The Pats In the Future

[MattM]

Found this information while looking up our FAs for these years, but if you follow the story below, it looks like the Pats really have about a two year window here with their current group. Between the hordes hitting FA (especially after 2009 below and combine that with Brady, Moss, Maroney and Light following after the 2010 season) and the age of some of their core (Bruschi, Seau, Harrison, new addition 31 year old CB Bryant and Vrabel come to mind, but so do Moss and even Brady and Adalius Thomas (both 31) to some extent), Pioli has his work cut out for him between now and then, especially since I understand that they're not exactly awash in cap money, some of which will probably become dead cap when guys like Harrison retire in the next year or two as well. Even better news is look at their 2006 and 2007 drafts and you'll see they've had one starter (Maroney) out of those two entire drafts--for ex., last year's draft netted Brandon "I'm Looking More and More Like a Bust Each Day" Merriweather and no one else who contributed at all (1 guy actually made the team--that's it, I believe).

 

Our FO looks pretty smart to me, actually, in terms of extending our guys now--NE may do the same with some of these folks, but that's a long list, including a lot of their starters (especially lineman on both sides of the ball).

 

The other lesson to me in all of this is that despite the lip service he pays it, no way in H-E-double hockey sticks does Kraft not want an uncapped league. That's what this says to me--that's the only way he'll keep this group together after 2009, IMHO is for 2010 to be uncapped, restrictions or no on that (and looking at this list makes me wonder if all of those new rules like "6 years experience before FA eligibility" were written with protecting his team in mind). If his drafts keep crapping out, he can always buy a chance at another ring.....

 

Here's the list of players per KFFL who will be FAs after the 2009 season:

Pos Player Name FA Status Previous Team Current Team

RB Kevin Faulk UFA New England Patriots

WR Sam Aiken UFA New England Patriots

WR Chad Jackson UFA New England Patriots

TE David Thomas UFA New England Patriots

TE Benjamin Watson UFA New England Patriots

PK Stephen Gostkowski UFA New England Patriots

OG Logan Mankins UFA New England Patriots

OG Stephen Neal UFA New England Patriots

OG Billy Yates UFA New England Patriots

OT Ryan O'Callaghan UFA New England Patriots

OL Nick Kaczur UFA New England Patriots

DL Jarvis Green UFA New England Patriots

DL Richard Seymour UFA New England Patriots

DL Le Kevin Smith UFA New England Patriots

DL Vince Wilfork UFA New England Patriots

LB Mike Vrabel UFA New England Patriots

CB Ellis Hobbs UFA New England Patriots

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

The one thing they'll always have going for them is Tom Brady. As long as he is healthy and starting, they're going to be tough to beat.

[generaLee83]

The one thing they'll always have going for them is Tom Brady. As long as he is healthy and starting, they're going to be tough to beat.

 

Well that and they will always be more than willing to find new and effective ways to cheat.

 

Their current defensive group has been lousy on paper for several seasons now but somehow just somehow they manage to keep on winning.

[H2o]

Well that and they will always be more than willing to find new and effective ways to cheat.

 

Their current defensive group has been lousy on paper for several seasons now but somehow just somehow they manage to keep on winning.

 

When your offense is better than 90% of the NFL, you'll have that.

[MattM]

When your offense is better than 90% of the NFL, you'll have that.

 

That's really only been this past season--their team was a bit more balanced in prior years. Last season's O did an awful lot to mask the D's weaknesses--I do think that their D's high ranking statistically had more to do with things like time of possession being way in their favor and playing against teams made one-dimensional by playing from behind all the time. Take some of that away through other D's catching onto their O, subtract some key personnel they've lost this offseason (Samuel, Colvin and Gay come to mind) and add a year in age to some of their Sr. Citizens Brigade and this team ain't as unbeatable as some folks (chief among them, Pats fans) like to think, even this year.....

[H2o]

That's really only been this past season--their team was a bit more balanced in prior years. Last season's O did an awful lot to mask the D's weaknesses--I do think that their D's high ranking statistically had more to do with things like time of possession being way in their favor and playing against teams made one-dimensional by playing from behind all the time. Take some of that away through other D's catching onto their O, subtract some key personnel they've lost this offseason (Samuel, Colvin and Gay come to mind) and add a year in age to some of their Sr. Citizens Brigade and this team ain't as unbeatable as some folks (chief among them, Pats fans) like to think, even this year.....

