Boatdrinks Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 For OBAMA.... " At the moment of conception". He sold himself to the evangelicals like a two dollar whore. Add to that the fact that he wants a back door income tax increase on anyone who has an employer paid health insurance policy worth a damn, and it's Obama all the way. That whole meeting with "Pastor Rick " or whatever that idiot calls himself was a joke. Religious test for office, anyone? I liked Obama's answer to that ridiculous question, though. It was essentially like saying "It's out of my area" and is best left to the INDIVIDUAL to decide. Some people get uncomfortable with that though, they need a "guiding light" or something...
Chilly Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 The abortion issue is just oh so important when picking a political candidate.
John Adams Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 For OBAMA.... " At the moment of conception". He sold himself to the evangelicals like a two dollar whore. Add to that the fact that he wants a back door income tax increase on anyone who has an employer paid health insurance policy worth a damn, and it's Obama all the way. That whole meeting with "Pastor Rick " or whatever that idiot calls himself was a joke. Religious test for office, anyone? I liked Obama's answer to that ridiculous question, though. It was essentially like saying "It's out of my area" and is best left to the INDIVIDUAL to decide. Some people get uncomfortable with that though, they need a "guiding light" or something... Go figure. I think life begins at some point near conception too, and I don't care AT ALL about the abortion issue. If you base your vote on someone's abortion view, your right to vote should be revoked.
Boatdrinks Posted August 24, 2008 Author Posted August 24, 2008 Go figure. I think life begins at some point near conception too, and I don't care AT ALL about the abortion issue. If you base your vote on someone's abortion view, your right to vote should be revoked. You know what, I'd be inclined to agree with you. However, one's stance on the abortion issue is a pretty good window into their worldview. Those who are vehemently against it are usually religious wackos who want to control the freedoms of others and oppose all that do not conform with their "religion". Very scary stuff. As a male, I do not feel as though I should have any say in in the matter. Women should decide ultimately. Will I ever personally need an abortion? No. Do I care about the "issue"? Not really, it's just an indicator of how one's mind works or doesn't.
BillsNYC Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 Go figure. I think life begins at some point near conception too, and I don't care AT ALL about the abortion issue. If you base your vote on someone's abortion view, your right to vote should be revoked. That's McCain's dilemma. You know he wants Lieberman, but all the conservative wackos out there will vote for a 3rd party rather than vote for a McCain ticket with a pro-life VICE PRESIDENT. I'm a McCain supporter and would love to see Lieberman on the ticket as I'm a social democrat but republican on everything else.
ExiledInIllinois Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 The abortion issue is just oh so important when picking a political candidate. You only have two viable... So pick one. Sorry it isn't PerfectoLand.
outsidethebox Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 For OBAMA.... " At the moment of conception". He sold himself to the evangelicals like a two dollar whore. Add to that the fact that he wants a back door income tax increase on anyone who has an employer paid health insurance policy worth a damn, and it's Obama all the way. That whole meeting with "Pastor Rick " or whatever that idiot calls himself was a joke. Religious test for office, anyone? I liked Obama's answer to that ridiculous question, though. It was essentially like saying "It's out of my area" and is best left to the INDIVIDUAL to decide. Some people get uncomfortable with that though, they need a "guiding light" or something... just a quick question for you Boatdrinks, are you for or against the death penalty?
Albany,n.y. Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 Things have changed so much since abortion was illegal, many people either are too young to know or have forgotten why there was a push to legalize it. Back when it was illegal, women who had money could travel out of the country and have safe abortions. Women who couldn't afford it played Russian Roulette with their lives, some not surviving an abortion as a result. That's the real reason for the push to legalize abortion-women were dying. Now there's more to the story-back in the days before Roe v Wade, our society would stigmatize both woman & child who were the result of an unmarried pregnancy, this doesn't seem to be as much of an issue these days as it did 40-50 years ago. What was once called a "bastard", is now "the child of a single mother". So the urgency to avoid being ostracized by society is somewhat of a moot point. Also, before the pill, birth control was a lot less effective, another reason the issue is quite different today. Plus there is now the morning after pill. Whenever the issue comes up, I remember the women who either couldn't afford another child or didn't want to be stigmatized and died as a result. I really can't say what the effect would be if there was no place in the USA where abortion was legal. That would be the only true test since if it was legal in a few states, those states would have women seeking abortions going there. Since both society & science have changed so much, the issue is quite different than when the politician from the souther tier cast the deciding vote to make abortion legal in NYS.
