Were you with me in bashing DJ for benching Losman?

[Flbillsfan#1]

Nice to see all you JP butt sniffers are still sticking together.

I don't see ANY Trent lovers coming to your defense. There is a reason for that. You bring NOTHING of substance to this board. People should be able to come on this board & express their opinions without being personally attacked by an IDIOT that doesn't have the knowledge or wit to express his opinions on the subject being discussed. 99% of your posts are either you licking Trents balls, or your attacking others that don't care to partake in that activity.

[thebug]

I don't see ANY Trent lovers coming to your defense. There is a reason for that. You bring NOTHING of substance to this board. People should be able to come on this board & express their opinions without being personally attacked by an IDIOT that doesn't have the knowledge or wit to express his opinions on the subject being discussed. 99% of your posts are either you licking Trents balls, or your attacking others that don't care to partake in that activity.

 

 

you....... I don't need anyone to come to my defense. When a guy posts on this board that he thinks JP should be the starter, he is obviously a retard and so are you!

 

 

Edit: I rest my case **** - did you see that drive.

[Orton's Arm]

Losman's career is virtually Rob Johnson revisited. I guess it will take JP getting waived by his next team to convince you. That's ok, from the data you do have a 5-10% chance of being right. My thinking is more along the lines that it wasn't the management that failed JP. It's more JP was failing the management and they were always looking to find a better replacement.

1) JP's 2nd season-I was with you all at the time. I hated Mularkey for putting his job security over the team and felt that to put in Holcomb, to win 1 or 2 more meaningless games was hurting JP and the team. Looking back on the situation, I now see what Mularkey & his staff were doing. They saw enough of Losman to believe he wasn't good enough & yanked him before the vets exploded the locker room. They felt they couldn't win with JP and went with a bandaid-Kelly Holcomb. That couldn't stop the bleeding (losses), but they felt it was futile to have JP in there.

2) JP's 3rd season-It would have been interesting to see what would have happened if the same staff that was there in 2005 was still in place-the ones who didn't trust JP with the starter's job. Fortunately, we will never know. So Marv & Jauron come in & what is one of their 1st moves-signing Craig Nall to compete for the starter's job. Now we know by now Nall is not starting material and by 2006 neither is Kelly Holcomb. So JP wins the starter's job by default. He plays well in about 3-7 games (depending on your view, but 7 is about the limit) and the fans thought JP was entrenched and would be the Bills' QB for the next decade. Now the guys who see the players every day in practice, gameday & subsequent film study show more by their actions than their words. When all the so called experts expect the Bills to fill an obvious need such as D back with pick 92 of the 2007 draft, the Bills surprise them all by picking a QB. This is the same group that signed Nall in a subtle attempt to replace JP the previous year.

3) JP's 4th season-From the 1st exhibition game & reports in practice, there are signs that not only has JP not moved forward, but he is playing more like the bad JP, not the good JP of the previous year's 3-7 games. In the 1st exhibition game, JP & the starting O are expected to play a few plays & get out of there. Unfortunately, JP & the O play so poorly that they are kept in a lot longer than planned. It cost the team an opportunity to get all QBs in the game. Do you remember how PO'd Nall was when he didn't play? As the preseason goes on, JP still is not showing much. Meanwhile Trent Edwards starts to light it up against the 2nd & 3rd stringers. By the end of pre-season, Trent has shown the most of the QBs & Nall is released. If there had been an open competition, Trent Edwards would have been the opening day starter, not JP Losman. Now the 1st 2 games JP flat out sucks, there's no other way to put it. Now JP gets injured & in his 1st start Trent edwards leads the Bills to victory. Now by the time JP is ready, the team has already found a guy the trust more. Once again, I go back to the fact they are the ones who see these guys 24/7. We all know how the rest of the story turns out.

So, looking back-was JP handled poorly? Maybe, but the guys who see these guys 24/7 have been looking for something better for virtually JP's entire career, that should tell all the fans something. No matter how bad you think Mularkey and his staff were, they still now more about football & talent evaluation than just about everyone who is a member of this board. When Marv & Dick came in they too did just about everything they could to find JP's replacement. Once again-they know more than we do. Is this messing with someone, or is it more watching a guy & concluding he's just not good enough. Now JP has had his moments and does have 30 starts, so having him around as a 2nd stringer, in a league where decent backups are few & far between, does make some sense.