 

You're right. Let's not forget the the major sports networks that hype up the Patsies EVERY YEAR, since they won their first SB. They're the ones who try to make it seem like the Pats are going to win every year. I think that last year was the beginning of the downfall. I think the Giants gave everyone a blueprint to follow and the ones who remain will never forget the 18-1 season.

[PromoTheRobot]

The Pats are bulletproof because:

a) most of their current players will sign at below value just to stay.

b) most free agents will sign below value because they're convinced its an automatic ring.

c) and they cheat.

 

Predicting the end of the Pats* is tiring. They way to end their run is on the field.

 

PTR

[BillnutinHouston]

Even better news is look at their 2006 and 2007 drafts and you'll see they've had one starter (Maroney) out of those two entire drafts

 

 

Another example of how faulty this is (number of starters) as a measuring stick for the quality of a team's drafts. Gee, the Bills draft lots of starters and the Patriots don't - I wonder why? Maybe because the current Patriots' current on-the-field product is superior to that of the Bills? Wouldn't you agree that over the last 5 years, if you were a draftee for the Bills your chances of starting right away would be much higher than if you were drafted by the Pats?

[BuffaloWings]

The Pats are bulletproof because:

a) most of their current players will sign at below value just to stay.

b) most free agents will sign below value because they're convinced its an automatic ring.

c) and they cheat.

 

Predicting the end of the Pats* is tiring. They way to end their run is on the field.

 

PTR

Just like predicting the end of any "dynasty" is tiring. I think it's safe to say that every other team is gunning to beat them and fans of every other team hate their guts (see: post-2000 New York Yankees).

 

And I couldn't agree more with PTR....beat them on the field to shut them up and end their run.

[MattM]

Another example of how faulty this is (number of starters) as a measuring stick for the quality of a team's drafts. Gee, the Bills draft lots of starters and the Patriots don't - I wonder why? Maybe because the current Patriots' current on-the-field product is superior to that of the Bills? Wouldn't you agree that over the last 5 years, if you were a draftee for the Bills your chances of starting right away would be much higher than if you were drafted by the Pats?

 

I agree to some extent with your post, but look at the quality of players they've picked the last two years and you'll see that they flat out stunk--only two from last year even made the team. While I understand that to some extent that is because the Pats are stacked talent-wise, more than two players out of a draft class should at least make the team don't you think?

[hit and marshawn]

I agree to some extent with your post, but look at the quality of players they've picked the last two years and you'll see that they flat out stunk--only two from last year even made the team. While I understand that to some extent that is because the Pats are stacked talent-wise, more than two players out of a draft class should at least make the team don't you think?

plus over the past few years they have scooped up some of the backups from the bills, which may show that we are indeed getting better at scouting talent

[Johnny Coli]

Just like predicting the end of any "dynasty" is tiring. I think it's safe to say that every other team is gunning to beat them and fans of every other team hate their guts (see: post-2000 New York Yankees).

 

And I couldn't agree more with PTR....beat them on the field to shut them up and end their run.

Dynasties don't choke in big games. The Shift-8's haven't won anything in four years. They won a championship in 01/02, didn't make the playoffs in 02/03, won the next two, and have gagged in the playoffs since. Hardly a dynasty. If anything, I'll give them props for being dominant for the 18 months spanning the 03/04 and 04/05 seasons. But calling them a dynasty is an insult to real sports dynasties, especially in light of the fact that they have been cheating the whole time.

[PromoTheRobot]

Dynasties don't choke in big games. The Shift-8's haven't won anything in four years. They won a championship in 01/02, didn't make the playoffs in 02/03, won the next two, and have gagged in the playoffs since. Hardly a dynasty. If anything, I'll give them props for being dominant for the 18 months spanning the 03/04 and 04/05 seasons. But calling them a dynasty is an insult to real sports dynasties, especially in light of the fact that they have been cheating the whole time.

It's up to all NFL fans to never let the Pats* off the hook for being scum. I suggest all fans carry (*) asterisk posters to all Pats* games.

 

PTR

[John Adams]

Dynasties don't choke in big games. The Shift-8's haven't won anything in four years. They won a championship in 01/02, didn't make the playoffs in 02/03, won the next two, and have gagged in the playoffs since. Hardly a dynasty. If anything, I'll give them props for being dominant for the 18 months spanning the 03/04 and 04/05 seasons. But calling them a dynasty is an insult to real sports dynasties, especially in light of the fact that they have been cheating the whole time.