SD Jarhead Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 You know what, I'd be inclined to agree with you. However, one's stance on the abortion issue is a pretty good window into their worldview. Those who are vehemently against it are usually religious wackos who want to control the freedoms of others and oppose all that do not conform with their "religion". Very scary stuff. As a male, I do not feel as though I should have any say in in the matter. Women should decide ultimately. Will I ever personally need an abortion? No. Do I care about the "issue"? Not really, it's just an indicator of how one's mind works or doesn't. That's McCain in a nutshell.
Boatdrinks Posted August 24, 2008 Author Posted August 24, 2008 just a quick question for you Boatdrinks, are you for or against the death penalty? I would lean toward against it in most cases. I would say it might be applicable only if the entire crime was caught on video.Otherwise there are just too many variables and chances for error. Not to mention being more expensive to apply than lifetime imprisonment. That said, if you are trying to compare abortion vs death penalty, well there is no comparison. A pregnant woman's decision to end a pregnancy is completely different from prosecution and punishment for a crime. There is no error involved. She either wants to or she doesn't. It is her body, ultimately.
In-A-Gadda-Levitre Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 Not to mention being more expensive to apply than lifetime imprisonment. at the risk of going way off topic, what does this mean? it costs more to convict and execute a felon than it does to convict, house, feed, and care (to whatever extent the prison system provides...) for the rest of their life? Death Row undoubtedly costs more than the general population, but it's a relatively short period, compared to life behind bars.
Alaska Darin Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 Yeah, abortion is a really important issue facing the country.
Albany,n.y. Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 That's McCain in a nutshell. No, he's just someone pandering to the people he described.
Chilly Posted August 24, 2008 Posted August 24, 2008 You only have two viable... So pick one. Sorry it isn't PerfectoLand. What does abortion have to do with your comment?
Boatdrinks Posted August 25, 2008 Author Posted August 25, 2008 at the risk of going way off topic, what does this mean? it costs more to convict and execute a felon than it does to convict, house, feed, and care (to whatever extent the prison system provides...) for the rest of their life? Death Row undoubtedly costs more than the general population, but it's a relatively short period, compared to life behind bars. Yes, the cost of the legal process, inevitable appeals, etc for a death penalty case actually exceeds the cost of housing the inmate for life. Studies have been done that show this. So from a taxpayer standpoint death is a less economical option.
Buford T. Justice Posted August 25, 2008 Posted August 25, 2008 No one tells Boatdrinks what he can do with his vagina.
Boatdrinks Posted August 25, 2008 Author Posted August 25, 2008 Yeah, abortion is a really important issue facing the country. No Darin. In the grand scheme of things, it isn't. That is my point. Why can't we get economic conservatism AND someone who errs on the side of KEEPING freedoms rather than eliminating them? Politcs and "religion" just don't mix. Politics is and should always be about the bottom line only...the ECONOMIC bottom line. Taxes should be low. Services should be fairly minimal. Necessary programs (i.e. defense) should be funded. Regulation should be fairly restrained. These things all benefit the bottom line. And at the end of the day, legal abortion, gay marriage and other social issues du jour just do not change my paycheck any. Therefore they are OK. This is a free country and as many things as possible ought to remain that way.
SD Jarhead Posted August 25, 2008 Posted August 25, 2008 Maybe McCain should've just said "present" when asked that question...
In-A-Gadda-Levitre Posted August 25, 2008 Posted August 25, 2008 Yes, the cost of the legal process, inevitable appeals, etc for a death penalty case actually exceeds the cost of housing the inmate for life. Studies have been done that show this. So from a taxpayer standpoint death is a less economical option. ok, I hear that, didn't know
John Adams Posted August 25, 2008 Posted August 25, 2008 No Darin. In the grand scheme of things, it isn't. That is my point. Why can't we get economic conservatism AND someone who errs on the side of KEEPING freedoms rather than eliminating them? Politcs and "religion" just don't mix. Politics is and should always be about the bottom line only...the ECONOMIC bottom line. Taxes should be low. Services should be fairly minimal. Necessary programs (i.e. defense) should be funded. Regulation should be fairly restrained. These things all benefit the bottom line. And at the end of the day, legal abortion, gay marriage and other social issues du jour just do not change my paycheck any. Therefore they are OK. This is a free country and as many things as possible ought to remain that way. That's your point--that abortion is not that important an issue? But did you start this thread by saying McCain's abortion stance sealed your vote? Take a deep breath. Collect your thoughts. Try again. McCain is pro-choice and would like to send the abortion question back to states to decide. I disagree but think there are more pressing matters. So, I am sure, does McCain. Obama won't answer conception/life questions because "it's above his pay grade." That's annoyingly evasive, but I still don't care.
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