Kelly the Dog Posted September 16, 2008 Posted September 16, 2008 You know I can't help but think of the FACT JP has hardly any games with over 200 yards and the fact that he is prone to bone-headed plays, and I just can't help but think that after watching you defend this guy you are "fair" or "balanced". Sure some things would have helped JP, but he is not going to be a good starter in this league. Trent showed me more in his first start than JP did in his career. Could you please change your name to StupidPerson?
colin Posted September 16, 2008 Posted September 16, 2008 trent has played pretty well in his last few games except for bad bad weather. the weather affected the opposing qb badly too, so he get's a bit of a pass, but he's looked much worse in the elements. i'd say trent is a solid young qb at this point, seeing as his decent games came against good (at least last year) Ds. jp losman is terrible by the measure of starting qbs. he's around the letwich, harrington level of first round busts. he makes bad plays and doesn't produce much offensively. his "11th rated passer" season was like a running back having a 4.5 average on the fewest number of carries in the nfl for starters. jp is a sack, turnover, dumb play, dirt ball machine. all that said he is a great athlete and could provide a kordel stewart type spark off the bench.
bizell Posted September 16, 2008 Posted September 16, 2008 70% completion percentage. Matt Cassell has a 70% completion percentage.. and he's only started 2 games in his career. SINCE HIGH SCHOOL. what's all this mean? i dunno.
Captain Hindsight Posted September 16, 2008 Posted September 16, 2008 It doesn't matter who you think is a better qb. If JP was the starter, I would be cheering for him at RWS on Sunday. That is what matters. Besides this, I agree with others in this thread. He might be very effective coming off the bench in case on injury to Trent. haha Bill im only screwing with ya because you got on my case once
DIE HARD 1967 Posted September 16, 2008 Author Posted September 16, 2008 Matt Cassell has a 70% completion percentage.. and he's only started 2 games in his career. SINCE HIGH SCHOOL. what's all this mean? i dunno. It means his high school team thought he was good enough to start! Everything went down hill after that!
Guest dog14787 Posted September 16, 2008 Posted September 16, 2008 You know I can't help but think of the FACT JP has hardly any games with over 200 yards and the fact that he is prone to bone-headed plays, and I just can't help but think that after watching you defend this guy you are "fair" or "balanced". Sure some things would have helped JP, but he is not going to be a good starter in this league. Trent showed me more in his first start than JP did in his career. and we can't help the fact that regardless of all the facts, JP Losman is still shouldering the blame for what in my opinion was some of the worst coaching and play calling in the history of the Buffalo Bills, maybe even in the whole NFL. So why don't you take your BS and spread it somewhere else because you look stupid for critisizing someone who seems to know allot more about the situation then you do. When and if JP Losman goes in under our new OC, and he plays poorly, maybe what you say will make a little more sense to those of us who tend to put the blame more on our previous OC or the way Losman was handled early on in his career.
Heels20X6 Posted September 16, 2008 Posted September 16, 2008 and we can't help the fact that regardless of all the facts, JP Losman is still shouldering the blame for what in my opinion was some of the worst coaching and play calling in the history of the Buffalo Bills, maybe even in the whole NFL. So why don't you take your BS and spread it somewhere else because you look stupid for critisizing someone who seems to know allot more about the situation then you do. When and if JP Losman goes in under our new OC, and he plays poorly, maybe what you say will make a little more sense to those of us who tend to put the blame more on our previous OC or the way Losman was handled early on in his career. Stop it! You're letting intelligence get in the way of a good debate!
Lori Posted September 16, 2008 Posted September 16, 2008 I think JP would be more successful than he was, last year, in the current environment. I don't think he would be as successful as Trent is now, with this team. As you said, hopefully we won't need to find out. I am fairly comfortable with him as a #2, and won't freak if he has to come into a game. I actually think his temperament is ideal for a #2 QB. Again, unless it is mop-up duty, I'd rather not find this out. I think JP would best fit a team like the ones I am currently watching, particularly Dallas. They have a good OL. Big fast receivers. And the go-long mentality. I think he could be a star in Denver. But, JP would still have to improve in some areas to be totally effective, even with those teams. The one area that he needs the most improvement in, is his awareness in the pocket. That is something some QBs never learn, but it can be improved. Agreed. It's not a contradiction to believe that Edwards is a better choice at QB than Losman, but also think that Losman was mishandled by previous coaching staffs (an opinion shared by Mark Kelso and Chris Brown, among others).
