Are we winning the War in Iraq?

[pBills]

So what do "rich" people do with all their money? They put it under the mattress? No, they invest it (which helps the economy and the stock market) and then they save some in back accounts and CDs spend the rest, both of which help the economy. "Rich" people have a life style that they've worked hard for and deserve just as you do. So why should the "rich" people have their lifestlye compromised and yours increased? Please explain that to me.

 

 

What do you think the middle-class does? They have CD's, 401k plans, some lucky ones still have pension plans. Which is clearly getting removed from many businesses/corporations.

 

 

"Rich" people have a life style that they've worked hard for and deserve just as you do. So why should the "rich" people have their lifestyle compromised and yours increased?

 

Giving the middle-class and break in taxes is such a bad thing now? And really their lives are going to be deeply compromised by paying a tad bit more in taxes? I love how people always look out for the wealthy (my definition is total household income of $250k and above) and basically say screw the middle-class.

[pBills]

I'm sure he doesn't invest in those pesky 401k plans, because really, why risk your money when you can spend it and rely on S. Security when you're old.

 

 

 

Actually, I do have a 401k plan, a pension plan, a secondary retirement plan as well as other investments. Fact is that some people have to spend their money because they have to. They do not make enough to simply put some away.

[SD Jarhead]

Well hey Einstein, aren't you afraid of the risk of investing your money? Too bad for you there isn't a plan that allows you to turn it over to the Government to invest for you...I'm sure they'd do a better job with it than you can.

 

The other side of this is that we all make choices in our life. Some choose to party and some choose to focus on education. That might have a bit of bearing on our financial wellness later in life. Some take chances to better themselves some don't. Why should the kid who takes calculus have to subsidize the kid who took auto shop? We all have a place to fill, but if you choose to become an auto worker for a living, don't hate Bill Gates because YOU made the choice. That's what I hate about the Democratic class warfare they employ. This country gives people the opportunity to be whoever their intellect and ambition lead them to be.

 

The same goes with finances. If as you mention above, people cannot save money because they do not make enough then maybe they should put down the Marlboros and stay out of the Pub on the weekends. Thats a large part of why the city of Buffalo is in the schitter. They're all about the party, not the productivity there.

[Endzone Animal]

The other side of this is that we all make choices in our life. Some choose to party and some choose to focus on education. If as you mention above, people cannot save money because they do not make enough then maybe they should put down the Marlboros and stay out of the Pub on the weekends. Thats a large part of why the city of Buffalo is in the schitter. They're all about the party, not the productivity there.

I totally disagree with this comment. I have lived in Cleveland, Tampa, Ft Lauderdale, all places that have better economies than Buffalo, and nowhere do people have a better work ethic than in Buffalo. We Buffalonians do love our beer, but certainly blowing money on a few cold ones over the weekend has not caused recession. I'm proud that Buffalonians are tough, kind and hard working people...and as for the beer, well, a guy named Tim Russert loved his beer more than anyone and somehow managed to become educated and successful, wouldn't you say?

 

You sound a lot like Barak Obama...mocking Buffalonians for clinging to their God, their guns and their beer.

[PastaJoe]

"Let them eat cake!" - Jarhead Antoinette

 

Society needs blue collar workers like auto mechanics. I'd rather know a good mechanic than someone good at calculus. Granted some people screw up their chances, but many people are never given the same chances to recover from mistakes. Having parents who can bail you out and pay for your education, your car, or your house down payment can give you a leg up on others who worked just as hard or harder. And what about the people who followed the rules, got an education, got a job and married before having kids, and through no fault of their own have lost their job that used to take care of their family and now is struggling with a lower paying job without benefits. That person deserves a helping hand from those that have been more fortunate.

[pBills]

The other side of this is that we all make choices in our life. Some choose to party and some choose to focus on education. That might have a bit of bearing on our financial wellness later in life. Some take chances to better themselves some don't. Why should the kid who takes calculus have to subsidize the kid who took auto shop? We all have a place to fill, but if you choose to become an auto worker for a living, don't hate Bill Gates because YOU made the choice. That's what I hate about the Democratic class warfare they employ. This country gives people the opportunity to be whoever their intellect and ambition lead them to be.

