pBills Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Which is what I posted, lol. How he voted, what did he vote for is what I am concerned about. Well, that and the straight talk express follows the same path as Bush. I'm sorry, I just feel as though McCain has some serious issues, I don't trust him for anything. One minute he's for them, next he's against, then for, then against.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 How he voted, what did he vote for is what I am concerned about. Well, that and the straight talk express follows the same path as Bush. I'm sorry, I just feel as though McCain has some serious issues, I don't trust him for anything. One minute he's for them, next he's against, then for, then against.... Then I suggest not trying to use statistics to prove your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pBills Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Then I suggest not trying to use statistics to prove your point. I do not trust McCain one bit. Some of his beliefs I feel are just wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 I do not trust McCain one bit. Some of his beliefs I feel are just wrong. So do you trust Obama? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pBills Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Actually, I do. I know - shocker. I believe that he will be a better president for the middle-class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Actually, I do. I know - shocker. I believe that he will be a better president for the middle-class. Thats like trusting a complete stranger. What you know of him is only what they/ ( the media) he ( everybody has skeletons in their closet) tells you. So you blindly believe them. Sorry. I dont trust any politician. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 So do you trust Obama? I have Obama slightly ahead of McCain right now. I think McCain's economic policies are better than Obama's, and I think Winnie the Pooh's are better than Bush's. Obama is for returning the power to the other two branches of government that Bush stole, along with McCain's vote to endow him with those kingly powers. I'm for the constitution, so removing those powers from the King and turning it back into a presidency sounds good to me. Not to say that I will end up voting for either of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 I have Obama slightly ahead of McCain right now. I think McCain's economic policies are better than Obama's, and I think Winnie the Pooh's are better than Bush's. Obama is for returning the power to the other two branches of government that Bush stole, along with McCain's vote to endow him with those kingly powers. I'm for the constitution, so removing those powers from the King and turning it back into a presidency sounds good to me. Not to say that I will end up voting for either of them The big problem from my perspective is neither of them have a plan that will actually balance the budget, even though both blabber about fiscal responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 The big problem from my perspective is neither of them have a plan that will actually balance the budget, even though both blabber about fiscal responsibility. I think I agree- I just wonder if the plans they are presenting are their real plans are are there just for the election. Their proposed plans will actually make the deficit worse. People need to accept the fact that it will get MUCH worse before it gets better. I think the biggest cuts will have to come in the entertainment industry, which is where too much money is going right now. And its not the government that needs to make those cuts either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In-A-Gadda-Levitre Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 The big problem from my perspective is neither of them have a plan that will actually balance the budget, even though both blabber about fiscal responsibility. Agreed, but McCain intends to stay in Iraq, good/bad/indifferent, and that's what? almost $200B per year and wants to make the Bush tax cuts permanent, and add additional tax cuts to the tune of $200-$400B per year according to his own economists, and promises to pay for it by eliminating earmarks. And Obama, good/bad/indifferent, wants to end the war, bringing that deficit way down in 24 months or so, and cancel the Bush tax cuts, while funding a middle class tax cut, adding government controlled healthcare, etc. He says he can pay for it by increasing taxes on the richest Americans and the repeal of the Bush tax cuts. I don't have an unbiased cost estimate for Obama's plan, but it seems on the surface to be closer to a balanced budget than McCain's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Agreed, but McCain intends to stay in Iraq, good/bad/indifferent, and that's what? almost $200B per year and wants to make the Bush tax cuts permanent, and add additional tax cuts to the tune of $200-$400B per year according to his own economists, and promises to pay for it by eliminating earmarks. And Obama, good/bad/indifferent, wants to end the war, bringing that deficit way down in 24 months or so, and cancel the Bush tax cuts, while funding a middle class tax cut, adding government controlled healthcare, etc. He says he can pay for it by increasing taxes on the richest Americans and the repeal of the Bush tax cuts. I don't have an unbiased cost estimate for Obama's plan, but it seems on the surface to be closer