Fan in San Diego Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 You sound like a nice guy, and I mean no offense, but you asked. You and your sister both need to lighten up a LOT. You rode into town with a chip on your shoulder, and took everything as an attack or insult. She acted exactly the way you expected. Just be yourself, ignore her ignorant comments (biting the tongue is like shaking a Pepsi), but definitely do not let her scare your baby by angrily yelling near her. By the way, once in a while, especially when traveling, extending the bed time is not unusual. As far as "you think it's bad now, wait until she is 3 (or 4, or 5. or 18)" used to piss me off too. Now, I tell younger parents that they grow as the kids grow, so it all evens out! You need to talk to your sister, admit some of the difficulties were your fault, and see if you can work things out so you can be family. Or just "cut bait" and write her off. Life is too short. Buy your wife some flowers, give her a hug, and apologize to HER. Sounds like she got the short end of the stick on this trip. Good luck. Well said pile of rocks !
Pete Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 sounds like an absolute control freak nut job. I know the type- sorry you happen to be related. I have no time for control freaks or negative people. You seem like you have some good values. Don't let your sister ever change them
The Poojer Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 42 year old sister in virginia pulling in 180 bills? pics? where in va?
BringMetheHeadofLeonLett Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Drive-by Bills fan here... offering random thoughts/possible misperceptions... hope you can piece it together & some of it is helpful It sounds important to you that your daughter have the opportunity to bond with her cousin & yet didn't mention the importance of your own relationship with your sister. Sounds like you're from a small family & trying to forge what bonds you can... totally cool and good luck with that. Personally, I have siblings & cousins I adore, and siblings & cousins I'm less tight with... cue 'That's life' on the jukebox Cold people suck... literally Many of the more successful people I know bury themselves in their pursuits to mask a lack of reasonable fulfillment in thier personal lives Many of the less successful people I know need to get their chit together and realize they're even more worthwhile than they've underestimated some of us belong where we are... and of course, success has very little to do with income, so give that up, please Is it possible your sis and her husband adopted to help resuscitate a failing relationship? Is it possible that she needs help/advice from someone she trusts? Could it be your time to step up to bat? F that she's older... 38 is an age where you're old enough(actually ancient enough) to know some things... (I'm ancient too)... While you may be her younger brother, you did let her become a yuppie... now what're you gonna do about it?!!! Seriously, good luck & at the very least I hope you can help facilitate the cousins becoming buds... methinks you're gonna have to man-up and tell your sis to go F herself at some point in order to make that happen, though. Cat
Stussy109 Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Here are my two cents... The both of you were in the wrong. Knowing she is a "control freak" living in controlled chaos, you have to assume and be ready for incidents such as the remote control. You have to accept that you are using her crap and have to follow her rules, but at the same time, i would lighten the situation up by making a wise crack at her about how shes talking to you. In your own sadistical way, you "controlled" the situation by not bending your ways to accomodate them with having a late dinner. You drove 10 hrs to visit your sister, your kid can be late to bed one night. Maybe the guy had 10 business phonecalls while he was out getting groceries. For you to pull out and leave like that to me was the most immature event that took place throughout the whole story. I feel you owe your sister an apology for the cold exit, but an explanation as to why you reacted like that. One thing I would assume being from the outside is that she has never brought up your income when comparing both of you, maybe offered financial advice which you had taken offense to. Myself making more money than most of my friends, have to be careful about advice I dish out which most of them dont care to hear,or take offense to (for example getting out of credit card debt etc) In the end, it is more important for your daughter to have a fun lasting memory being at her aunt and uncle's hanging with her cousin then to be in bed on time. Sometimes you have to be the better man and suck it up and break your routine and method of controlled chaos. Also in general, most women are biatches, especially succesful ones. They didnt get to where they were by being nice Mr. Rogers wife. No offense women