 

The same goes with finances. If as you mention above, people cannot save money because they do not make enough then maybe they should put down the Marlboros and stay out of the Pub on the weekends. Thats a large part of why the city of Buffalo is in the schitter. They're all about the party, not the productivity there.

 

 

 

That is the most ridiculous post I have read in a long time. Your attitude is why I can't stand most republicans. Anyone who doesn't make a lot of money spends to much time in the pubs, smoking or just didn't like school. What an absolutely dumb thing to say. Way to classify all auto workers as meaning less to society. What do you do by the way?

 

Anyone who can't necessarily afford to save tons of money or is living paycheck to paycheck is in the pubs, smoking, non-productive, etc. I guess those single mothers or single father working two jobs to put food on the table and to keep a roof over their heads must in the pubs in their spare time or just slacking off. :beer:

[pBills]

"Let them eat cake!" - Jarhead Antoinette

 

Society needs blue collar workers like auto mechanics. I'd rather know a good mechanic than someone good at calculus. Granted some people screw up their chances, but many people are never given the same chances to recover from mistakes. Having parents who can bail you out and pay for your education, your car, or your house down payment can give you a leg up on others who worked just as hard or harder. And what about the people who followed the rules, got an education, got a job and married before having kids, and through no fault of their own have lost their job that used to take care of their family and now is struggling with a lower paying job without benefits. That person deserves a helping hand from those that have been more fortunate.

 

 

 

No Pasta, according to Jarhead they should never ask for help. They don't deserve it no matter what. We need to classify everyone as the same. Those people just didn't work hard enough for it.

[Endzone Animal]

pBills: Jarhead, spewed bipartisan idiocy, not Republican idiocy. I'm republican and found that comment of his just as offensive, elitest and flat out wrong as you do.

[SD Jarhead]

There's a simple solution that works...move to where there are jobs. Period, end of story. Like my Dad used to tell me, "Life is not fair, if you want Fair, You'll have to wait until August when it comes to town".

 

There's so much Bullschit to your argument. Yes, bad things happen to good people. Our character defines how we respond when this happens.

 

I could tell you my story or my sisters story of how she put herself through dental school to become a dentist taking *gasp* risk by borrowing money to put herself through school. And BTW, my Dad was an autoworker at Ford, so I didn't come from the "upper crust".

[pBills]

pBills: Jarhead, spewed bipartisan idiocy, not Republican idiocy. I'm republican and found that comment of his just as offensive, elitest and flat out wrong as you do.

 

 

For that, I do apologize.

[SD Jarhead]

I believe in accountability for ones actions...bottom line. The entitlement mentality you people support is exactly what is going to bring this nation down.

 

Pbills-you still haven't addresses your idiotic position of why you feel the Gov't will provide you a better return on your investment of S. Security than could be had in the open market.

[pBills]

There's a simple solution that works...move to where there are jobs. Period, end of story. Like my Dad used to tell me, "Life is not fair, if you want Fair, You'll have to wait until August when it comes to town".

 

There's so much Bullschit to your argument. Yes, bad things happen to good people. Our character defines how we respond when this happens.

 

I could tell you my story or my sisters story of how she put herself through dental school to become a dentist taking *gasp* risk by borrowing money to put herself through school. And BTW, my Dad was an autoworker at Ford, so I didn't come from the "upper crust".

 

 

 

 

Just like the Ethiopians... move to where there is food. Or people in other countries, move away from the violence. Just that simple. Just move to get a new job - leave the area in which you have lived, raised or are raising your children, where you have started to create a support circle. So easy, why didn't think of that?

 

Yes our character defines who are. Especially when under the gun, however it does guarantee a turnaround. Bad things do happen and they are not always easy to turn around. Having a great work ethic or a great degree doesn't always mean you'll get back up on your feet quickly if at all.

 

Your sisters story is captivating... she got a loan and borrowed money. She was lucky to have good credit. Another thing people do not always have for one reason or another. And since your father worked as an auto worker - I find it funny that you bashed auto workers earlier and that you have no sympathy for the middle-lower class.

[PastaJoe]

There's a simple solution that works...move to where there are jobs. Period, end of story. Like my Dad used to tell me, "Life is not fair, if you want Fair, You'll have to wait until August when it comes to town".

 

There's so much Bullschit to your argument. Yes, bad things happen to good people. Our character defines how we respond when this happens.

