Jauron most underrated coach in NFL

[Steely Dan]

Really? Was the NFC West so much inferior to the high-powered AFC East? Let's see, the NFC West played the NFC South and the AFC North.

 

So really, you're saying the Bills would've won 5 more games because they'd, I guess, sweep the NFC West, which would only get them to 9-7. So the other 3 games would have to come against the AFC North (which they went 2-2 against) the NFC South (they went 1-3 against the NFC East; Atlanta and Carolina arguably nets 1 more win; we're up to 10), or wins against the 2 free opponents (which they whiffed on going 0-2).

 

On the other hand, this is optimistic and a few bumps in the road puts the Bills right back to hovering at around 8-8 with all the rest of the middling also-rans.

 

Tell that to the people that keep posting the Bills wouldn't have won more than 3 games without Jauron.

 

How about looking at the facts of record in my post above.

[Sisyphean Bills]

How about looking at the facts of record in my post above.

I've got no beef with your speculations, SD. You're not the one calling people idiots.

 

13 teams had worse records means 18 teams had better records, zero-sum game and all. To be a playoff team, that means the Bills have to pass 6 teams ahead of them (3 AFC teams) and hope nobody from behind passes them in the process. The Jets and Dolphins are working hard to improve; I'm not sure they should be taken as afterthoughts and as 4 automatic wins. Any of the 7-9 teams could improve from last year and all of them except for the Bills and Lions have gotten to the playoffs in recent memory. Want to talk injuries? The Ravens were a 13-3 team in 2006 and were decimated with injuries last year. They still have talent, if they can put it together and stay healthy.

[ax4782]

How about looking at the facts of record in my post above.

 

Too bad people around here don't look at facts more often. Rather they are more concerned with spouting their dislikes or unhappinesses rather than engaging in legitimate discussions concerning a topic. That is unfortunately the problem. When you confront emotion with reason, you can't win. Many have a dislike for Jauron, for whatever reason. Maybe they wanted another person for the job and are still bitter. Maybe they think they could have done better than 7-9 with a secondary made up of PS players who gave it their all. Maybe they just don't understand that the coach is not the one who makes the plays. Or they forgot that Steve RUN RUN PASS Fairchild was the coordinator last year and was actually the one running the offense. But none of that matters. To many who dislike Jauron, the only thing that matters is that the team was 7-9 and since he was the coach, well, that must have been completely his fault.

 

Perhaps we should get another coach, and implement a new offensive system. That should only set us back another three years. And by then, well, the fans will be tired of that coach and we'll have to get another one. Change and competitiveness in football have to do with consistency at the helm and having a solid core of players than they do with having a superstar coach. By the logic of many on this board, Buffalo should have never hired Marv Levy based on his performance in KC, Bill Belicheat should never have gone to the Patriots after his performance in Cleveland, and Brian Billick should NEVER have become a coach with the Ravens or any other Team. All of those coaches, however, were given an opportunity, and after taking charge and reshaping the team to their requirements, they saw a lot of success. Jauron and the Bills are fielding our best team in years this season. Could we please stop and give the team a chance to succeed before we start piling on the coaching staff. Another change at the helm, what would be the fourth in ten years, is only going to set us back. Before we doom ourselves to three more years of defeat and become the Detroit Lions, let's see what this season brings.

[Steely Dan]

Too bad people around here don't look at facts more often. Rather they are more concerned with spouting their dislikes or unhappinesses rather than engaging in legitimate discussions concerning a topic. That is unfortunately the problem. When you confront emotion with reason, you can't win. Many have a dislike for Jauron, for whatever reason. Maybe they wanted another person for the job and are still bitter. Maybe they think they could have done better than 7-9 with a secondary made up of PS players who gave it their all. Maybe they just don't understand that the coach is not the one who makes the plays. Or they forgot that Steve RUN RUN PASS Fairchild was the coordinator last year and was actually the one running the offense. But none of that matters. To many who dislike Jauron, the only thing that matters is that the team was 7-9 and since he was the coach, well, that must have been completely his fault.

