bills_fan Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 I guess not all government intervention is bad I never claimed it was. Sometimes the one with the big balance sheet has to step up and save the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I never claimed it was. Sometimes the one with the big balance sheet has to step up and save the system. Sure about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 The ratings agencies (most evil entities on earth, IMHO) have effectively been neutralized. The drove the final nail in the AIG coffin, after of course, helping to build the coffin. If you don't like the people who do the ratings, watch this hatchet job on S&P's ratings guru. Bet he doesn't go on the air again soon. http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=859038023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 Sure about that? I try not to speak in absolutes, and tend not to favor government intervention. Could you find something I posted, yeah, maybe... You, of all posters here, should appreciate how close to the abyss we got this week. By mid-Oct, MS, GS, State St, GE, C, F and GM would likely all have failed or required AIG/Bear style intervention. Thats reactive and does not solve the problem. Central banks around the world have injected a collective $2 trillion into financial systems in the last 13 months, yet we were still spinning ever faster to the brink of disaster. Now we can go back to managing the crisis du jour, instead of fearing the entire system will fail. Fix the regulation, assign blame, try to correct the problems....sure. But we won't fear the entire system failing while we do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 If you don't like the people who do the ratings, watch this hatchet job on S&P's ratings guru. Bet he doesn't go on the air again soon. http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=859038023 I would pay to watch that guy and his counterparts from Moodys and Fitch sit before a congressional committee and face questions on the AIG downgrade this week as well as the original ratings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I try not to speak in absolutes, and tend not to favor government intervention. Could you find something I posted, yeah, maybe... You, of all posters here, should appreciate how close to the abyss we got this week. By mid-Oct, MS, GS, State St, GE, C, F and GM would likely all have failed or required AIG/Bear style intervention. Thats reactive and does not solve the problem. Central banks around the world have injected a collective $2 trillion into financial systems in the last 13 months, yet we were still spinning ever faster to the brink of disaster. Now we can go back to managing the crisis du jour, instead of fearing the entire system will fail. Fix the regulation, assign blame, try to correct the problems....sure. But we won't fear the entire system failing while we do it. By no means am I minimizing this week's hell, which is far worse than St Paddy's Day massacre. Just pointing out that it was the right thing to do yesterday, like it was in March. Not everyone agreed in March. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I would pay to watch that guy and his counterparts from Moodys and Fitch sit before a congressional committee and face questions on the AIG downgrade this week as well as the original ratings. Did you hear that a big reason for AIG's troubles was that some banks refused to fund their committments to AIG BEFORE they were downgraded? That's some serious stuff that carries a lot of liability with it. Name another investment grade company for whom banks refused to fund a commitment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 Did you hear that a big reason for AIG's troubles was that some banks refused to fund their committments to AIG BEFORE they were downgraded? That's some serious stuff that carries a lot of liability with it. Name another investment grade company for whom banks refused to fund a commitment. Didn't hear that, but was out of the office on Mon/Tues. Wow, that is a massive deal that will have repercussions down the road (like much of the actions in this period). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Didn't hear that, but was out of the office on Mon/Tues. Wow, that is a massive deal that will have repercussions down the road (like much of the actions in this period). All part of risk management. Banks probably felt that legal liability of not funding was lower than funding the loan. Will be interesting to see what rationale they used not to fund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted September 19, 2008 Author Share Posted September 19, 2008 My original thread premise stands corrected, albeit a week too late. Leadership..... Paulson, Bernanke and Congressional leaders just emerged from a closed-door meeting in the Capitol. Standing shoulder-to-shoulder with their GOP counterparts, Democratic Congressional leaders said the group reached "a bi-partisan agreement to work together" and that the Administration will soon submit a proposal to the Congress, which Senate Majority Leader Reid said he "expect to receive in a matter of hours, not days." Reid said he was "very impressed" with Paulson and Bernanke and said "we're committed to working with them" on this. Paulson said he "saw the best of the United States of America" at work in tonight's meeting and said the Administration would soon submit "an approach to deal with systemic risk in our capital markets." Specifically, Paulson said it will be a "comprehensive approach" and "expeditious solution aimed at the heart of this problem: illiquid assets on financial institutions' balance sheets." In sum, nary a false note in the bipartisan chorus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YellowLinesandArmadillos Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 I would pay to watch that guy and his counterparts from Moodys and Fitch sit before a congressional committee and face questions on the AIG downgrade this week as well as the original ratings. Don't need to, just watch the hearing schedule and pay some college kid from GW to get in line at about 7am to hold a spot in line for you or find an intern who is not making any money to call in sick and hold the spot. Even better, the intern can usually get there at 5am and wait, feed them and they can sleep in front of the door! