Obama WILL give tax CUTS to 95% of Americans!

[UBinVA]

According to the Tax Foundation, approx. 31% of Americans DON'T pay Federal Income Tax. So, how do you give a tax cut to someone who doesn't pay them to begin with?

 

Oh I see now, it then becomes a tax credit to those people and they now get more money back from the government that they never paid to begin with. Net results, more welfare and wealth redistribution.

 

If the Democrats are really the party of equality for all, how about the flat tax? That to me is the most equitable of all systems.

 

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/1410.html

[YellowLinesandArmadillos]

According to the Tax Foundation, approx. 31% of Americans DON'T pay Federal Income Tax. So, how do you give a tax cut to someone who doesn't pay them to begin with?

 

Oh I see now, it then becomes a tax credit to those people and they now get more money back from the government that they never paid to begin with. Net results, more welfare and wealth redistribution.

 

If the Democrats are really the party of equality for all, how about the flat tax? That to me is the most equitable of all systems.

 

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/1410.html

 

It is one of those weird distortions that has occurred as a result of changes in the tax law... interestingly though states have increased taxes, both on an income level and or in sales taxes. I would like to know more about the distribution of overall taxes on everyone before I make a judgment as to whether I think this is a bad thing.

[PastaJoe]

It's semantics; the proper wording would be that 95% of Americans will not have their taxes increase, and of those that pay taxes, they will get a tax cut.

 

A flat tax is regressive against lower income taxpayers; someone making $50k and paying 20% in taxes is going to feel the impact much more in basic spending needs (home, food, gas, healthcare, education) than someone making $5 million.

[StupidNation]

The best tax system is a flat tax of 1% of everything bought, sold, or serviced. No exemptions, no write-offs, just a 1% tax on everything. The revenue would be roughly the same, but just below what we have. With that in turn the country could focus on their businesses and be more successful.

 

It's not my idea or my figures. It was brought up during the election.

[Taro T]

The best tax system is a flat tax of 1% of everything bought, sold, or serviced. No exemptions, no write-offs, just a 1% tax on everything. The revenue would be roughly the same, but just below what we have. With that in turn the country could focus on their businesses and be more successful.

 

It's not my idea or my figures. It was brought up during the election.

So, if I'm a small grain distributor buying wheat from a farmer, I pay 1% tax on the grain I buy, and then the mill will pay 1% tax on the grain they process, and then the baker will pay 1% tax on the grain they process into bread, and then the guy who distributes the bread will pay 1%, and then the guy who sells sandwiches made from the bread pays 1% tax on that and the vendor he sold the sandwiches to that actually sells to a customer pays 1% and the guy who finally eats the sandwich pays 1% on that. Did I get all that straight? That's just over 7% paid out on your 1% flat tax.

 

Of course the sandwich which came from ADM which owns the whole supply chain ends up w/ a 1% tax at the customer's end.

 

That clearly looks like an equitable situation to me.

[molson_golden2002]

The best tax system is a flat tax of 1% of everything bought, sold, or serviced. No exemptions, no write-offs, just a 1% tax on everything. The revenue would be roughly the same, but just below what we have. With that in turn the country could focus on their businesses and be more successful.

 

It's not my idea or my figures. It was brought up during the election.

[ExiledInIllinois]

Ah, 95% of TAX PAYING Americans? I guess that is a convienent little detail left out.

 

 

I think it actually around 80%... What's 15%? They all seem to be fudging (AK's % of American energy) numbers.

[KD in CA]

Any discussion of so-called tax cuts is complete horsesh-- until the candidates articulate what they intend to do with the Bush tax cuts.

 

I think it's highly likely that a large portion of that 95% will in fact see a tax hike under Obama (and probably McCain), since they will allow the Bush tax cuts to expire and replace them with smaller tax cuts aimed at a much smaller segment of the population.

 

Anyone who makes >$75,000 per year and thinks their taxes are going down while Obama is in office is living in fantasy land.

[UBinVA]

It's semantics; the proper wording would be that 95% of Americans will not have their taxes increase, and of those that pay taxes, they will get a tax cut.

 

A flat tax is regressive against lower income taxpayers; someone making $50k and paying 20% in taxes is going to feel the impact much more in basic spending needs (home, food, gas, health care, education) than someone making $5 million.

 

Once you start to devise rules and regulations that favor wealth, status, race, gender, etc. you start down the road of social engineering and that becomes very dangerous and exclusionary as we have today. Either we have equal rights for everyone or we don't. In most cases, the unintended consequences of social engineering are more dangerous than the intended protection of those rights in the first place.

 

One of the main reason we are in this financial crises (besides the piss poor mismanagement of Fanny/Freddy/AIG), is that the government required these lending institutions to make loans to those who had no right to even qualify for that loan in the first place. This was done to increase the ownership of homes to the lower middle class, which included a large minority population and housing speculators wanting to make a buck on flipping. Well, the housing market was flooded with new buyers, houses became scarce, and housing prices soared.

 

Once these people realized they could not keep pace with their ill gotten mortgages and home equity loans that people were constantly drawing on, the bubble burst.

 

So, the well intended policy of allowing "everybody" the ability to own a home by lowering lending standards resulted in this mess today.

 

Common sense solutions have been replaced by social engineering (to right the so called wrongs) that our society sees though the lens of class warfare.

 

It really comes down to fundamental principles. Either you're a capitalist or a socialist. The U.S. is mixture of both systems to a certain degree. I choose the capitalist side because I believe it's the purest form of freedom and liberty.