 

Perhaps we should get another coach, and implement a new offensive system. That should only set us back another three years. And by then, well, the fans will be tired of that coach and we'll have to get another one. Change and competitiveness in football have to do with consistency at the helm and having a solid core of players than they do with having a superstar coach. By the logic of many on this board, Buffalo should have never hired Marv Levy based on his performance in KC, Bill Belicheat should never have gone to the Patriots after his performance in Cleveland, and Brian Billick should NEVER have become a coach with the Ravens or any other Team. All of those coaches, however, were given an opportunity, and after taking charge and reshaping the team to their requirements, they saw a lot of success. Jauron and the Bills are fielding our best team in years this season. Could we please stop and give the team a chance to succeed before we start piling on the coaching staff. Another change at the helm, what would be the fourth in ten years, is only going to set us back. Before we doom ourselves to three more years of defeat and become the Detroit Lions, let's see what this season brings.

 

Well stated!

[Pyrite Gal]

The weirdest thing about folks diatribes against Jauron is that actually the subject of this thread is about emotion rather than simply results (which IMHO is actually the most important thing). This thread is not only about his results (which I think on the face of it were slightly below average at 7-9 in a league which tends toward almost all teams competing for the playoffs even if they are only 8-8) but is specifically about whether he is over or under rated.

 

The weird thing is that not only are folks simply wrong when they claim he has done nothing (at worst on the face of it he is a one time NFL Coach of the Year who has produced a slightly below average record with much less than average teams) but actually they are even more wrong about saying that even this level of below average production is less than the conventional wisdom rated him as likely to produce.

 

Bears- The CW had him producing at best a slightly above average team initially but he exceeded expectation by HCing the team to a 13-3 record.

 

The CW did not go up drastically for him despite this success because the front office was clearly in disarray. When a new GM was hired he could not fire Jauron because of his past success but it was clearly a matter of time before he was gonna get canned and so it was.

 

DET- I do not see how anyone could claim that their was any expectation of him doing well with the team he took over which got the HC canned. It did not do well.

 

However, it seems to be generally agreed that Jauron exceeded expectations here as this team at least showed up to play under him and was at least simply bad rather than horrendous.

 

Bills- This team was 5-11 when he got here and he and the new braintrust went about cleaning house getting rid of WM, Fletch, and TKO. Still though the result was slightly below average at 7-9, it likely exceeded where most watchers would rate a bad team in a transition year as doing.

 

Last year, the result was clear and about the same at the same 7-9. Yet, again this less than average production exceeded what the conventional wisdom would expect from a team which led the league in players on IR.

 

Has Jauron delivered a winner to Bills fans?

 

No.

 

Has he exceeded reasonable expectations about what result a 5-11 team undergoing a housecleaning and then suffering a league leading total of players on IR would produce?

 

Yep.

 

Folks can certainly make a credible argument that the CW should have been higher and observers were wrong to underate what the Bills would do in 2008 despite the injuries.

 

However, some do not want to make this logical argument but instead seem to want to rely on rants against Jauron which ignore his past Coach of the Year honor with incorrect claims he has done nothing. Or they instead choose to argue the relative case of whether he and the Bills were overrated with reliance on the absolute of the team record while ignoring the IR fact.

 

IMHO opinion the facts are that Jauron produced slightly worse than average results working with a bad team rebuilding from a 5-11 record and in the face of leading the league in players on IR.

 

These strike me as the simple facts and folks who simply choose to ignore this end up looking like fools,

 

Some may argue that it is all about results. i say yeah but in the words of Dick Cheney... So?

 

The key will likely be the results produced in 08 or more likely 09 since Jauron has been HC on a team which has prodced slightly less than average results when they were so bad in terms of the players we had this team could easily have produced one of the NFLs worst records in either of the last two years.