 

I could tell you my story or my sisters story of how she put herself through dental school to become a dentist taking *gasp* risk by borrowing money to put herself through school. And BTW, my Dad was an autoworker at Ford, so I didn't come from the "upper crust".

 

There's an idea, let's ship our manufacturing workers over to China where their jobs went.

 

Given your background I would expect you to understand the struggle and how some people could use a hand, especially now when prospects for blue collar workers have greatly decreased, especially those who are in their 40s and older and have lost benefits. My dad never got a college education because he had to go to work young to help out his family, and I had to take loans to pay for my college and never had a car until I got a permanent job and could buy one when I was 23, and that was a $300 Buick. So I've been there too and know how hard it is.

[Chef Jim]

What do you think the middle-class does? They have CD's, 401k plans, some lucky ones still have pension plans. Which is clearly getting removed from many businesses/corporations.

 

 

 

 

Giving the middle-class and break in taxes is such a bad thing now? And really their lives are going to be deeply compromised by paying a tad bit more in taxes? I love how people always look out for the wealthy (my definition is total household income of $250k and above) and basically say screw the middle-class.

 

Good job answering my question. Where did I say that we shouldn't give the middle class a tax break? My question was why should they get one while the wealthy get a tax increase. Where's the rationale for that? My plan is looking our for the lower (interesting you didn't mention them..oh that's right, you're probably not part of them), middle and upper class and saying screw the goverment by making them work with what they have been given.

[SD Jarhead]

Just like the Ethiopians... move to where there is food. Or people in other countries, move away from the violence. Just that simple. Just move to get a new job - leave the area in which you have lived, raised or are raising your children, where you have started to create a support circle. So easy, why didn't think of that?

 

Yes our character defines who are. Especially when under the gun, however it does guarantee a turnaround. Bad things do happen and they are not always easy to turn around. Having a great work ethic or a great degree doesn't always mean you'll get back up on your feet quickly if at all.

 

Your sisters story is captivating... she got a loan and borrowed money. She was lucky to have good credit. Another thing people do not always have for one reason or another. And since your father worked as an auto worker - I find it funny that you bashed auto workers earlier and that you have no sympathy for the middle-lower class.

 

I see I've got the retard rodeo all fired up this morning

 

BTW, moron-I'm not talking about Ethi-freakin-opia-I'm talking about the USA. Nice try at spinning.

 

First off, I'm not denigrating auto workers. Just the ones who are bittermen like you and your ilk who hate on the Bill Gates of the world because they worked hard and are rich. And you feel that because they're rich they have some responsibility to give a percentage of their wealth to those who are, well, autoworkers. It is an insane idea.

 

As far as my sister is concerned, no she was not lucky to have good credit. It is a function of PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY!

 

Anyway, chew on that for awhile...I've got to go and be a productive person so I don't end up unemployed and bitter at the world like you and Pasta.

[PastaJoe]

Good job answering my question. Where did I say that we shouldn't give the middle class a tax break? My question was why should they get one while the wealthy get a tax increase. Where's the rationale for that? My plan is looking our for the lower (interesting you didn't mention them..oh that's right, you're probably not part of them), middle and upper class and saying screw the goverment by making them work with what they have been given.

 

The wealthy have prospered under the current tax policies while the middle and lower class haven't seen the benefit of the promised trickle down effect. And the wealthy did quite well even at the tax rates of the Clinton years. Now it's time for them to pick up the slack and give a little more to help out the majority of taxpayers. Should we also reduce spending, of course, and the billions being spent in Iraq would be a good start. If the wealthy want to keep lower tax rates, then they should invest in creating American jobs to increase the taxpayer base, instead of investing in whatever foreign business gives them the greatest return. How about showing some patriotism and sacrificing some profit for the good of the nation.

[pBills]

I see I've got the retard rodeo all fired up this morning

 

BTW, moron-I'm not talking about Ethi-freakin-opia-I'm talking about the USA. Nice try at spinning.

 

First off, I'm not denigrating auto workers. Just the ones who are bittermen like you and your ilk who hate on the Bill Gates of the world because they worked hard and are rich. And you feel that because they're rich they have some responsibility to give a percentage of their wealth to those who are, well, autoworkers. It is an insane idea.

 

As far as my sister is concerned, no she was not lucky to have good credit. It is a function of PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY!

