$ed?

 

Gee, you're right. Let's just not do anything.

Better to not do anything and stick the taxpayer with a $700B bill, especially when there's no reforms to prevent the smae sh-- from happening again.

[Chef Jim]

Uhhh...I don't know. We're !@#$ed?

 

Gee, you're right. Let's just not do anything.

 

Kind of like the global warming nuts arguement. Ironic isn't it?

[Chef Jim]

Better to not do anything and stick the taxpayer with a $700B bill, especially when there's no reforms to prevent the smae sh-- from happening again.

 

The do nothing bill could be a lot more than $700b in the long run.