Federal Gov't is trying make birth control being considered

[justnzane]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/editorial/5935532.html

Redefining abortion

Federal officials considering a rule allowing health care workers to refuse to provide contraceptives

Copyright 2008 Houston Chronicle

Aug. 10, 2008, 11:15PM

 

 

The Bush administration has consistently opposed providing funding for international birth control programs, but until now has not tried to limit the use of contraceptives inside the United States.

 

That could change in the president's final months in office. Health and Human Services officials are considering a draft regulation that would classify most birth control pills, the Plan B emergency contraceptive and intrauterine devices as forms of abortion because they prevent the development of fertilized eggs into fetuses.

 

The rule, which does not require congressional approval, would allow health care workers who object to abortion on moral or religious grounds to refuse to counsel women on their birth control options or supply contraceptives. It would forbid more than half a million health agencies nationwide that receive federal funds from requiring employees to provide such services. Pharmacists could use the rule as a justification for refusing to fill birth control prescriptions, and insurance companies could cite it as a basis for declining to cover the costs.

 

An existing regulation allows health care providers with objections to abortion to abstain from providing it to patients. By extending the definition of abortion to cover contraceptives, federal officials are attempting to create by administrative fiat what would fail by a wide margin in Congress.

 

In fact, the draft rule could void laws in 27 states that require insurance companies to provide birth control coverage for women requesting it. The rule also could counter laws in 14 states requiring that rape victims receive counseling and access to emergency, day-after contraceptives. It would also require federal agencies and states to provide funds for sham family planning clinics that provide women only abstinence counseling.

 

The enactment of such rules would have an immediate impact in Southeast Texas, where state health officials estimate more than half a million women are in need of affordable family planning services. Rochelle Tafolla, a spokeswoman for Planned Parenthood of Houston and Southeast Texas Inc., warns that enactment of the regulation would endanger women's health.

 

According to Tafolla, "In a time when more and more families are uninsured and feeling the financial strain of a bad economy, it's pretty incredible that the Bush administration is actually trying to put up roadblocks for women trying to access basic health care." Planned Parenthood strongly opposes the proposed rule "and will be fighting to preserve women's access to health care information."

 

Planned Parenthood is not alone in its opposition. The American Medical Association, the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists and a bipartisan group of 112 members of Congress have weighed in against the draft regulation.

 

Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama has signed a letter of protest written by a group of U.S. senators. (Republican candidate John McCain has not taken a position.)

 

Health and Human Services officials issued a statement claiming the regulation would not alter existing rules and is simply designed to protect health care workers from discrimination based on their views of certain medical procedures. That ignores the fact that defining some forms of contraception as abortion is a radical departure from the status quo.

 

As with a spate of administrative regulations undermining environmental enforcement that the administration has pushed as its time in office grows short, this one is a payoff to social conservatives who oppose abortion and contraception. Since polls show that an overwhelming percentage of the American people support birth control, such backdoor tactics are the only way such restrictions could be considered, let alone enacted.

 

Justifying these draft rules as an anti-discrimination measure would be laughable, if it weren't so undemocratic and dangerous to American women. If HHS Secretary Michael Leavitt is irresponsible enough to approve the regulation, Congress and the next president should make sure it is short-lived.

 

I don't know about anyone else's stance here, but I think contraceptives are a necessity to our society. I think there is a huge between a contraceptive and an abortion. Regardless of politics about abortion, I think "the pill" is probably one of the best things to happen for society as it prevents those abortions from happening. To take away the preventative measure would ensure more abortions, and to take it away from rape victims is just wrong as they have gone through enough suffering.

 

I want to hear what you guys think.

[Wacka]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/editorial/5935532.html

 

 

I don't know about anyone else's stance here, but I think contraceptives are a necessity to our society. I think there is a huge between a contraceptive and an abortion. Regardless of politics about abortion, I think "the pill" is probably one of the best things to happen for society as it prevents those abortions from happening. To take away the preventative measure would ensure more abortions, and to take it away from rape victims is just wrong as they have gone through enough suffering.