 

Anyway, chew on that for awhile...I've got to go and be a productive person so I don't end up unemployed and bitter at the world like you and Pasta.

 

 

Moron follow along... read a bit. The "why don't they just move" philosophy you have is a failed one. Ethiopia was just an example tool. Believe me, I am not a bitter person. I, unlike you look out for people that do not have the opportunities or need help. I do not hate Bill Gates in any way. I dislike his product - I am a mac person. He had a great idea, developed it and sold it to the world. God for him. His hard paid off. Hard work however does not pay off for everyone. What about those workers that bust their butt everyday and then lose their job to no fault of their own? Or get skipped over for a promotion because of the person above them wants to promote a buddy or some kid of college with no job experience. All of that hard work and dedication for nothing.

 

I do not feel as though the rich have the responsibility - they should want to help out those less fortunate. They for whatever reason, luck, hard work, etc have what others are not able to get. Why not help them out? Not saying empty their pocket books and accounts out - just help a bit. Would not hurt one bit even if it was through a small tax increase. Thinking that does not make me bitter at all.

 

Go be productive. Why you are doing that - learn how to multitask, then you would be able to be on the message board while conducting business. I am going to go hit the pub, smoke and be unemployed and bitter????

[Chef Jim]

The wealthy have prospered under the current tax policies while the middle and lower class haven't seen the benefit of the promised trickle down effect. And the wealthy did quite well even at the tax rates of the Clinton years. Now it's time for them to pick up the slack and give a little more to help out the majority of taxpayers. Should we also reduce spending, of course, and the billions being spent in Iraq would be a good start. If the wealthy want to keep lower tax rates, then they should invest in creating American jobs to increase the taxpayer base, instead of investing in whatever foreign business gives them the greatest return. How about showing some patriotism and sacrificing some profit for the good of the nation.

 

That has got to be the funniest thing I've read. Yeah, those terrible wealthy people just sit in their ivory towers and create no jobs. Who the !@#$ do you thing has created the majority of the jobs in the country? Tax them more and those jobs go away. For those of you who think that $250k is rich you're talking the sweet spot of small business.

 

You guys just dont' get it.

 

"Rich" people are not all like Paris Hilton.

 

-Small business produces roughly half of the private Gross Domestic Product (GDP) and creates, on average, about two-thirds of net new jobs annually.

-Small businesses are the greatest source of new employment in inner cities, comprising more than 99 percent of establishments and 80 percent of total employment.

-American small business is the world’s third largest economy, trailing only the United States as a whole and Japan.

-Small businesses employ more than half of private sector employees. Ninety percent of small businesses employ fewer than 20 people.

-Small firms represent 99.7 percent of all employers.

-Nearly 16 million people operate a small business as their primary occupation in a year.

-Women-owned firms have grown at around two times the rate of all firms; minority-owned firms have grown at around four times the rate of all firms.

[Endzone Animal]

The wealthy have prospered under the current tax policies while the middle and lower class haven't seen the benefit of the promised trickle down effect. And the wealthy did quite well even at the tax rates of the Clinton years. Now it's time for them to pick up the slack and give a little more to help out the majority of taxpayers. Should we also reduce spending, of course, and the billions being spent in Iraq would be a good start. If the wealthy want to keep lower tax rates, then they should invest in creating American jobs to increase the taxpayer base, instead of investing in whatever foreign business gives them the greatest return. How about showing some patriotism and sacrificing some profit for the good of the nation.

Ugggghhhh...We should expect our businesses to sacrifice their profits out of patriotism? Dear God. Increasing taxes will incentivise businesses to invest in America rather than abroad - where taxes are next to nothing?

 

Please, please say you made a typo, or hit the "add reply" button before you proof read.

[PastaJoe]

That has got to be the funniest thing I've read. Yeah, those terrible wealthy people just sit in their ivory towers and create no jobs. Who the !@#$ do you thing has created the majority of the jobs in the country? Tax them more and those jobs go away. For those of you who think that $250k is rich you're talking the sweet spot of small business.

 

Let's all bow down to the wealthy who profited from the labor of the workers for giving us our jobs. Taxes aren't the main motivation for moving jobs overseas, it's because they can maximize their profits with cheap labor and lax regulations. If they show a committment to keeping jobs in America, then they should get taxbreaks, but not when they still move jobs overseas.