Peters may be willing to sit all season

[PromoTheRobot]

Anyone who's been to practice and watched Langston Walker at LT today knows Peters' leverage grows with each day. Walker's athleticism is a shred of what Peters offers and will not neutralize edge rushers. It's understood this was Walker's first full day at LT, but his lateral movement isn't there for a OLT.

 

There is an amazing domino effect which taking place, with Walker now changing positions and a career backup inserted at RT. I think the team's frustration is born out of the realization that they cannot yield to the new deal demands for principle (and pride) reasons, yet not doing so means their team (at least on offense) will not nearly be as successful.

 

The team may need to relent sooner than they imagined, although maybe it'll take a few pre-season games to impress on fans what the coaching staff knows right now: that Walker's move to LT will be a rough transition for him, the QB, and the entire offense.

Have you actually been to practice and know for a fact Walker and Chambers are doing poorly? I don't believe it. I think it's the wishful thinking of Chicken Little fans that hope the sky falls on this franchise.

 

As for who has the leverage, I assure you it's the Bills. They will take their chances playing without Peters. What's Peters have? He has 3 years left on a contract. If he fails to report by August 8, then this season doesn't count. He still owes the Bills three years. He can sit out ten years and he will still owe the Bills 3 years, but he will owe the Bills millions in fines. In the meantime, what does all this sitting do for his value as an "elite" left tackle? This guy just came off surgery and he won't let his team take a look at him? Is he hiding something?

 

Peters may still be injured and he's trying to scam the Bills into a fat contract with a big guarantee. All I can say is I'm glad we have people like Brandon running the Bills, not some of the panic-stricken pansies who wet their drawers when a player makes a threat. Peters is screwing himself. The Bills are 100% in the right here. If Peters wants a new deal...just show up. That's why I think he's still injured.

 

PTR

[BuffOrange]

While it would be nice if Peters took the same approach that Kyle Williams and Chris Kelsay showed, there's a key difference here. Williams and Kelsay SUCK.

 

Gold

[BillsVet]

I kinda feel as though the spread of this type of mindset ( if occurring in the minds of the players) WILL result in a domino effect, but if the will of the players is strong they should be able to absorb the change and work with it. With that said, for one player to be in a position to affect an entire team in this way speaks to the need for change in the way the NFL does it's contracts.

 

Superior play at LT is almost a necessity, it's not the financial landscape, it's the specialization of the offensive and defensive line positions.

 

 

Have you actually been to practice and know for a fact Walker and Chambers are doing poorly? I don't believe it. I think it's the wishful thinking of Chicken Little fans that hope the sky falls on this franchise.

 

As for who has the leverage, I assure you it's the Bills. They will take their chances playing without Peters. What's Peters have? He has 3 years left on a contract. If he fails to report by August 8, then this season doesn't count. He still owes the Bills three years. He can sit out ten years and he will still owe the Bills 3 years, but he will owe the Bills millions in fines. In the meantime, what does all this sitting do for his value as an "elite" left tackle? This guy just came off surgery and he won't let his team take a look at him? Is he hiding something?

 

Peters may still be injured and he's trying to scam the Bills into a fat contract with a big guarantee. All I can say is I'm glad we have people like Brandon running the Bills, not some of the panic-stricken pansies that wet their drawers when a players makes a threat. Peters is screwing himself. The Bills are 100% in the right here. If Peters wants a new deal...just show up. That's why I think he's still injured.

 

PTR

 

I've been to practice, today as a matter of fact. And I noted in my previous post that it was Walker's first day at LT so I didn't expect to see him dominate. The conclusion any knowledgeable fan can reach is that Walker isn't the type of player who succeeds at the most demanding physical position on the OL. Chambers is certainly not starting grade, and this holdout has the potential to significantly affect the success of the entire offense. Offenses take time to gel, and this training camp is no different. The defense is rounding into form, and has given the offense problems. That said, I think missing their best OL is a bigger problem than most fans realize.

 

Peters' issues with the front office and vice versa do not fit into the minds of blue collar fans like most of us here. Most fans see it as pure greed and the inability of a player to fulfill a contract. It's far more than that, and in the business of pro football, players know they've got a small window. For the fortunate few who have superior talent, it can be taken away at any moment. I think Peters oughta report, but he's not, and everyone knows why.

 

Despite what anyone says, Peters is healthy. It doesn't take 5 months to come back from a hernia, and the idea he's hurt and hiding in the shadows at home is the biggest conspiracy theory I've heard in a long time.