 

The facts simply are that Jauron HC'ed awful Bills teams to slightly worse than average results. One can reasonably argue that Jauron has failings that will not get the Bills over the top, however making demonstrably false claims that he has never succeeded anywhere or not recognizing the 06 Bills were simply an awful team completely undercuts any attempt to do a rational critique.

Too bad people around here don't look at facts more often. Rather they are more concerned with spouting their dislikes or unhappinesses rather than engaging in legitimate discussions concerning a topic. That is unfortunately the problem. When you confront emotion with reason, you can't win. Many have a dislike for Jauron, for whatever reason. Maybe they wanted another person for the job and are still bitter. Maybe they think they could have done better than 7-9 with a secondary made up of PS players who gave it their all. Maybe they just don't understand that the coach is not the one who makes the plays. Or they forgot that Steve RUN RUN PASS Fairchild was the coordinator last year and was actually the one running the offense. But none of that matters. To many who dislike Jauron, the only thing that matters is that the team was 7-9 and since he was the coach, well, that must have been completely his fault.

 

Perhaps we should get another coach, and implement a new offensive system. That should only set us back another three years. And by then, well, the fans will be tired of that coach and we'll have to get another one. Change and competitiveness in football have to do with consistency at the helm and having a solid core of players than they do with having a superstar coach. By the logic of many on this board, Buffalo should have never hired Marv Levy based on his performance in KC, Bill Belicheat should never have gone to the Patriots after his performance in Cleveland, and Brian Billick should NEVER have become a coach with the Ravens or any other Team. All of those coaches, however, were given an opportunity, and after taking charge and reshaping the team to their requirements, they saw a lot of success. Jauron and the Bills are fielding our best team in years this season. Could we please stop and give the team a chance to succeed before we start piling on the coaching staff. Another change at the helm, what would be the fourth in ten years, is only going to set us back. Before we doom ourselves to three more years of defeat and become the Detroit Lions, let's see what this season brings.

[ax4782]

The weirdest thing about folks diatribes against Jauron is that actually the subject of this thread is about emotion rather than simply results (which IMHO is actually the most important thing). This thread is not only about his results (which I think on the face of it were slightly below average at 7-9 in a league which tends toward almost all teams competing for the playoffs even if they are only 8-8) but is specifically about whether he is over or under rated.

 

The weird thing is that not only are folks simply wrong when they claim he has done nothing (at worst on the face of it he is a one time NFL Coach of the Year who has produced a slightly below average record with much less than average teams) but actually they are even more wrong about saying that even this level of below average production is less than the conventional wisdom rated him as likely to produce.

 

Bears- The CW had him producing at best a slightly above average team initially but he exceeded expectation by HCing the team to a 13-3 record.

 

The CW did not go up drastically for him despite this success because the front office was clearly in disarray. When a new GM was hired he could not fire Jauron because of his past success but it was clearly a matter of time before he was gonna get canned and so it was.

 

DET- I do not see how anyone could claim that their was any expectation of him doing well with the team he took over which got the HC canned. It did not do well.

 

However, it seems to be generally agreed that Jauron exceeded expectations here as this team at least showed up to play under him and was at least simply bad rather than horrendous.

 

Bills- This team was 5-11 when he got here and he and the new braintrust went about cleaning house getting rid of WM, Fletch, and TKO. Still though the result was slightly below average at 7-9, it likely exceeded where most watchers would rate a bad team in a transition year as doing.

 

Last year, the result was clear and about the same at the same 7-9. Yet, again this less than average production exceeded what the conventional wisdom would expect from a team which led the league in players on IR.

 

Has Jauron delivered a winner to Bills fans?

 

No.

 

Has he exceeded reasonable expectations about what result a 5-11 team undergoing a housecleaning and then suffering a league leading total of players on IR would produce?

 

Yep.

 

Folks can certainly make a credible argument that the CW should have been higher and observers were wrong to underate what the Bills would do in 2008 despite the injuries.