 

I want to hear what you guys think.

 

If you run into a pharmacist that won't dispense it, go to another pharmacy. That simple.

[ieatcrayonz]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/editorial/5935532.html

I think "the pill" is probably one of the best things to happen for society

 

No great society like Greece, or Rome was ever built without it. It is definitely one of the best things to happen in our society. It would really be a great thing for Canada to get someday, IMO but that is a whole other topic.

 

There are so many things to like about the pill but the one I like the best is that it allows people to act without thinking. This is so cool because the less people think, the more money I can make off of them. They sort of get trained to run around looking for their next instantaneous pleasure which definitely helps build great societies because people like me can profit. Then we can create stuff that helps people think even less which means we can profit even more. The trick is to put in enough faulty pills so that some more dumb generations can be born.

 

Other stuff in our society that have helped make it so great include:

 

Movies which allow you to skip books which take way too long to read.

Video games which allow kids to stay inside.

Reality TV which allows us to show the real stars of our society and gives people something to which they can aspire.

Gambling

Booze

 

 

Without these things our society would not be jack. This would mean that people would not want to cure diseases and stuff because why cure a disease if you live in a world without an invention like the pill? You'd be running around all day worrying that you knocked up some chick like John Edwards. Who in the heck wants to live in that kind of world? Nobody. That's who. And if nobody wants to live then why cure diseases? In many ways the pill is the driving force behind everything in our society.

 

I think you have underrated by calling it "one of" the best things to happen in our society. Name one thing more imprtant to our society or any other.

[Boatdrinks]

There are so many things to like about the pill but the one I like the best is that it allows people to act without thinking. This is so cool because the less people think, the more money I can make off of them. They sort of get trained to run around looking for their next instantaneous pleasure which definitely helps build great societies because people like me can profit. Then we can create stuff that helps people think even less which means we can profit even more. The trick is to put in enough faulty pills so that some more dumb generations can be born.

 

 

 

You are quite a tard. Taking the pill IS thinking. Thinking ahead, taking responsibility. You see, MOST sex takes place for pleasure ( I know...pleasure BAD) NOT procreation, contrary to what some backwardass douches want everyone to believe. The point is ALL birth control should be widely available and government should stay out of it. For all you right wingers that appear to want less government intrusion, you seem to have no trouble allowing it into the bedroom. Please return yourself to the dark ages.

[Steely Dan]

If you run into a pharmacist that won't dispense it, go to another pharmacy. That simple.

 

Doctors cannot refuse service to a patient in the vast majority of cases. Why can Pharmacists refuse?

 

There are so many things to like about the pill but the one I like the best is that it allows people to act without thinking. This is so cool because the less people think, the more money I can make off of them. They sort of get trained to run around looking for their next instantaneous pleasure which definitely helps build great societies because people like me can profit. Then we can create stuff that helps people think even less which means we can profit even more. The trick is to put in enough faulty pills so that some more dumb generations can be born.

 

 

 

You are quite a tard. Taking the pill IS thinking. Thinking ahead, taking responsibility. You see, MOST sex takes place for pleasure ( I know...pleasure BAD) NOT procreation, contrary to what some backwardass douches want everyone to believe. The point is ALL birth control should be widely available and government should stay out of it. For all you right wingers that appear to want less government intrusion, you seem to have no trouble allowing it into the bedroom. Please return yourself to the dark ages.

 

Could you explain why the two paragraphs seem to contradict each other?

 

This policy is just another example of douchebaggery by the religious right. This is what the people who voted for Bush got whether they wanted it or not. If you voted for Bush and didn't see this coming you're an idiot.

[Alaska Darin]

If you voted for Bush and didn't see this coming you're an idiot.

Which is why I'm sure you give the same line of credence to people who're afraid Obama and the Democrats are going to tax the crap outta everyone, bloat the federal government with even more social programs that won't work but will cost an arm and a leg, and go after the 2nd Amendment, right?