 

If only the Bills were such a non-Dynasty.

[Cotton Fitzsimmons]

Dynasties don't choke in big games. The Shift-8's haven't won anything in four years. They won a championship in 01/02, didn't make the playoffs in 02/03, won the next two, and have gagged in the playoffs since. Hardly a dynasty. If anything, I'll give them props for being dominant for the 18 months spanning the 03/04 and 04/05 seasons. But calling them a dynasty is an insult to real sports dynasties, especially in light of the fact that they have been cheating the whole time.

 

 

I agree with this assertion. I hate the Pats as much as anyone and think that the cheating scandal can't just be swept away as irrelevant as some seem to insist. That said, however, if you set the whole scandal aside, there's no dynasty to end here... it's been over for 4 seasons. From '01-'04 you can argue that 3 SB's in 4 years was a dynasty, but as you said they haven't won a Super Bowl in going on 4 years. I'd say that's a clear break in whatever *dynasty they had going.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

There is only 1 thing I want to see in the Putz future, OK make it 2...

 

Tom Brady no longer playing QB and 1 or 2 defeats per season to the Buffalo Bills.

[Gordio]

Dynasties don't choke in big games. The Shift-8's haven't won anything in four years. They won a championship in 01/02, didn't make the playoffs in 02/03, won the next two, and have gagged in the playoffs since. Hardly a dynasty. If anything, I'll give them props for being dominant for the 18 months spanning the 03/04 and 04/05 seasons. But calling them a dynasty is an insult to real sports dynasties, especially in light of the fact that they have been cheating the whole time.

 

 

The cheating aspect aside, they have won 3 superbowls this decade & have appeared in another super bowl. The only other teams that I could think of having as good of a run as them over the course of a decade our the 70's Steelers, the 80's 49ers & the 90's Cowboys. I mean say they are not a dynasty because they were caught cheating, but do not say the reason they should not be considered a dynasty since 2000 because they have not accomplished enough. You just sound like a sore loser.

[Buftex]

The cheating aspect aside, they have won 3 superbowls this decade & have appeared in another super bowl. The only other teams that I could think of having as good of a run as them over the course of a decade our the 70's Steelers, the 80's 49ers & the 90's Cowboys. I mean say they are not a dynasty because they were caught cheating, but do not say the reason they should not be considered a dynasty since 2000 because they have not accomplished enough. You just sound like a sore loser.

 

 

I understand what you are saying, and agree. The record books are never going to change. But, I don't think you can ever think about these Patriots (2001- present) without being mindful of the cheating scandal. I didn't take it very seriously at first, but the more that comes out, I just have to wonder about how great these Patriot teams would have been, on a level playing field. I think the cheating they succeeded at is much more signifcant than some are seeing it as. I am by no means a Pats fan, but have stuck up for them for years, on this board. I am more than willing to give teams/athletes, no matter what team, their proper credit when they achieve something. But this cheating scandal really alters my view of them (Brady, Bellechk, etc etc) and their legacy. Sure, they won 3 Super Bowls in 7 years, but the final score doesn't tell the whole story. They will be considered "great" in the same way that Barry Bonds, Sammy Sosa, and Mark McGwire are in MLB. You can't deny that they did something great, but you can have major doubts about how they got there. For me, as much as it pains me to say it, the last true dynasty in the NFL was the Cowboys of the 1990's.

[ans4e64]

I'll never write off the Patriots as long as Belichick is their head coach and Brady is their QB.

[Buftex]

I'll never write off the Patriots as long as Belichick is their head coach and Brady is their QB.

 

 

I am not counting them out either, and I figure they will win the division again. If I were betting, I would go that way. But, there is a part of me that could see them just collapsing this season too. The Super Bowl loser collapse trend is pretty strong, and that team certainly has had a lot of distractions this off-season. I know, it is only the off-season, but this whole thing will likely heat up again once training camp breaks.

 

In the little he has talked about it, Brady already seems a little uptight and defensive, he almost looks a little "burned out" IMO...Bellichek seems to be getting more defiant...people are whispering...just saying, I am not sure that their recon operation didn't help them (especially 6th round draft pick Tom Brady) just a little bit over the years. You hear guys like Dan Marino, Phil Simms, Boomer Esiason and Jim Kelly explain that knowing defensive play calls would be a "huge" advantage for a QB, you just can't help but wonder...