Let's get to the final part-the ridiculous notion that JP was benched for financial reasons & Ralph is just being cheap. Did JP lose money by losing the starting job? I'm not so sure he did. 1st of all, the Bills don't think JP is a multi-million dollar talent. They view him in his proper place-a veteran backup who has started 30 games with limited success. Now if JP had played enough games for his salary to be higher than it is, it wouldn't mean he'd be getting it. If JP had played enough to earn the extra $ for 2008, I'm 99.9% sure that the Bills would have cut him, before they paid him starter's $ to be the backup. Also, Ralph & the team know darn well that whoever the starter is this year, a big year means a major contract extension for next season. So it really doesn't matter who the starter is from a financial standpoint. If Trent succeeds, which I fully expect, he's going to be paid about $7 million next year. Otherwise the Bills will be paying big $ to a 1st round rookie or a veteran acquired by trade or as a free agent. It was NEVER about Ralph pulling strings to save $.

This is one of the best posts on this subject I've seen. I've read that one of the reasons for Losman's success in the second half of 2006 was that the offense had been considerably simplified for his benefit. The coaching staff did what it had to do to maximize wins over the short term, and start developing some confidence in the locker room. At the same time, they must have realized that Losman's decision-making and ability to quickly process information wouldn't necessarily ever reach the level they were hoping for. So when Edwards fell to them in the 3rd round, they took a quarterback with less physical talent than Losman, but much better mental ability. The Bills' coaching staff probably thought, if Losman significantly improves his ability to quickly process information, then we've used a 3rd round pick on a very good backup QB. And if he doesn't, then we've just drafted his replacement. And in any case, Trent looks like a much better football player than you'd expect from a 3rd round pick.

 

During the 2007 season, Edwards looked more polished and further along in his development than Losman. At that point, the coaching staff apparently realized that Losman would probably never be more than just a journeyman, but Edwards had the potential to develop into a very good QB. Thus far this season, the coaching staff's faith in Edwards has paid big dividends. I'm really excited by the Bills' potential to have a great season this year. And with this being a young, talented team, whatever we accomplish this year isn't going to be some one-and-done deal. Expect the Bills to be good for years to come.

[Flbillsfan#1]

you....... I don't need anyone to come to my defense. When a guy posts on this board that he thinks JP should be the starter, he is obviously a retard and so are you!

 

 

Edit: I rest my case **** - did you see that drive.

My point is you do not respect the opinion of other people, & if you disagree with it debate it in a logical way. ALL you can do is attack people on a personal level that you don't agree with. You NEED this board for that because if you interacted in person with others the way you interact with others on this board, you would have been SQUISHED like the BUG you are long ago. YOU are the **** my fellow Bills fan.

[BillsWatch]

I wasn't bashing the coaches and I feel the same thing about bashing as I did before - it is an waste of time and electrons.

 

I think Losman can be a good backup and with time can do what Gannon did find a coach which can utilize his skills and hide/coach out his weaknesses but methodical, high completion percentage game may never be his strong suit.

[ChasBB]

... And in any case, Trent looks like a much better football player than you'd expect from a 3rd round pick.[/i]

Joe Montanna was also a 3rd-round pick -- that's pretty good company for Trent!

 

Tom Brady was a 6th-round pick!

[Gordio]

The announcers in the Seattle game touched on the Edwards/Losman thing briefly. They made the comment that the Bills "like them both. Edwards does some things really well and Losman does some things really well. They just feel Edwards has a slight edge at the moment. But, they are really happy to have Losman as well."

 

Personally, I think that was a straight from the horse's mouth comment. The Bills coaches do not think Losman sucks; they think that Edwards just has a bit of an edge. Neither one of them is Peyton Manning (yet) and neither one of them is Henry Burris.

 

I don't see Losman being in Buffalo after this year. People that think it is possible for a player to snap his fingers and unlearn bad habits and poor coaching instantly are wholly unrealistic. It really is not that surprising that Losman and Edwards are at similar points in their development. I'll cheer for both of them, thank you very much, to continue to develop into good NFL QBs.

 

 

If you honestly think Losman & Edwards are at similar stages of their developement, I really have to question your football knowledge.

[Steely Dan]

This is one of the best posts on this subject I've seen. I've read that one of the reasons for Losman's success in the second half of 2006 was that the offense had been considerably simplified for his benefit. The coaching staff did what it had to do to maximize wins over the short term, and start developing some confidence in the locker room. At the same time, they must have realized that Losman's decision-making and ability to quickly process information wouldn't necessarily ever reach the level they were hoping for. So when Edwards fell to them in the 3rd round, they took a quarterback with less physical talent than Losman, but much better mental ability. The Bills' coaching staff probably thought, if Losman significantly improves his ability to quickly process information, then we've used a 3rd round pick on a very good backup QB. And if he doesn't, then we've just drafted his replacement. And in any case, Trent looks like a much better football player than you'd expect from a 3rd round pick.