 

You partisans are such goddamn idiots.

[ieatcrayonz]

You are quite a tard. Taking the pill IS thinking. Thinking ahead, taking responsibility. You see, MOST sex takes place for pleasure ( I know...pleasure BAD) NOT procreation, contrary to what some backwardass douches want everyone to believe. The point is ALL birth control should be widely available and government should stay out of it. For all you right wingers that appear to want less government intrusion, you seem to have no trouble allowing it into the bedroom. Please return yourself to the dark ages.

Reading comprehension much? I am totally stoked that most sex takes place for pleasure. Having sex for pleasure instead of procreation is the single biggest thing that separates us from animals. The pill allows for even more pleasure. This is what I said. This allows me to profit immensely so why would I argue?

 

The only beef I have with the government is that doesn't pay for the pill all of the time for everyone. If you interpret the constitution properly, pleasure is guaranteed under equal protection and posse comitatus which means something pretty vulgar in latin. Therefore government should supply the pill to any man woman or child who wants it. I agree that right wingers are dopes but I don't think they want the government to supply the pill into bedrooms so your other comment confuses me. They are cramping my style on this but want the government out of the bedroom, not in. Personally, I say let 'em in. There are probably some freaks even in government and freaks mean profit.

 

Left wingers confuse me on this too. They want the government to supply the pill to allow for pleasure but don't really advocate the government paying for stuff like Playstation and DVD rentals to also increase pleasure. This is an impediment to me making more profit and it irks me about the left. I am pretty sure it has to do with the hippy influence which was all about pleasure but way too focused on sex and drugs. Hippies are too wasted to be able to react quickly like is needed in Playstation. They are too myopic to see that plasure comes in different forms. You say tomato, I say tomato, so to speak.

 

Dude, anyway, chill out, we agree about most of what you say.

[Chilly]

I don't know about anyone else's stance here, but I think contraceptives are a necessity to our society. I think there is a huge between a contraceptive and an abortion. Regardless of politics about abortion, I think "the pill" is probably one of the best things to happen for society as it prevents those abortions from happening. To take away the preventative measure would ensure more abortions, and to take it away from rape victims is just wrong as they have gone through enough suffering.

 

I want to hear what you guys think.

 

Here is where my non-libertarian side comes out. Allowing people to not dispense essential medication based on some silly view of morality comes at a great cost to society.

 

And yes, the pill is an essential medication. I sure as hell don't want to pay the costs of having many more kids running around, and I don't want to see babies put into situations with people who can't afford it (a much, much bigger wrong than selling someone a contraceptive).

 

Since many human behaviors are based off of convenience, it is conceivable that in the Bible Belt all pharmacies in an area will not sell it, and instead of traveling a ways, people just fore-go it.

[OCinBuffalo]

Here is where my non-libertarian side comes out. Allowing people to not dispense essential medication based on some silly view of morality comes at a great cost to society.

 

And yes, the pill is an essential medication. I sure as hell don't want to pay the costs of having many more kids running around, and I don't want to see babies put into situations with people who can't afford it (a much, much bigger wrong than selling someone a contraceptive).

 

Since many human behaviors are based off of convenience, it is conceivable that in the Bible Belt all pharmacies in an area will not sell it, and instead of traveling a ways, people just fore-go it.

Well, since we are talking "which wrong is more right"...or something along those lines, not sure when craynz is around, the simple fact is:

 

We have undeniable proof that the crime rate has gone down in direct correlation with the propagation of use of contraceptives and abortion.

 

Those are the facts. I don't care if anybody doesn't like it, or if it offends bible-thumpers. The facts are what they are, and no study can contradict this clear relationship.