to a balanced budget than McCain's. So what? Neither of them can say that they are cutting enough programs to be able to balance the budget. Paying for Universal Health Care and other programs by leaving Iraq and adjusting tax policy still leaves a completely and utterly unbalanced budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In-A-Gadda-Levitre Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 So what? Neither of them can say that they are cutting enough programs to be able to balance the budget. Paying for Universal Health Care and other programs by leaving Iraq and adjusting tax policy still leaves a completely and utterly unbalanced budget. AT LEAST $400 BILLION DOLLARS PER YEAR DIFFERENCE, but so what Do you ever even consider another opinion besides your own? sad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 AT LEAST $400 BILLION DOLLARS PER YEAR DIFFERENCE, but so what "So what" meaning he isn't going to actually balance the budget, even with that influx of cash flow. He even said so himself back in December 2007 in a debate. Do you ever even consider another opinion besides your own? sad... Sure I do. Your opinion is that accepting Obama's figures and desire to reduce the yearly operating deficit is good enough. I considered that, and came to the conclusion that it wasn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 "So what" meaning he isn't going to actually balance the budget, even with that influx of cash flow. He even said so himself back in December 2007 in a debate. Sure I do. Your opinion is that accepting Obama's figures and desire to reduce the yearly operating deficit is good enough. I considered that, and came to the conclusion that it wasn't. I am not sure that 1 or 2 presidential terms are enough to eliminate the deficit. Granted, I may be way off on that, I am not an economist, but I do think I have what should be termed uncommon sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 I am not sure that 1 or 2 presidential terms are enough to eliminate the deficit. Granted, I may be way off on that, I am not an economist, but I do think I have what should be termed uncommon sense. Because of all the spending, we're at a $407-billion deficit for fiscal 2009. Give me a President who would get that balanced, and I'll vote for him. Obama's plan has some areas of savings, but he typically spends all of those savings, leaving us again at a budget deficit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Because of all the spending, we're at a $407-billion deficit for fiscal 2009. Give me a President who would get that balanced, and I'll vote for him. Obama's plan has some areas of savings, but he typically spends all of those savings, leaving us again at a budget deficit. Now don't take this as sour grapes towards big oil, because as I said before, they are the leg that is propping up our economy right now. But with their record profits, they hardly needed that big tax break this year. Sure, that wouldn't come close to fixing the deficit, but you have to start somewhere, and it will come out of all sectors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD Jarhead Posted June 13, 2008 Author Share Posted June 13, 2008 Lest anyone forget that the $200 billion spent on the war is also helping to prop up the economy. I'm not saying this is a good thing, but once we start cutting back on Gov't contracts real estate is going to get real cheap in Maryland and Virginia. The hangover from this war is going to dwarf what happened post-Vietnam. And don't even ask about the cost of re-setting the force once we do get out of Iraq... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 when we pull our heads out of our asses. Wind power, astro power, fuel cells, zero point energy, cold fusion, anti matter, tide power, scalar wave technology, magnetic energy, geothermal energy, etc. We are the USA, the land of innovation. What would Ben Franklin say about oil today? He would be busting his ass trying to solve the crisis, not advocate drilling our forests. Europe and the rest of the civilized world are ahead of us with alternative energy. Iceland and Brazil are good examples, as are Germany and Switzerland. We are pissing away the worlds resources. There are alternatives. And yes KD- I do care about future generations. Where would we be without our forefathers innovations? What happens when we drill all our resources and then run out of oil? Then what? It is prudent to develop alternatives now- and not wait until we run out. And I would just as soon leave our beautiful parks and nature reserves beautiful. Except we're not going to run out of oil and that lahjik is what's gotten us to this point in the first place - there is no short term replacement for oil. And ANWR is anything but beautiful. It's a desolate wasteland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 Except we're not going to run out of oil and that lahjik is what's gotten us to this point in the first place - there is no short term replacement for oil. And ANWR is anything but beautiful. It's a desolate wasteland. its beautiful habitat for over 200 species Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 its beautiful habitat for over 160 species And would it not remain so if >1% of the area was developed for domestic energy production? Seriously Pete, those talking points really don't make a very convincing arguement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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