 

However, some do not want to make this logical argument but instead seem to want to rely on rants against Jauron which ignore his past Coach of the Year honor with incorrect claims he has done nothing. Or they instead choose to argue the relative case of whether he and the Bills were overrated with reliance on the absolute of the team record while ignoring the IR fact.

 

IMHO opinion the facts are that Jauron produced slightly worse than average results working with a bad team rebuilding from a 5-11 record and in the face of leading the league in players on IR.

 

These strike me as the simple facts and folks who simply choose to ignore this end up looking like fools,

 

Some may argue that it is all about results. i say yeah but in the words of Dick Cheney... So?

 

The key will likely be the results produced in 08 or more likely 09 since Jauron has been HC on a team which has prodced slightly less than average results when they were so bad in terms of the players we had this team could easily have produced one of the NFLs worst records in either of the last two years.

 

The facts simply are that Jauron HC'ed awful Bills teams to slightly worse than average results. One can reasonably argue that Jauron has failings that will not get the Bills over the top, however making demonstrably false claims that he has never succeeded anywhere or not recognizing the 06 Bills were simply an awful team completely undercuts any attempt to do a rational critique.

 

This may have been the most rational and well stated position on the argument that I have seen. Well said. I completely second your statements and analysis, as seen in the post I submitted that you quoted. Very nicely put.

[KD in CA]

Really? name some, and I won't accept Hank Bullough or Kay Stevenson. Actually, Jauron is alot like Kay. Nice guy who'll finish last, but he's really nice.

 

 

Look what happened to 'Man-Genius' last season when the Jets had a little adversary. They fell completely apart and only managed 4 wins cause they played the Fish twice.

[Steely Dan]

The weirdest thing about folks diatribes against Jauron is that actually the subject of this thread is about emotion rather than simply results (which IMHO is actually the most important thing). This thread is not only about his results (which I think on the face of it were slightly below average at 7-9 in a league which tends toward almost all teams competing for the playoffs even if they are only 8-8) but is specifically about whether he is over or under rated.

 

The weird thing is that not only are folks simply wrong when they claim he has done nothing (at worst on the face of it he is a one time NFL Coach of the Year who has produced a slightly below average record with much less than average teams) but actually they are even more wrong about saying that even this level of below average production is less than the conventional wisdom rated him as likely to produce.

 

Bears- The CW had him producing at best a slightly above average team initially but he exceeded expectation by HCing the team to a 13-3 record.

 

The CW did not go up drastically for him despite this success because the front office was clearly in disarray. When a new GM was hired he could not fire Jauron because of his past success but it was clearly a matter of time before he was gonna get canned and so it was.

 

DET- I do not see how anyone could claim that their was any expectation of him doing well with the team he took over which got the HC canned. It did not do well.

 

However, it seems to be generally agreed that Jauron exceeded expectations here as this team at least showed up to play under him and was at least simply bad rather than horrendous.

 

Bills- This team was 5-11 when he got here and he and the new braintrust went about cleaning house getting rid of WM, Fletch, and TKO. Still though the result was slightly below average at 7-9, it likely exceeded where most watchers would rate a bad team in a transition year as doing.

 

Last year, the result was clear and about the same at the same 7-9. Yet, again this less than average production exceeded what the conventional wisdom would expect from a team which led the league in players on IR.

 

Has Jauron delivered a winner to Bills fans?

 

No.

 

Has he exceeded reasonable expectations about what result a 5-11 team undergoing a housecleaning and then suffering a league leading total of players on IR would produce?

 

Yep.

 

Folks can certainly make a credible argument that the CW should have been higher and observers were wrong to underate what the Bills would do in 2008 despite the injuries.

 

However, some do not want to make this logical argument but instead seem to want to rely on rants against Jauron which ignore his past Coach of the Year honor with incorrect claims he has done nothing. Or they instead choose to argue the relative case of whether he and the Bills were overrated with reliance on the absolute of the team record while ignoring the IR fact.