[yall]

Superior play at LT is almost a necessity, it's not the financial landscape, it's the specialization of the offensive and defensive line positions.

 

 

 

 

I've been to practice, today as a matter of fact. And I noted in my previous post that it was Walker's first day at LT so I didn't expect to see him dominate. The conclusion any knowledgeable fan can reach is that Walker isn't the type of player who succeeds at the most demanding physical position on the OL. Chambers is certainly not starting grade, and this holdout has the potential to significantly affect the success of the entire offense. Offenses take time to gel, and this training camp is no different. The defense is rounding into form, and has given the offense problems. That said, I think missing their best OL is a bigger problem than most fans realize.

 

Peters' issues with the front office and vice versa do not fit into the minds of blue collar fans like most of us here. Most fans see it as pure greed and the inability of a player to fulfill a contract. It's far more than that, and in the business of pro football, players know they've got a small window. For the fortunate few who have superior talent, it can be taken away at any moment. I think Peters oughta report, but he's not, and everyone knows why.

 

Despite what anyone says, Peters is healthy. It doesn't take 5 months to come back from a hernia, and the idea he's hurt and hiding in the shadows at home is the biggest conspiracy theory I've heard in a long time.

 

How can you be sure?

[Mickey]

Anyone who's been to practice and watched Langston Walker at LT today knows Peters' leverage grows with each day. Walker's athleticism is a shred of what Peters offers and will not neutralize edge rushers. It's understood this was Walker's first full day at LT, but his lateral movement isn't there for a OLT.

 

There is an amazing domino effect which taking place, with Walker now changing positions and a career backup inserted at RT. I think the team's frustration is born out of the realization that they cannot yield to the new deal demands for principle (and pride) reasons, yet not doing so means their team (at least on offense) will not nearly be as successful.

 

The team may need to relent sooner than they imagined, although maybe it'll take a few pre-season games to impress on fans what the coaching staff knows right now: that Walker's move to LT will be a rough transition for him, the QB, and the entire offense.

What is it that pride goeth before?

[VOR]

Despite what anyone says, Peters is healthy. It doesn't take 5 months to come back from a hernia, and the idea he's hurt and hiding in the shadows at home is the biggest conspiracy theory I've heard in a long time.

The only assumption that can be made from this peculiar scenario are that Peters is "healthy" but the groin injury has robbed him of some athletic ability (a la Spikes and his achilles injury) or that Peters has lost his desire to play football. Expecting to be paid a ton of money without showing up, much less proving you're back to your old self, is silly.

[Chandler#81]

Superior play at LT is almost a necessity, it's not the financial landscape, it's the specialization of the offensive and defensive line positions.

 

 

 

 

I've been to practice, today as a matter of fact. And I noted in my previous post that it was Walker's first day at LT so I didn't expect to see him dominate. The conclusion any knowledgeable fan can reach is that Walker isn't the type of player who succeeds at the most demanding physical position on the OL. Chambers is certainly not starting grade, and this holdout has the potential to significantly affect the success of the entire offense. Offenses take time to gel, and this training camp is no different. The defense is rounding into form, and has given the offense problems. That said, I think missing their best OL is a bigger problem than most fans realize.

 

Peters' issues with the front office and vice versa do not fit into the minds of blue collar fans like most of us here. Most fans see it as pure greed and the inability of a player to fulfill a contract. It's far more than that, and in the business of pro football, players know they've got a small window. For the fortunate few who have superior talent, it can be taken away at any moment. I think Peters oughta report, but he's not, and everyone knows why.

 

Despite what anyone says, Peters is healthy. It doesn't take 5 months to come back from a hernia, and the idea he's hurt and hiding in the shadows at home is the biggest conspiracy theory I've heard in a long time.

 

Fine, DeBunk it then.

[colin]

so really (VOR i think talked about it) in 8 days he is up a creek? if he doesn't come forward by then i suspect he's not right. i really have this feeling he's not healthy. if his career is over (or likely to be over on one more injury) we are smart to not pay him.

 

remember tony boselli?

[R. Rich]

The top of the list changed in a hurry the past couple years after a rather long time with the same names at the top. The people who are gaffawing about where Peters ranks don't seem to realize that. After Ogden, Pace and Jones entered the league there were a lot of years where the top OT's weren't really "great" prospects, didn't live up to the hype or just plain flamed out.

 

 

Agreed. The overall league wide quality of LTs since Ogden, Pace, and Jones entered the league has been below the level of those 3. Peters is quickly rising to the top of the list, as is Joe Thomas after a masterful first season. There's still some wily veterans out there @ the top of their game though, like Matt Light in New England and Flozell Adams in Dallas.