 

Now, if you want to make the point that 80% of Planned Parenthood offices are in traditionally minority neighborhoods, well, that's a whole different argument. I'm just curious: How does Planned Parenthood's obvious bias against minorities wash with a supposed "tolerant" liberal mindset? Again, the facts I have laid down are undeniable, so please, spare us the BS. The fact is that Planned Parenthood was founded by a lady, Singer, who clearly stated that unwanted minority pregnancies, called "poor" a the time, were the target.

 

Seriously, is there anything more intolerant than limiting the birth rate of African-Americans or Latinos at a rate of 8 to 1 over whites? If this keeps up, there won't hardly be black people in this country. Was that the original intent? It makes me wonder....but then again, the crime rate is down all over the country...not sure how I am supposed to feel about this.

[PastaJoe]

Well, since we are talking "which wrong is more right"...or something along those lines, not sure when craynz is around, the simple fact is:

 

We have undeniable proof that the crime rate has gone down in direct correlation with the propagation of use of contraceptives and abortion.

 

Those are the facts. I don't care if anybody doesn't like it, or if it offends bible-thumpers. The facts are what they are, and no study can contradict this clear relationship.

 

Now, if you want to make the point that 80% of Planned Parenthood offices are in traditionally minority neighborhoods, well, that's a whole different argument. I'm just curious: How does Planned Parenthood's obvious bias against minorities wash with a supposed "tolerant" liberal mindset? Again, the facts I have laid down are undeniable, so please, spare us the BS. The fact is that Planned Parenthood was founded by a lady, Singer, who clearly stated that unwanted minority pregnancies, called "poor" a the time, were the target.

 

Seriously, is there anything more intolerant than limiting the birth rate of African-Americans or Latinos at a rate of 8 to 1 over whites? If this keeps up, there won't hardly be black people in this country. Was that the original intent? It makes me wonder....but then again, the crime rate is down all over the country...not sure how I am supposed to feel about this.

 

 

And many of the founders of our country were slave owners, but that doesn't mean that's the current mindset. Planned Parenthood is mostly in economically poor neighborhoods, which in many cases happen to be populated by blacks. They're there because many people living in those areas couldn't otherwise afford proper reproductive healthcare, it has nothing to do with their ethnicity. And nobody is forcing anyone to use birth control, just offering it as an option.

[OCinBuffalo]

And many of the founders of our country were slave owners, but that doesn't mean that's the current mindset. Planned Parenthood is mostly in economically poor neighborhoods, which in many cases happen to be populated by blacks. They're there because many people living in those areas couldn't otherwise afford proper reproductive healthcare, it has nothing to do with their ethnicity. And nobody is forcing anyone to use birth control, just offering it as an option.

See, that's the point, are we talking "poor" or are we talking "not-white". I'm not so sure. There is plenty of writings, or so I have been told, from (I think it's actually Sanger) that point to the clear target being "blacks" but without actually saying it. It's like the concept of a limit in math, as you approach the limit, but never touch it, what happens?

 

Again, I see the results = less crime, and that makes less inclined to care one way or the other. But, there's this pesky thought in the back of my head that says: "fine, a-hole, but at what real cost?" or "what does this really say about our society"?

 

To be sure, these real are questions, and I sure as hell don't have the answers. I am perhaps the least qualified person in the country to speak about this issue, and, like I said, this makes me wholly unsure. As far as I am concerned this whole problem centers on women and therefore should get solved where everything else that center's on women does = the girls bathroom. I'm only kidding, kind of. I honestly would have no problem with them all getting together in a room, figuring out what they want to do, and then telling us what the new policy is. It's not like it doesn't happen a lot anyway. But somehow it's like every other issue I have dealt with on a personal level with women, they ask for your opinion only so that can tell you why you are wrong. What's the fing point? This is why I try to have as little opinion as possible on stuff like this, because no matter what I say I'm going to be wrong anyway.

 

Of course I can see the funny sides of this, but then again, I think if you got Ann Coulter and Oprah in the same room and told them we expected results in a reasonable amount of time, sh_t would get done.