 

During the 2007 season, Edwards looked more polished and further along in his development than Losman. At that point, the coaching staff apparently realized that Losman would probably never be more than just a journeyman, but Edwards had the potential to develop into a very good QB. Thus far this season, the coaching staff's faith in Edwards has paid big dividends. I'm really excited by the Bills' potential to have a great season this year. And with this being a young, talented team, whatever we accomplish this year isn't going to be some one-and-done deal. Expect the Bills to be good for years to come.

 

Very true. It appears that TE is the real deal. He's only started a handful of games so far and so his development is in the very early stages. He's starting at a very high level and if he keeps improving like he has so far then this team should be great for a few years. A young talented team is what the FO has been driving for since Levy took over. Right now, IMO, the team has the perfect mix of veterans, rookies and second year players. It appears after two games that all facets of the game are at a high level and should only improve as the season goes on.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

Not to rub salt..

 

but we told you so...

[thebug]

My point is you do not respect the opinion of other people, & if you disagree with it debate it in a logical way. ALL you can do is attack people on a personal level that you don't agree with. You NEED this board for that because if you interacted in person with others the way you interact with others on this board, you would have been SQUISHED like the BUG you are long ago. YOU are the **** my fellow Bills fan.

 

Thanks JP! Carry on with your Trent crusade. Nice beard.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

Thanks JP! Carry on with your Trent crusade. Nice beard.

Nice intelligent response.

[thebug]

Nice intelligent response.

 

 

Thanks for your concern.

 

 

GO BILLS!

[Orton's Arm]

Joe Montanna was also a 3rd-round pick -- that's pretty good company for Trent!

 

Tom Brady was a 6th-round pick!

True. QB draft day steals like those two don't come around very often, so you hate to hope for too much. But it's starting to become obvious that Trent was worth a lot more than the 3rd round pick we used to get him. The only question now is, how much more?

[VABills]

You know to really screw up another teams game planning and to give us an edge, DJ ought to mix them up. never let the other team know who is starting. I think JP has been dorked around and would be great. We all know he has more athletic ability, that more than make up for any "mental" issue he may have. Could you imagine the other coordinators going WTF when JP trots on the field?

[thebug]

You know to really screw up another teams game planning and to give us an edge, DJ ought to mix them up. never let the other team know who is starting. I think JP has been dorked around and would be great. We all know he has more athletic ability, that more than make up for any "mental" issue he may have. Could you imagine the other coordinators going WTF when JP trots on the field?

 

 

Really? I guess I must have missed those games. I know I would be saying WTF?

 

 

 

GO BILLS!

[PromoTheRobot]

Are we still arguing that JP should be the starter?

 

PTR

[Bill from NYC]

Are we still arguing that JP should be the starter?

 

PTR

 

It probably won't stop until he is waived from his next team. Wait and see what happens when the Bills lose their first game. The calls for JP will come not after, but during the game.

 

Again, I understand it to a degree because I was a huge RJ supporter. When a guy can run, throw 60 yard passes, and looks like a good qb, it makes it way harder to tell that a guy is not a good player.

[keepthefaith]

Very true. It appears that TE is the real deal. He's only started a handful of games so far and so his development is in the very early stages. He's starting at a very high level and if he keeps improving like he has so far then this team should be great for a few years. A young talented team is what the FO has been driving for since Levy took over. Right now, IMO, the team has the perfect mix of veterans, rookies and second year players. It appears after two games that all facets of the game are at a high level and should only improve as the season goes on.

 

I still don't like the decision and I think the Bills would be the same 2-0 with JP at the helm this year. No question that Trent's style of play and his personality are better fits for Jauron's approach to the game. Trent is off to a good start this year and if he continues to play well and improve, then he'll validate the decision to put him in there. The proof will be in several weeks IMO after the opposition has some time to study Trent's game.

[Albany,n.y.]

True. QB draft day steals like those two don't come around very often, so you hate to hope for too much. But it's starting to become obvious that Trent was worth a lot more than the 3rd round pick we used to get him. The only question now is, how much more?

When Trent Edwards started getting noticed in camp last year, my first reaction was (after thinking about players like Brady & Montana) maybe it's finally our turn.

[Bill from NYC]

I still don't like the decision and I think the Bills would be the same 2-0 with JP at the helm this year. No question that Trent's style of play and his personality are better fits for Jauron's approach to the game. Trent is off to a good start this year and if he continues to play well and improve, then he'll validate the decision to put him in there. The proof will be in several weeks IMO after the opposition has some time to study Trent's game.

 

As opposed to 4 years? You know....one player has 7 wins in 11 starts, the other 10 wins in 31 starts.

 

I must say that I admire your mettle for sticking with this guy, and I am being completely serious.