 

IMHO opinion the facts are that Jauron produced slightly worse than average results working with a bad team rebuilding from a 5-11 record and in the face of leading the league in players on IR.

 

These strike me as the simple facts and folks who simply choose to ignore this end up looking like fools,

 

Some may argue that it is all about results. i say yeah but in the words of Dick Cheney... So?

 

The key will likely be the results produced in 08 or more likely 09 since Jauron has been HC on a team which has prodced slightly less than average results when they were so bad in terms of the players we had this team could easily have produced one of the NFLs worst records in either of the last two years.

 

The facts simply are that Jauron HC'ed awful Bills teams to slightly worse than average results. One can reasonably argue that Jauron has failings that will not get the Bills over the top, however making demonstrably false claims that he has never succeeded anywhere or not recognizing the 06 Bills were simply an awful team completely undercuts any attempt to do a rational critique.

 

Well stated too! I would have avoided the Cheyney quote though.

 

 

Look what happened to 'Man-Genius' last season when the Jets had a little adversary. They fell completely apart and only managed 4 wins cause they played the Fish twice.

 

 

My point exactly. Jauron refused to use the Kevin Everett injury as a rallying cry and I think that gave him a lot more respect from all of his players that already love the guy. They obviously play hard for him. Now that unFairchild is gone I'm hoping the offense produces at the level it really should be producing at. When Jauron was hired Troy Vincent called his buddies around the league and he couldn't find one to say anything bad about the guy. He commands the respect of his players because he treats them like men.

[eball]

Too bad people around here don't look at facts more often. Rather they are more concerned with spouting their dislikes or unhappinesses rather than engaging in legitimate discussions concerning a topic. That is unfortunately the problem. When you confront emotion with reason, you can't win. Many have a dislike for Jauron, for whatever reason. Maybe they wanted another person for the job and are still bitter. Maybe they think they could have done better than 7-9 with a secondary made up of PS players who gave it their all. Maybe they just don't understand that the coach is not the one who makes the plays. Or they forgot that Steve RUN RUN PASS Fairchild was the coordinator last year and was actually the one running the offense. But none of that matters. To many who dislike Jauron, the only thing that matters is that the team was 7-9 and since he was the coach, well, that must have been completely his fault.

 

Perhaps we should get another coach, and implement a new offensive system. That should only set us back another three years. And by then, well, the fans will be tired of that coach and we'll have to get another one. Change and competitiveness in football have to do with consistency at the helm and having a solid core of players than they do with having a superstar coach. By the logic of many on this board, Buffalo should have never hired Marv Levy based on his performance in KC, Bill Belicheat should never have gone to the Patriots after his performance in Cleveland, and Brian Billick should NEVER have become a coach with the Ravens or any other Team. All of those coaches, however, were given an opportunity, and after taking charge and reshaping the team to their requirements, they saw a lot of success. Jauron and the Bills are fielding our best team in years this season. Could we please stop and give the team a chance to succeed before we start piling on the coaching staff. Another change at the helm, what would be the fourth in ten years, is only going to set us back. Before we doom ourselves to three more years of defeat and become the Detroit Lions, let's see what this season brings.

Nicely stated, but unfortunately such a post falls upon too many deaf ears around here. I think it's completely reasonable to suggest the 2008 Bills are their most talented team since perhaps '99. If they sustain only a "normal" amount of injuries, then based upon the schedule a playoff spot (or at a minimum, a winning record) is what I'm expecting. If that doesn't happen, then I do believe everyone is rightfully under scrutiny -- particularly the HC.

[ax4782]

Nicely stated, but unfortunately such a post falls upon too many deaf ears around here. I think it's completely reasonable to suggest the 2008 Bills are their most talented team since perhaps '99. If they sustain only a "normal" amount of injuries, then based upon the schedule a playoff spot (or at a minimum, a winning record) is what I'm expecting. If that doesn't happen, then I do believe everyone is rightfully under scrutiny -- particularly the HC.