[Ramius]

Way to go gubmint! WooHoo! Lets ignore the little fact that the pill can be prescribed for other uses besides contraception, such as treatment of hormone imbalances, severe acne, and endometriosis. Fuggin idiots. As someone said above, i dont care what the hell your moral standards are. If someone comes in to fill their prescription, you give them the little box of pills. Theres nothing immoral and you are not going to hell for handing someone their pills that were prescribed to them.

 

And when it comes to insurance companies, you tell me what makes more sense. Paying for a $300-400 per year prescription, or paying medical costs for a baby?

[Fingon]

Why should a Pharmacist be required to dispense birth control pills? He has a constitutional right to freedom of religion, and birth control pills are non-essential medication; they do not treat a disease or save a life.

[Fingon]

Way to go gubmint! WooHoo! Lets ignore the little fact that the pill can be prescribed for other uses besides contraception, such as treatment of hormone imbalances, severe acne, and endometriosis. Fuggin idiots. As someone said above, i dont care what the hell your moral standards are. If someone comes in to fill their prescription, you give them the little box of pills. Theres nothing immoral and you are not going to hell for handing someone their pills that were prescribed to them.

 

And when it comes to insurance companies, you tell me what makes more sense. Paying for a $300-400 per year prescription, or paying medical costs for a baby?

Should a doctor be required to perform a sex change if it will help eliminate the patients depression?

[Ramius]

Why should a Pharmacist be required to dispense birth control pills? He has a constitutional right to freedom of religion, and birth control pills are non-essential medication; they do not treat a disease or save a life.

 

A pharmacist does have freedom of religion. A pharmacist does not have the right to impose his/her religious beliefs upon someone else. A pharmacist is there to provide a service for people. So you are saying its ok to deny service to someone based off of religion? Dangerous precedent there.

 

And again, how is handing someone a box of pills infringing on your religious freedoms?

 

EDIT: apparently you missed my line above on the other uses of a birth control pill prescription.

[ieatcrayonz]

Why should a Pharmacist be required to dispense birth control pills? He has a constitutional right to freedom of religion, and birth control pills are non-essential medication; they do not treat a disease or save a life.

There is nowhere else to go for prescriptions. It is not like they can be ordered via mail or anything. The local pharmacist should not be the person who decides everyones health.

[ieatcrayonz]

Way to go gubmint! WooHoo! Lets ignore the little fact that the pill can be prescribed for other uses besides contraception, such as treatment of hormone imbalances, severe acne, and endometriosis.

Dude, I agree with your end result but come on. If you have zitz just buy a tube of Clearasil. Don't come crying on a message board.

[JK2000]

There is nowhere else to go for prescriptions. It is not like they can be ordered via mail or anything. The local pharmacist should not be the person who decides everyones health.

 

How about if you're a "deeply religious person" you don't enter into a profession that you believe compromises your religious beliefs in the first place. What's next, Muslim bartenders who refuse to serve alcohol?

[OCinBuffalo]

How about if you're a "deeply religious person" you don't enter into a profession that you believe compromises your religious beliefs in the first place. What's next, Muslim bartenders who refuse to serve alcohol?

Hey if we keep on the "tolerance train" do you really think that's going to really be that far-fetched? As if there isn't an ACLU law team preparing the briefs as we speak? Muslims already have enjoyed a "more equal" position legally for a while now. How come South Park gets to F with Jesus but gets censored if they try to do a simple picture of Mohamed?

 

I am almost certain that sooner or later in my travels I will encounter the very thing you are talking about a some s-hole hotel owned by our friends from the Middle East. We have to stay in the crap joints more often that the good ones in what I do. Hell, I already got in trouble once for bringing my beer into a cab, and the guy couldn't care less about open container or any legal issue, he didn't want the booze in the cab.

 

I'll bet you a penny we see some sort of lunacy like this on a crap show like Geraldo in the next year.

[JK2000]

How come South Park gets to F with Jesus but gets censored if they try to do a simple picture of Mohamed?

 

Ask Theo Van Gogh........................