[krazykat]

Agreed. The overall league wide quality of LTs since Ogden, Pace, and Jones entered the league has been below the level of those 3. Peters is quickly rising to the top of the list, as is Joe Thomas after a masterful first season. There's still some wily veterans out there @ the top of their game though, like Matt Light in New England and Flozell Adams in Dallas.

Unfortunately this league doesn't work on what's fair and right though. Perceptions often if not usually lead the way. Take Schobel for example. He's not worth that last contract we gave him, but the perceptions were, and correctly so, that he needed to be paid more than Kelsay questioning whether Kelsay was worth the huge contract that he got. I don't think so.

 

What the Bills need to do regarding this is to look at the dropoff in play by having Peters replaced and what the line looks like after that. Not that what they think has any credibility anymore, but if they think that and want to hinge their futures in Buffalo on the notion that this line isn't much different, or enough to warrant a restructuring/raise for Peters, than it is now, then they can take that gamble.

 

If not, then they need to get Peters in here.

 

I personally think that Peters is a little bit overrated. He seems to have played better in '06 than in '07. But he's still the best lineman that we have. Dockery and Walker are also overrated. And before anyone jumps on me for suggesting that, you don't trail the league in ball movement and 1st down conversions with a solid line regardless of who your RB and QB are.

 

Anyway, I only said that to suggest that maybe the line isn't much different without Peters. Who knows. I can't imagine that to be the case though.

[Ramius]

Agreed. The overall league wide quality of LTs since Ogden, Pace, and Jones entered the league has been below the level of those 3. Peters is quickly rising to the top of the list, as is Joe Thomas after a masterful first season. There's still some wily veterans out there @ the top of their game though, like Matt Light in New England and Flozell Adams in Dallas.

 

Good post Rich. I was going to point out Joe Thomas as well as one of the young up and coming LT's in the league. While we are at a changing of the guard there are still some young guys that are looking like they are the real deal. Along with Peters and Thomas, i'll toss in Marcus McNeill's name as well.

[colin]

Good post Rich. I was going to point out Joe Thomas as well as one of the young up and coming LT's in the league. While we are at a changing of the guard there are still some young guys that are looking like they are the real deal. Along with Peters and Thomas, i'll toss in Marcus McNeill's name as well.

 

kid in NO had a couple good seasons too, made a pro bowl.

 

peters is sick, but this board has gotten nuts over LT's, they can be schemed around. if we are ok at lt but good overall as a line and our playmakers are solid, we can do well. like the ny giants of last season.

[K-9]

Unfortunately this league doesn't work on what's fair and right though. Perceptions often if not usually lead the way. Take Schobel for example. He's not worth that last contract we gave him, but the perceptions were, and correctly so, that he needed to be paid more than Kelsay questioning whether Kelsay was worth the huge contract that he got. I don't think so.

What the Bills need to do regarding this is to look at the dropoff in play by having Peters replaced and what the line looks like after that. Not that what they think has any credibility anymore, but if they think that and want to hinge their futures in Buffalo on the notion that this line isn't much different, or enough to warrant a restructuring/raise for Peters, than it is now, then they can take that gamble.

 

If not, then they need to get Peters in here.

 

I personally think that Peters is a little bit overrated. He seems to have played better in '06 than in '07. But he's still the best lineman that we have. Dockery and Walker are also overrated. And before anyone jumps on me for suggesting that, you don't trail the league in ball movement and 1st down conversions with a solid line regardless of who your RB and QB are.

 

Anyway, I only said that to suggest that maybe the line isn't much different without Peters. Who knows. I can't imagine that to be the case though.

 

Whether or not you, me, or anyone else thinks Schobel is 'worth it' or not is NOT the point. And it has NOTHING to do with Kelsey. Schobel got fair market contract value based on his production as a starting DE in the league at the time he signed his deal. If you question his production I suggest you compare him to the other big money DEs over the last 5 years. Including the bar setter (at the time anyway), Dwight Freeney.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[R. Rich]

Good post Rich. I was going to point out Joe Thomas as well as one of the young up and coming LT's in the league. While we are at a changing of the guard there are still some young guys that are looking like they are the real deal. Along with Peters and Thomas, i'll toss in Marcus McNeill's name as well.

 

While McNeill did make the Pro Bowl last year, it was only 'cause of Ogden's injury. I think he took a small step back in play, but I do think he's a very good young OL, as long as he can stay healthy.

 

Speaking of staying healthy...