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Here are my two cents... The both of you were in the wrong. Knowing she is a "control freak" living in controlled chaos, you have to assume and be ready for incidents such as the remote control. You have to accept that you are using her crap and have to follow her rules, but at the same time, i would lighten the situation up by making a wise crack at her about how shes talking to you. In your own sadistical way, you "controlled" the situation by not bending your ways to accomodate them with having a late dinner. You drove 10 hrs to visit your sister, your kid can be late to bed one night. Maybe the guy had 10 business phonecalls while he was out getting groceries. For you to pull out and leave like that to me was the most immature event that took place throughout the whole story. I feel you owe your sister an apology for the cold exit, but an explanation as to why you reacted like that. One thing I would assume being from the outside is that she has never brought up your income when comparing both of you, maybe offered financial advice which you had taken offense to. Myself making more money than most of my friends, have to be careful about advice I dish out which most of them dont care to hear,or take offense to (for example getting out of credit card debt etc) In the end, it is more important for your daughter to have a fun lasting memory being at her aunt and uncle's hanging with her cousin then to be in bed on time. Sometimes you have to be the better man and suck it up and break your routine and method of controlled chaos. Also in general, most women are biatches, especially succesful ones. They didnt get to where they were by being nice Mr. Rogers wife. No offense women I agree... Both are wrong... They are polar opposites for a reason... Or are they really polar opposites? They each have their own "control issues." What I can't figure out is that the trip (and driving 10 hours) even happened in the first place! Not saying that I am perfect, far from it... We all know that everyone has their issues... But, these two seem like you said to both be at fault. Adaptability goes along way, especially when you are on other's "turf". (Believe it or not, the "controlled chaos" child may be better off with adaptabily in the long run... Even know I don't condone the sister's lifestyle). My God! Is there a shaking head emoticon? I guess this will do:
Fan in Chicago Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Did I handle this correctly? Any help or advice is appreciated...thanks I think the reason your sister behaves the way she does with you, is because you sound like a passive person who is perceived as being easy to push around and boss over. Years of 'training' have reinforced her attitude and behavior towards you. You can deal with such personalities in two ways (1) Ignore her and distance her completely from your life (2) Give it back to her in the same fashion she does. If you make the choice to ignore, it is likely she will not let you be. You may have to resort to choice (2) Doing (2) is difficult for a passive personality (I am one also until pushed beyond a point) but sometimes you have no choice. By your preamble, it appears that you have a bit of inferiority complex towards her. If so, be confident about what you are and how you perceive life. Finances do not dictate happiness in any family and obviously you are happy where you are. If you reduce your contact with her, I think you will be a much happier person as you do not have to be bombarded with her constant drive to prove herself superior. Some psychologists may argue that she is the one with the hidden inferiority complex and trying to compensate for it. See if you can use this latest example as a means to reinforce to yourself that you are better off maintaining minimum contact with her. But before you do anything, talk the matter completely with your wife and make sure you are both on the same page. If your wife bypasses you and tries to talk to your wife, she has to display implicit support by taking a similar attitude to yours and deferring to you for any conversations your sister tries to have through her. Good luck, man. Too often people try to trample a person who wants to get along with everybody. Luckily, there aren't too many of such people out there.
Fan in San Diego Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 I just thought of another possibility, meet in neutral locations when visiting. Stay in the local hotel but meet at local parks, museums, zoo's etc. That way the whole control thing is removed and you can enjoy each others company and let the kids play. She can't control the remote or washing machine if your in a zoo!
KD in CA Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 1) I ask if it is ok to watch some TV while the kids go out and play with their respective mothers watching them.... Right there you reinforced that she is a mother/authority figure to you so you shouldn't be surprised when she responds as such. It would never occur to me to ask permission to turn on a TV (or grab a beer out of the fridge, etc.) at one of my siblings houses.
Fan in San Diego Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Right there you reinforced that she is a mother/authority figure to you so you shouldn't be surprised when she responds as such. It would never occur to me to ask permission to turn on a TV (or grab a beer out of the fridge, etc.) at one of my siblings houses. I missed that, your right, I wouldn't either.