 

Right on.

[todd]

"Deaf ears" is putting it nicely. Good post.

 

Nicely stated, but unfortunately such a post falls upon too many deaf ears around here. I think it's completely reasonable to suggest the 2008 Bills are their most talented team since perhaps '99. If they sustain only a "normal" amount of injuries, then based upon the schedule a playoff spot (or at a minimum, a winning record) is what I'm expecting. If that doesn't happen, then I do believe everyone is rightfully under scrutiny -- particularly the HC.

[todd]

Word.

 

Too bad people around here don't look at facts more often. Rather they are more concerned with spouting their dislikes or unhappinesses rather than engaging in legitimate discussions concerning a topic. That is unfortunately the problem. When you confront emotion with reason, you can't win. Many have a dislike for Jauron, for whatever reason. Maybe they wanted another person for the job and are still bitter. Maybe they think they could have done better than 7-9 with a secondary made up of PS players who gave it their all. Maybe they just don't understand that the coach is not the one who makes the plays. Or they forgot that Steve RUN RUN PASS Fairchild was the coordinator last year and was actually the one running the offense. But none of that matters. To many who dislike Jauron, the only thing that matters is that the team was 7-9 and since he was the coach, well, that must have been completely his fault.

 

Perhaps we should get another coach, and implement a new offensive system. That should only set us back another three years. And by then, well, the fans will be tired of that coach and we'll have to get another one. Change and competitiveness in football have to do with consistency at the helm and having a solid core of players than they do with having a superstar coach. By the logic of many on this board, Buffalo should have never hired Marv Levy based on his performance in KC, Bill Belicheat should never have gone to the Patriots after his performance in Cleveland, and Brian Billick should NEVER have become a coach with the Ravens or any other Team. All of those coaches, however, were given an opportunity, and after taking charge and reshaping the team to their requirements, they saw a lot of success. Jauron and the Bills are fielding our best team in years this season. Could we please stop and give the team a chance to succeed before we start piling on the coaching staff. Another change at the helm, what would be the fourth in ten years, is only going to set us back. Before we doom ourselves to three more years of defeat and become the Detroit Lions, let's see what this season brings.

[todd]

So going 12-3 was meaningless?

 

He's done nothing in his career to be considered "uderrated". Everything points to him being a below average head coach. Nothing short of him and his teams "showing me otherwise" will change this opinion. I've watched him closely in every season he's been a head coach.

[scribo]

Well, we're about to see just how good he is -- he has a young, talented roster with a bit of experience now. But there are off the field issues sprouting up left and right along with increased national media attention. Can Jauron keep the Bills focused enough to make the playoffs? This is his chance. Here's to hoping and praying he can show everyone that he is good. So next year, he won't be underrated -- just highly rated.

[Sen. John Blutarsky]

He's done nothing in his career to be considered "uderrated". Everything points to him being a below average head coach. Nothing short of him and his teams "showing me otherwise" will change this opinion. I've watched him closely in every season he's been a head coach.

maybe it's possible that we just haven't been very good the last two years. What our team has done an excellent job of is playing hard. They had tons of chances to run for the bus last year but they kept showing up and playing hard. The coach plays a big role in that. It's not the BS pep talks it's the environment he builds throughout the year.

 

Even before the injuries I don't think we were a very good team but afterwards we were pretty bad. I watched the Redkins game yesterday and ticked off guy after guy who is no longer on the roster who was seeing significant playing time. Leonhard, Hargrove, Stamer, and Haggan at least. They went down 11 points early in that game and still won despite it being the Sean Taylor game, on the road.

 

Hell, even the GOOD Bills lost to the Jets the week after Dennis Byrd's paralysis. Whether you like DJ or not they were a gutty team last year and if they bring that level of hustle and determination to this season with better talent they'll be darn good.