Bailout vote

[bills_fan]

Foreclosures are, and will continue to happen anyway. Thats was the root of the outrage against yet another bailout.

 

 

Yes, but when every single home purchased with at least an 80% mortgage in the United States since 2002 is underwater (worth less than the mortgage on it)...there is one word for that...

 

F*cked!

[DC Tom]

I hope this isn't as bad as it seems

 

It pretty much is. Lots of banks are now stuck with illiquid asset. They have no cash to lend. Companies that depend on credit are going to start to go under. Unemployment will go up. Bankruptcies and foreclosures will increase. Then it becomes a vicious circle.

 

The House just threw most Americans under a bus in the interests of "saving" them.

[molson_golden2002]

Interesting blog hit from Salon:

 

If your idea of fun is watching congressional politicians discuss what to do about "the most significant financial crisis of the post-WWII world" then CSPAN on Monday morning made for some absolutely riveting television.

 

The smell of fear and anger is in the air. Passing the "Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008" will be a historic act and the legislators know it. In 45 minutes, I heard four legislators, Republicans and Democrats, cite the Great Depression. Republicans attacked the "financial industrialists of Wall Street" while Democrats argued passionately in favor of a bill originally proposed by the Bush administration.

 

Conservative Republicans are not happy. "A vote for this bailout is a vote to ratify business as usual in Washington," said Rep. Ginny Brown-Waite, R-Fla., calling it "a gun to the head," and "extortion." Todd Akin, R-Mo., said, "If we pass this bill we'll be back here in another couple of months and the banks will still be failing."

 

But it's not just Republicans who are angry. Marcy Kaptur, D-Ohio, who made news last week with her YouTube bailout sensation, also opposed the bill, declaring that it "bails out behavior" with "no reform." She also refused to accept the theory that this is "the worst financial crisis in modern times," stating that the 1980s were much worse.

 

Populist anger, a sense of foreboding, a stock market sharply down, and a vote coming soon.

 

UPDATE: Strange times alert: The far left, Dennis Kucinich, and the far right, Michelle Bachmann, are in agreement. They hate the bailout bill.

[East Brady]

Yes, but when every single home purchased with at least an 80% mortgage in the United States since 2002 is underwater (worth less than the mortgage on it)...there is one word for that...

 

F*cked!

Thats not the case here in western pa. our prices didn't rise much except in a select few neighborhoods. But I understand where your coming from.

[GG]

It pretty much is. Lots of banks are now stuck with illiquid asset. They have no cash to lend. Companies that depend on credit are going to start to go under. Unemployment will go up. Bankruptcies and foreclosures will increase. Then it becomes a vicious circle.

 

The House just threw most Americans under a bus in the interests of "saving" them.

 

You forgot the seizure of the commercial paper market, which will force companies to draw down their lines with banks, further upending balance sheets. If companies meet payroll tomorrow, don't be so sure for Oct 15. Sucks for anyone who needs to buy or sell a house, even if you have 20% down.

 

But hey, Wall Street will have learned its lesson.

[taterhill]

looks like Pelosi and her "speech" doomed this

[UBinVA]

Yes, but when every single home purchased with at least an 80% mortgage in the United States since 2002 is underwater (worth less than the mortgage on it)...there is one word for that...

 

F*cked!

 

They're not F&cked. What difference does it make what the value of the house is? If they can still afford the mortgage payments nothing has changed except the difference between market value and what they owe. Only if they have to move or sell do they incur that loss.

 

This is the time to buy people. Rich people know this, that's how they become rich. Most people panic and bail out when prices are low and buy back in when prices go higher. The total opposite of what you're supposed to do.

 

I just put $20K in my SEP IRA today.

[DC Tom]

You forgot the seizure of the commercial paper market, which will force companies to draw down their lines with banks, further upending balance sheets. If companies meet payroll tomorrow, don't be so sure for Oct 15. Sucks for anyone who needs to buy or sell a house, even if you have 20% down.

 

But hey, Wall Street will have learned its lesson.

 

How long until Congress votes themselves another pay raise?

[Johnny Coli]

looks like Pelosi and her "speech" doomed this

So even though the GOP leadership in the House claimed that this Bill was necessary to stave off economic disaster, they chose to tank the bill because they don't like Pelosi? That's the line of reasoning they're going with to explain why they just screwed millions of Americans? Interesting take.

[Alaska Darin]

You know how the right warns about US turning into a 3rd world country? This will help it along.

Yeah, let's use some more fear mongering to screw the US taxpayer even further. This "bailout without reform" will be the icing on the cake of 100 years of terrible economic policy and will all but assure the downfall of this country.

[Alaska Darin]

So even though the GOP leadership in the House claimed that this Bill was necessary to stave off economic disaster, they chose to tank the bill because they don't like Pelosi? That's the line of reasoning they're going with to explain why they just screwed millions of Americans? Interesting take.

Keep eating up the company line.