Orton's Arm Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 Agreed. It's not a contradiction to believe that Edwards is a better choice at QB than Losman, but also think that Losman was mishandled by previous coaching staffs (an opinion shared by Mark Kelso and Chris Brown, among others). Certainly that's one way to look at it. Another way is that Losman had his whole rookie year to learn the playbook, take mental reps in practice, watch game film, learn from the things Bledsoe did well or did poorly, etc. He also received practice time in his rookie year both before the injury occurred and after he'd healed. Going into his second year, the offense and playbook should have been familiar to him. And it certainly looked like all that rookie year learning had paid off when the Bills played Houston. But there's a certain minimal level of play you expect from a second year quarterback, and during the next three games Losman fell well short of that level of play. It was clear that Holcomb was the better quarterback for the short term. But one could (and many on this board have) made the argument that Losman's abysmal and embarrassing performances in games 2 - 4 of his second season raised serious questions about his long-term future in this league. Questions which, with the benefit of hindsight, appear to have been perfectly legitimate. If Mularkey and company were simply looking for a quick fix, it's hard to respect their decision to bench Losman. But if, even then, they were starting to realize he wasn't going to become the long-term answer at quarterback, their decision to bench him appears in a more reasonable light.
Steely Dan Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 I think JP was mishandled but even if handled right he would never have been better than Edwards in my opinion. He will be a solid QB for some team but I believe TE will be a franchise QB.
Flbillsfan#1 Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 I guess I'm just not as willing to put 100% of the blame on Fairchild. When I hear that our QB isn't allowed to call audibles, I think it speaks to his grasp of the offense. I guess I'm uncomfortable with Kelly's post that implied that Losman would be successful in the current environment - I honestly believe that our offense is more sophisticated this year because of Edwards' ability to learn the playbook. I admit I have no proof, just a gut feeling. Hopefully we don't have a chance to find out, but if we do, I hope I'm wrong What was your gut feeling about Youboty? How many people on this board wanted to dump him for nothing? Just as Ashton hadn't had a chance to prove himself yet, I feel the same about JP due to the teams he played on. On the 2008 Bills with Turk as OC I think JP would look much better than he has in the past.
Stussy109 Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 QB Stats (Edwards is ranked #8) http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/statistics?s...2&year=2008 2 Wins. Tied for 1st in AFC EAST ESPN 2 says he is "THE MOST IMPROVED PLAYER IN THE ENTIRE NFL" Ron Jawbreaker was blasting the experts for jumping on the Brett Farve band wagon and ignoring the Bills...Jaws said "I warned you guys but you just had to do it" I am real happy....not sure about you guys! Check out the names of the QB's rated lower then Edwards.... I think Jaworski hopped on the Bills Bandwagon after the MNF game against Big D last year. He saw us almost embarrass "Americas Team" on the big stage.
Cotton Fitzsimmons Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 I wouldn't mind him risking that rating by taking a few more shots downfield. But, given that the Bills are winning, and that the D looks to be stronger, I am quite happy with that performance. Go Trent! This is getting serious around here Deano! If this keeps up, you and I may not have our annual debate over the interpretation of tiebreakers...
Hanoverbills Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 You know...I am both excited and saddened by this stat - I was a staunch supporter of JP Losman.....why couldn't he have produced like this? I was really hoping he would get it together and be a annual Pro Bowler and with that rocket arm strike fear into the hearts of opposing defenses.... But it was not mean to be....... Welcome to our new savior Trent Edwards....who really DOES appear to be the real deal. I think the big differance in Edwards is Turk Schonert.He calls a better game than our coordinator last year.I think if Losman plays this year,you will see him play better too.