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 You left out the part that Congress is about to break until after the New Year. That's some leadership. I actually had a friend of mine defend this sort of thing, "Can you imagine how hard they are working? I mean they put in 60 - 70 hour days." Mostly to get re-elected IMO. I don't know about you folks, but I shy away from the decisions if I can. Well, unless making decisions nets me more money...ohhhh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsNYC Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Maybe our Right Tackle should be president "It’s no surprise that switching back and forth from right to left tackle in Sunday’s game at Jacksonville was more challenging from a physical standpoint than a mental one for Buffalo Bills lineman Langston Walker. After all, this is a guy who graduated from the University of California with a degree in economics. This is a guy who informed a handful of reporters after practice Wednesday that AIG’s stock had dropped below $2.50 a share. " http://www.buffalonews.com/452/story/442020.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Funny. The market may end up for the week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
molson_golden2002 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Funny. The market may end up for the week. The magic of big government bailouts! The credit crunch isn't going away anytime soon, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YellowLinesandArmadillos Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 I actually had a friend of mine defend this sort of thing, "Can you imagine how hard they are working? I mean they put in 60 - 70 hour days." Mostly to get re-elected IMO. I don't know about you folks, but I shy away from the decisions if I can. Well, unless making decisions nets me more money...ohhhh They do put in a lot of hours in a day and staff even more. Often the staff has them back in their districts running around every day talking to people, yes fundraising too, but mostly spending time in their states and districts meeting people and finding out what is important as well as IDing people who can use help dealing with different bureaucracies. As a staffer myself, we were tasked with keeping my bosses busy, then we had to follow up on his visits and if a call was needed by the Congressman then we made that happen too. So to say they are out of session doesn't necessarily mean much. If however, said congressman is off doing things that he or she shouldn't then the criticism is valid, but most are working in state when not in session...Community Organizing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 I try not to speak in absolutes, and tend not to favor government intervention. Could you find something I posted, yeah, maybe... You, of all posters here, should appreciate how close to the abyss we got this week. By mid-Oct, MS, GS, State St, GE, C, F and GM would likely all have failed or required AIG/Bear style intervention. Thats reactive and does not solve the problem. Central banks around the world have injected a collective $2 trillion into financial systems in the last 13 months, yet we were still spinning ever faster to the brink of disaster. I have a bad feeling that all we did was delay the inevitable. I fear that too much damage will be done. And to anyone who thinks I just want to spin things on that- I really, really hope I am wrong, because a total collapse helps nobody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted September 19, 2008 Author Share Posted September 19, 2008 I have a bad feeling that all we did was delay the inevitable. I fear that too much damage will be done. And to anyone who thinks I just want to spin things on that- I really, really hope I am wrong, because a total collapse helps nobody. I don't think so. Of course we will still have crisis du jour, but this was different due to the lack of a floor. Many buyer walked into AIG last week, they had no way to measure the downside risk...due to mark-to-market accounting, the risk was almost infinite. This allows the banks to offload the bad debt, thereby enabling them to begin lending again, restoring credit and liquidity (after the stupid short selling order expires). This will actually put a floor under home prices. Combined with all the capital injected into the market, I think we will be in good shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon in Pasadena Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 they put in 60 - 70 hour days. Yeah, that sounds like typical government accounting... (We'll just steal some hours from our grand-kids' days -- no problemo! ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 Yeah, that sounds like typical government accounting... (We'll just steal some hours from our grand-kids' days -- no problemo! ) Glad someone got it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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