[Johnny Coli]

Keep eating up the company line.

You should turn on the TV. That's exactly what Boener and Blunt just said.

[DC Tom]

So even though the GOP leadership in the House claimed that this Bill was necessary to stave off economic disaster, they chose to tank the bill because they don't like Pelosi? That's the line of reasoning they're going with to explain why they just screwed millions of Americans? Interesting take.

 

It's consistent with the rest of their blithering idiocy. Die Partei above all. You, of all people, should understand the mindset.

[East Brady]

So what happens in the coming weeks when life continues and the world doesn't end? The kleptocrat's have been held off for now.

[bills_fan]

They're not F&cked. What difference does it make what the value of the house is? If they can still afford the mortgage payments nothing has changed except the difference between market value and what they owe. Only if they have to move or sell do they incur that loss.

 

This is the time to buy people. Rich people know this, that's how they become rich. Most people panic and bail out when prices are low and buy back in when prices go higher. The total opposite of what you're supposed to do.

 

I just put $20K in my SEP IRA today.

 

 

Wrong. Welcome to the wonderful world of Deflation.

 

What happens when all asset values are deflated? Negative economic growth. High unemployment. What happens when wages head south, even for those who continue to be employed? Ooops, didn't think of that right?

 

And, oh, you may have forgotten that the baby boomer generation (the largest in US history) is now retiring...not gonna happen for them. Their 401(k)s just imploded.

 

Remember your history...1929...the margin clerk comes calling...hey, I may just get into the spirit of things and pick up a fedora. Its 1930 again and yes, we will enter a depression.

 

And what always follows deflation....print more money...yep, hyperinflation. Hoping the price of gold drops because I'm seriously considering dumping my own personal savings account into solid gold and picking up an assault rifle while I'm at it.

[GG]

Yeah, let's use some more fear mongering to screw the US taxpayer even further. This "bailout without reform" will be the icing on the cake of 100 years of terrible economic policy and will all but assure the downfall of this country.

 

Frankly, the biggest fear mongering was done by people throwing up the $700 billion headline number, as if it's the end of the world. The true cost to the taxpayers will be far smaller, if not a gain if done right.

 

I have no idea what 100 years of terrible economic policy is, when during that time US went to dominate the world economy and is only having its second financial panic in a century, vs six financial panics in the century that preceded it. Perhaps the Austrian school can give an answer to that if its desciples can tell the difference between Freidrich & Salma.

[molson_golden2002]

Wrong. Welcome to the wonderful world of Deflation.

 

What happens when all asset values are deflated? Negative economic growth. High unemployment. What happens when wages head south, even for those who continue to be employed? Ooops, didn't think of that right?

 

And, oh, you may have forgotten that the baby boomer generation (the largest in US history) is now retiring...not gonna happen for them. Their 401(k)s just imploded.

 

Remember your history...1929...the margin clerk comes calling...hey, I may just get into the spirit of things and pick up a fedora. Its 1930 again and yes, we will enter a depression.

 

And what always follows deflation....print more money...yep, hyperinflation. Hoping the price of gold drops because I'm seriously considering dumping my own personal savings account into solid gold and picking up an assault rifle while I'm at it.

[Kelly the Dog]

The House Republicans and Boehner and McCain and Blunt et al were all saying this must be done for America and Americans. How then, could whatever Pelosi say (which I totally agree was stupid) change their vote? What it means is that THEY are far more partisan than she is and willing to screw the country by being petty. They thought that it was necessary for America and something that had to be done for its citizens, but they voted NO because they heard someone criticize and blame them (regardless of how stupid it was)? That is partisanship at its worst. The fact is, the Dems/Pelosi got the votes they said they were going to get and the Republicans/Boehner didn't. If the 12 or so House Reps changed because of just her speech when they were going to vote for it for the citizens, they screwed the citizens.

[bills_fan]

A real f*cking profile in courage here...

 

"We're all worried about losing our jobs," Rep. Paul Ryan, R-Wis., declared in an impassioned speech in support of the bill before the vote. "Most of us say, 'I want this thing to pass, but I want you to vote for it—not me.' "

 

Throw the whole f*cking lot of them out...Dems and Reps.

[Johnny Coli]

The House Republicans and Boehner and McCain and Blunt et al were all saying this must be done for America and Americans. How then, could whatever Pelosi say (which I totally agree was stupid) change their vote? What it means is that THEY are far more partisan than she is and willing to screw the country by being petty. They thought that it was necessary for America and something that had to be done for its citizens, but they voted NO because they heard someone criticize and blame them (regardless of how stupid it was)? That is partisanship at its worst. The fact is, the Dems/Pelosi got the votes they said they were going to get and the Republicans/Boehner didn't. If the 12 or so House Reps changed because of just her speech when they were going to vote for it for the citizens, they screwed the citizens.

And don't forget, this Bill was full of specific concessions that the GOP House leadership said had to be in there in order for them to vote for it. Absurd.