Steely Dan Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 What was your gut feeling about Youboty? How many people on this board wanted to dump him for nothing? Just as Ashton hadn't had a chance to prove himself yet, I feel the same about JP due to the teams he played on. On the 2008 Bills with Turk as OC I think JP would look much better than he has in the past. I agree with you that if JP had been drafted by this HC and had this OC and he was brought along for a year first he'd be a great QB. Unfortunately he didn't have that and the damage is irreparable and it's best for the Bills and him that he move on. I think TE is a franchise QB and will be much better than JP could have been. I'd place JP in the Jake Delhomme, John Kitna and Jeff Garcia mold. QB's that are above average but not great. I think TE has Manning or Brady potential.
Flbillsfan#1 Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 I agree with you that if JP had been drafted by this HC and had this OC and he was brought along for a year first he'd be a great QB. Unfortunately he didn't have that and the damage is irreparable and it's best for the Bills and him that he move on. I think TE is a franchise QB and will be much better than JP could have been. I'd place JP in the Jake Delhomme, John Kitna and Jeff Garcia mold. QB's that are above average but not great. I think TE has Manning or Brady potential. I agree with you about JP & hope you are right about Trent. I am still concerned about Trent's ability to stay healthy & play well in bad weather. I have read over & over that the opposing QB's also played just as poorly in poor weather. I disagree with this as the opposing QB WON each game (except the Seattle game when the weather improved). To compare Trent's potential to Payton Manning, Trent will have to learn to play well in poor weather...............I'm sure you saw the weather Payton played in to win the Super Bowl.
Hanoverbills Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 Certainly that's one way to look at it. Another way is that Losman had his whole rookie year to learn the playbook, take mental reps in practice, watch game film, learn from the things Bledsoe did well or did poorly, etc. He also received practice time in his rookie year both before the injury occurred and after he'd healed. Going into his second year, the offense and playbook should have been familiar to him. And it certainly looked like all that rookie year learning had paid off when the Bills played Houston. But there's a certain minimal level of play you expect from a second year quarterback, and during the next three games Losman fell well short of that level of play. It was clear that Holcomb was the better quarterback for the short term. But one could (and many on this board have) made the argument that Losman's abysmal and embarrassing performances in games 2 - 4 of his second season raised serious questions about his long-term future in this league. Questions which, with the benefit of hindsight, appear to have been perfectly legitimate. If Mularkey and company were simply looking for a quick fix, it's hard to respect their decision to bench Losman. But if, even then, they were starting to realize he wasn't going to become the long-term answer at quarterback, their decision to bench him appears in a more reasonable light. J.P. had a differant offensive coordinator his first three years with the Bills.I don't think that could be good for a young qb, unless your going from what we had last year at offensive coordinator.Anybody would be a improvement over Fairchild.
Steely Dan Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 I agree with you about JP & hope you are right about Trent. I am still concerned about Trent's ability to stay healthy & play well in bad weather. I have read over & over that the opposing QB's also played just as poorly in poor weather. I disagree with this as the opposing QB WON each game (except the Seattle game when the weather improved). To compare Trent's potential to Payton Manning, Trent will have to learn to play well in poor weather...............I'm sure you saw the weather Payton played in to win the Super Bowl. The bad weather thing is something he'll learn to deal with. It's just another obstacle for him and I think he's more than capable of overcoming the problem. He seems to take his weakness' seriously and I'll bet he works on his throws in bad weather on his own until he's overcome it.
WellDressed Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 Carson Palmer @ 31 w/30 something rating?? The SHO guys are right..............dump #84 & #85
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted September 18, 2008 Posted September 18, 2008 Let me start with this Evans is off to his best opening to a season since the Bills selected him in the first round of the 2004 draft out of Wisconsin. In two games, he has a team-leading eight catches for 179 yards, which is plenty for a receiver that had difficulty cracking 200 yards in the first month of each of his first four seasons—and had a meager 22 at this point last year. I will finish with this.... Trent Edwards has lead this years team to 2-0. Trent has 454 passing yards, 1 TD, 0 INT's and a 107.7 QB rating. At this time Last Season Lostman lead the team to 0-2. He had 251 passing yards, 0 TD's, 1 INT's and a 67.4 QB rating.
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