 

kid in NO had a couple good seasons too, made a pro bowl.

 

He's got the tools to be a dominant OT for years to come, but he's been struggling w/ injuries for the past 5 years.

 

I hope all of these guys usher in a new era of dominant tackles. It would be nice to see guys like Travelle Wharton, D'Brickashaw Ferguson, and even Levi Jones (if he's done getting sucker punched @ casinos) step up to their level.

[krazykat]

Whether or not you, me, or anyone else thinks Schobel is 'worth it' or not is NOT the point. And it has NOTHING to do with Kelsey. Schobel got fair market contract value based on his production as a starting DE in the league at the time he signed his deal. If you question his production I suggest you compare him to the other big money DEs over the last 5 years. Including the bar setter (at the time anyway), Dwight Freeney.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Schobel got fair market value for his past play. You think he earned his contract last year for all of that guaranteed money he's already pocketed? Low standards if so.

 

Freeney's still in his prime, Schobel's out of his.

 

I'd suggest you compare apples to apples.

[K-9]

Schobel got fair market value for his past play. You think he earned his contract last year for all of that guaranteed money he's already pocketed? Low standards if so.

 

Freeney's still in his prime, Schobel's out of his.

 

I'd suggest you compare apples to apples.

 

You can't quantify 'prime' in any way. But if you wish to try, you go right ahead.

 

As for apples to apples, that's what the Bills did when they negotiated his deal. The numbers he posted merited the contract. What happened AFTER that is immaterial (i.e. last season). BTW and at the risk of repeating myself, the DE responsibilities and schemes were altered last year due to the injuries and the players playing behind them.

 

He's had FAR more success at his position, is FAR more polished at his position, and was willing to bust his ass in camp to prove his case. More than I can say for Peters. Far more. Talk about apples and oranges.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Ramius]

While McNeill did make the Pro Bowl last year, it was only 'cause of Ogden's injury. I think he took a small step back in play, but I do think he's a very good young OL, as long as he can stay healthy.

 

Speaking of staying healthy...

 

 

 

He's got the tools to be a dominant OT for years to come, but he's been struggling w/ injuries for the past 5 years.

 

I hope all of these guys usher in a new era of dominant tackles. It would be nice to see guys like Travelle Wharton, D'Brickashaw Ferguson, and even Levi Jones (if he's done getting sucker punched @ casinos) step up to their level.

 

I still think one of the more underrated tackles in the league is Jordan Gross.

[Mickey]

Don't forget that he ended the season on IR and nobody has seen him since. I think that the injury/offseason surgery, the fact that he has 3 years left, and the fact that he isn't showing up for mandatory camps is enough for the Bills to want to play hardball with him. If it was my money, I'd want to see him perform after that surgery prior to giving him the huge contract that his position historically deserves.

 

He could be a completely different person after the surgery, although it is unlikely. I think the Bills have every right to hedge their risk of losing millions of dollars by telling him that he needs to be at camp prior to negotiations.

Interesting. Do we really know that the team has no information on how the surgery went or how his recovery is going? They don't need a face to face exam to do find that out.

 

It would be reasonable for the Bills to say we will pay you X but we need you to pass a physical first. I can't imagine any player not agreeing to that but I don't think they are even close to that point. Obviously, a player who won't agree to having his condition verified has something to hide. I can't even think of an example in recent memory where a player refused such a request.

 

The bottom line is we just don't know what is really going on. The team did some public complaining but Jason hasn't which I think is to his credit. The whole thing is frustrating but its early yet. Plenty of time to get him in here and ready for the opener, I hope.

[MikeInABQ]

Didn't Michael Vick get a 10 year deal back in 2002?

I think you're thinking sentence, not deal.

[Mickey]

I have no doubt that if he showed up and started practicing, he would get a new contract immediately. The Bills just want to check him out to make sure he is 100% healthy and ready to go before hey pay him $8 million or more. Not a terrible request in my opinion.

 

EVERY OTHER GUY IS HERE.......EVEN THE ONES WITHOUT CONTRACTS FOR NEXT SEASON!!!! If he comes into camp and is ready to go, the Bills WILL PAY HIM! Show some loyalty to the team and the team will pay him!

If true, that would be pretty interesting but I haven't seen anything which shows what you assert to be true: that the team has committed to a large raise, has communicated that to him and placed just one contingency- that being to verify he is in playing condition.

 

Is there some article out there I have missed which says the team has agreed to pay him 8 million or more but just wants to verify his condition and he has refused? Just trying to sort out facts from guesses.