[YellowLinesandArmadillos]

So, if I'm a small grain distributor buying wheat from a farmer, I pay 1% tax on the grain I buy, and then the mill will pay 1% tax on the grain they process, and then the baker will pay 1% tax on the grain they process into bread, and then the guy who distributes the bread will pay 1%, and then the guy who sells sandwiches made from the bread pays 1% tax on that and the vendor he sold the sandwiches to that actually sells to a customer pays 1% and the guy who finally eats the sandwich pays 1% on that. Did I get all that straight? That's just over 7% paid out on your 1% flat tax.

 

Of course the sandwich which came from ADM which owns the whole supply chain ends up w/ a 1% tax at the customer's end.

 

That clearly looks like an equitable situation to me.

Yep, on the surface it sounds like a good deal, but the details are what drives folks up the wall. In order to correct the inequity, the government would have to create tax tables of the estimate of those sales at each level and tax ADM accordingly... still 7% and now the government is defacto setting the price (or at least a floor), eliminating free market principles to work.

[molson_golden2002]

Tax cuts? When we are about to dump $1,000,000,000,000 into our vaunted free market system?

 

Hello, I'm from the government and I'm here to help!

[UBinVA]

Tax cuts? When we are about to dump $1,000,000,000,000 into our vaunted free market system?

 

Hello, I'm from the government and I'm here to help!

 

Stop wasteful government programs and spending and you'll recover that 10 fold in five years.

[molson_golden2002]

Stop wasteful government programs and spending and you'll recover that 10 fold in five years.

ya, whatever

[StupidNation]

So, if I'm a small grain distributor buying wheat from a farmer, I pay 1% tax on the grain I buy, and then the mill will pay 1% tax on the grain they process, and then the baker will pay 1% tax on the grain they process into bread, and then the guy who distributes the bread will pay 1%, and then the guy who sells sandwiches made from the bread pays 1% tax on that and the vendor he sold the sandwiches to that actually sells to a customer pays 1% and the guy who finally eats the sandwich pays 1% on that. Did I get all that straight? That's just over 7% paid out on your 1% flat tax.

 

Of course the sandwich which came from ADM which owns the whole supply chain ends up w/ a 1% tax at the customer's end.

 

That clearly looks like an equitable situation to me.

 

Businesses pay close to 5% to manage accounting. That makes up for the 5% tax by efficient standards of what businesses do, which is their business, management, marketing, rinse and repeat.

 

The system beats the taxes business owners already pay, alleviate stress, increase freedom from scrutiny, and allow people to know how to expense their business before instead of after they are done.

 

Are you in business or have you had your own business? I still do and it makes a lot of sense.

[StupidNation]

Stop wasteful government programs and spending and you'll recover that 10 fold in five years.

 

Wait a second... are you implying that the gov't spends us unconstitutionally into the ground?

[YellowLinesandArmadillos]

Stop wasteful government programs and spending and you'll recover that 10 fold in five years.

Start to name a few and I am sure you can find some, most will not ad up to what you think and others have large constiuencies, a la mineral royalties that become impossible to change, so unless you want to get specific with both programs, dollars and how to accomplish it politically all you rehashing is a useless overused Republican talking point.

 

If you want to get specific, then we can figure out what is wasteful and how eliminating it might be accomplished.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Start to name a few and I am sure you can find some, most will not ad up to what you think and others have large constiuencies, a la mineral royalties that become impossible to change, so unless you want to get specific with both programs, dollars and how to accomplish it politically all you rehashing is a useless overused Republican talking point.

 

If you want to get specific, then we can figure out what is wasteful and how eliminating it might be accomplished.

 

Ooh! Can I play?

 

The Dept. of Education - Management of Educational standards needs to be returned to the localities and states.

The Nat'l Endowment for the Arts - Really, why the f*ck should *I* as a contributing member of society support some starving artist?

Nat'l Endowment for the Humanities - See above.

[finknottle]

It's semantics; the proper wording would be that 95% of Americans will not have their taxes increase, and of those that pay taxes, they will get a tax cut.

 

A tax credit is credit for taxes considered already paid - so if your amount owed drops below zero, you get a refund. Examples include the the Earned Income Tax Credit and the Tax Credits for (having) Children. They tend to go to the poor.

 

This is how you 'lower' the taxes on people paying no income tax - tax credits for things like low income fuel assistance actually sends them money in the form of a refund, considered a rebate for external expenses.

 

So I think the 95% refers to the entire population of filers, not on the 95% that actually pay anything; and that they will all either pay less or get more (according to the Obama camp), not just the 65% who pay something now. [And under his plan, the number of people who pay income tax is projected to fall to only 50% of the households.]

[Typical TBD Guy]

Start to name a few and I am sure you can find some, most will not ad up to what you think and others have large constiuencies, a la mineral royalties that become impossible to change, so unless you want to get specific with both programs, dollars and how to accomplish it politically all you rehashing is a useless overused Republican talking point.

 

If you want to get specific, then we can figure out what is wasteful and how eliminating it might be accomplished.

 

Off the top of my head,

 

Remove U.S. troops from the following places:

 

1. Iraq

2. South Korea

3. Germany

4. Japan

5. Italy

 

Cut the following departments of the federal executive branch:

 

1. Agriculture

2. Commerce

3. Education

4. Energy

5. Homeland Security

6. HUD

7. Labor

8. Transportation

 

To make this happen, start by voting for either of the following on Election Day:

 

1. Non-incumbents

2. Libertarian Party candidates

[Taro T]

Businesses pay close to 5% to manage accounting. That makes up for the 5% tax by efficient standards of what businesses do, which is their business, management, marketing, rinse and repeat.

 

The system beats the taxes business owners already pay, alleviate stress, increase freedom from scrutiny, and allow people to know how to expense their business before instead of after they are done.

 

Are you in business or have you had your own business? I still do and it makes a lot of sense.

 

All that system does is favor vertically integrated firms. But you probably knew that already.

 

And yes, I own my own business.