OGTEleven Posted October 21, 2004 Posted October 21, 2004 Let me say that I am Yankee neutral. I am rooting for them in this series primarily because Boston people in general and Pats fans in particular are so obnoxious that a RS World Series win (Go Cards or Astros) would make it unbearable. I'm a Padre fan. I do get to see a lot of the Yanks on TV and I love baseball and think I understand it very well. Here's why they are not already in the WS........Stottlemyre. In the past 7-8 years there is not one pitcher that has been brought into NY from outside or the minors that has improved in any way. The only pitchers that have performed have been well established veterans (Clemens, Mussina, Wells, Pettitte). The young pitchers they have brought in from outside the organization have failed. (I'm not going to count Brown against Stottlemyre, he is a vet and has always had a loser's attitude. I also won't count Contreras against him or credit him for El Duque. Both were established before NY, albeit outside MLB.). The two most obvious failures have been Weaver and Vasquez. Weaver came in from Detroit leading the league in complete games and shutouts (for the Tigers). He had thrown a 1-hitter in Fenway. Stottlemyre proceeded to rip apart the kid's entire approach to the game and tried to rebuild it. It didn't work. Some may think it was NY that got to Weaver but I don't. He was/is definitely too emotional but Stottlemyre did nothing to help with that. He tinkered and tinkered his way to and ERA for Weaver of just under 6. Ok, let's say it was all Weaver's fault. You can't miss with Vasquez right? He was a stud for Montreal for goodness sake. He was probably one of the top 5 or 6 starters in the NL last year. Now he completely stinks? No way. Anyone in the bullpen develop? Nope. Anyone regress? Heredia did. How about guys that left? What did Weaver do in LA this year? (Watch him next year). Wasn't that Ted Lilly in the All Star game this year?
Guest Guest Posted October 21, 2004 Posted October 21, 2004 My theory is there are too many Buffalo fans rooting for the Yankees. We all know what happens to Buffalo teams in big games "gasp ... gasp .... gasp ... whine ... whine .... whine ... everybody is out to get us."
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted October 21, 2004 Posted October 21, 2004 While I don't disagree with anything you say, I also think that the Yankee's haven't figured out one other thing. There's a shortage of good pitching in baseball (just like QB's in football) Any real good young pitchers are either resigned with their existing teams or are used as trade bait for other good young prospects. In the true Yankee tradition, they figure they can just keep spending tons of $$ to buy the pitchers they want. Trouble is, they haven't figured out that there's a reason the people they are signing are available. For most part they are no good! So they have a great fantasy rotation, just not very good on the mound. The other thing that it appears has happened. After the Yanks won a couple of series in late 80's they tailed off. George S decided for awhile to stop spending money like a drunken sailer. So instead he let young players develop; Jeter, B Williams, Soriano, (Paul ONeal??) and a number of other who all played at Columbus. Then in mid 90's they started winning again. George then got greedy again and wanted to keep winning every year, so went to his old ways and started trading his young prospects at Columbus for older mostly over the hill playes to fill in holes. They've made some good good deals but also many bad ones. At this point they have a team with good offensive players, but no pitching and no prospects to speak of to trade with to get any good young pitching. So the only thing George can do is to continue spending money blinding and subscribe to the "even a blind squirrel finds an acorn on occasion"! They will likely get lucky on some, but not likely enough.
Tom Posted October 21, 2004 Posted October 21, 2004 The other thing that it appears has happened. After the Yanks won a couple of series in late 80's they tailed off. George S decided for awhile to stop spending money like a drunken sailer. So instead he let young players develop; Jeter, B Williams, Soriano, (Paul ONeal??) and a number of other who all played at Columbus. Then in mid 90's they started winning again. George then got greedy again and wanted to keep winning every year, so went to his old ways and started trading his young prospects at Columbus for older mostly over the hill playes to fill in holes. They've made some good good deals but also many bad ones. At this point they have a team with good offensive players, but no pitching and no prospects to speak of to trade with to get any good young pitching. So the only thing George can do is to continue spending money blinding and subscribe to the "even a blind squirrel finds an acorn on occasion"! They will likely get lucky on some, but not likely enough. Lots of good points, Ed. Thanks
OGTEleven Posted October 21, 2004 Author Posted October 21, 2004 While I don't disagree with anything you say, I also think that the Yankee's haven't figured out one other thing. In the true Yankee tradition, they figure they can just keep spending tons of $$ to buy the pitchers they want. Trouble is, they haven't figured out that there's a reason the people they are signing are available. For most part they are no good! So they have a great fantasy rotation, just not very good on the mound. 78522[/snapback] Vazquez ERA's (all of these were "on mound performances) 01 - 3.43, 02 - 3.91, 03 - 3.24, 04 (Stottlemyre) - 4.91 Weaver's ERA's 02 (split between NY & DET with Det #'s being much better) - 3.52, 03 (with MS) 5.99, 04 (post MS) 4.01 These numbers aren't lying. Weaver's ERA went up 2.5 runs with MS and came down 2 after leaving. Vazquez's results sre too stark for it to be a coicindence. God forbid he gets his hands on Santana. P.S. Neither Mel or his kid ever pitched worth a crap either.
MattyT Posted October 21, 2004 Posted October 21, 2004 Pettitte and Rivera can't be counted as Stottlemyre failures. They both came up from the minor leagues and developed into All-Stars under Mel's watch. However, FA pitching aquisitions have not really improved while w/the Yankees despite the added run support. At best, they have maintained the statistical achievements that they had coming onto the team despite coming from less productive teams.
Alaska Darin Posted October 21, 2004 Posted October 21, 2004 There are alot of reasons the Yankees don't win despite the payroll. You've each touched on some of them. At the end of the day, too many superstars are generally trumped by teams with enough superstars and other players who are willing to do the little things that the Yankees simply don't do. This entire series swung because Alex Rodriguez was too selfish to shorten his swing and make contact with a runner on 3rd and less than two out. That's a microcosm of what ails this team.
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 21, 2004 Posted October 21, 2004 There are alot of reasons the Yankees don't win despite the payroll. You've each touched on some of them. At the end of the day, too many superstars are generally trumped by teams with enough superstars and other players who are willing to do the little things that the Yankees simply don't do. This entire series swung because Alex Rodriguez was too selfish to shorten his swing and make contact with a runner on 3rd and less than two out. That's a microcosm of what ails this team. 78574[/snapback] So true AD... Just as in Life...
Rudyc80 Posted October 21, 2004 Posted October 21, 2004 My theory is there are too many Buffalo fans rooting for the Yankees. We all know what happens to Buffalo teams in big games "gasp ... gasp .... gasp ... whine ... whine .... whine ... everybody is out to get us." Thats your typical NE area fan...just a pure son of a b@#@ch! I seriously hate those people and hope their beloved resox lose the world series! they are pure punks and thats why i will always hate them! Read the quote above and you need to see no more!
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