IDBillzFan Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Right there you reinforced that she is a mother/authority figure to you so you shouldn't be surprised when she responds as such. Which is why I asked about his parents. My mother died when the six of us kids were pretty young (ranging in age from 5 to 18). To this day, the oldest -- a sister -- is a diabolical control freak who thinks she should dictate every portion of every one else's life. Personally, I keep my son away. Despite being family, she brings nothing to the table of any value.
Buftex Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 I have an older sister (4 years) who is married and lives out of town in VA while I live in NY. I am 38 and she is 42. She is married and has an adopted daughter from China who is 2.5yrs old (very cute and I love her to death) and I have a daughter who is 22 months who amazes me everyday and I love very much like any father would. We lead very different lives...she is a top executive earning 180,000/yr and I barely crack 30,000/yr . She lives her life in controlled chaos. She is highly opinionated, thinks it is "all about her" in life due to her job status, loves money, loves to spend money, loves to yell when she disciplines her daughter, loves confrontation, feels she is entitled to know everything about me, and has zero sense of humor, and walks around with her emotions on her sleeve all the time. My wife and I run a quiet household where discipline is firm and not loud, my daughter is a great kid who listens 98% of the time, gets praise when she puts something away or does something helpful, is very smart, and my wife and I try our hardest to make sure she grows up with a sense of self esteem. We are not the perfect parents by any means and we have our struggles like anyone else. We run a household that is much more low key and less chaotic than my sister. Anyway, the whole point is... we are just two very different people and I am glad she lives far away cause she drives me nuts with her lack of respect for me as a 38 year old man. Her and her husband like to treat me as if I am an invalid who wears depends and lives secluded in a basement and cannot possibly handle life for some reason that is beyond me. Well my wife and I decided that it is important for our daughter to spend time with her cousin even though it is going to require a 10 hour car trip and other expenses on our part. We think it is important for my daughter to see family regardless of what I think of them. So I made sure I try my darndest to "bite my tongue" to be civil when my sister says or does something inappropriate towards me or my family. So we made the trip and went to visit and made sure we stayed in a hotel to get a break when needed. Sure enough not even 1/2 day into our 3 day visit the toxicity starts. Here are some examples.... 1) I ask if it is ok to watch some TV while the kids go out and play with their respective mothers watching them....my sister tells me to not touch anything on the remote in a tone like I was 3 yrs old and proceeds to turn it on for me and shows me how to change the channel and turn the volume up and down on a simple basic remote. (They have no elaborate setup here and I can figure it out myself since I have one at home thank you.) 2) I ask if it is ok to run some wash at her house since the hotel does not have one. She proceeds to tell me that I have only permission to push "power" then "start only"on both units because it is an expensive machine. I own 2 expensive machines at home with many buttons and I have not broken anything so far. (I guess I am too dumb to figure out how to select cycles/temps on a machine which is pretty self explanatory.) 3) We constantly get unsolicited advice and warnings from them about how we should be raising our child and statements like "Just you wait until she reaches 3 then you will know how tough it is like what we are going through now." She tends to imply that we have no idea what it is like to raise a child. Her opinions are the only ones that matter even though her family unit is toxic. 4) Both her and her husband like to yell at their daughter and if my daughter is next to her cousin while the yelling is going on it frightens her and she starts to get scared and cries. They have no concept of how loud they are and to pull their kid aside and discipline them. Needless to say this angers us to no end and we mentioned it to them but it falls on deaf ears. Anyway, after many instances of being talked down to.....the 3rd day into our visit and I have no more tongue left from biting it so hard....Our daughter goes to bed at 7:30-8pm and I let my sis know at 4:45pm that we need to go back to the hotel at 7:30pm after a long visit. My sister proceeds to tell me "7:30?? Isn't that a little early?" Her child has a much later bed time and they are constantly running late for everything they do. The husband goes out to a nearby grocery store to get food to grill on at 4:50pm and the kids and mommies go out to play in the yard after I have received my instruction on how operate the remote . Before I know it it is 6:50pm and no sign of the husband and nothing has happened in the dinner dept. I call my wife on the celll phone outside for privacy and tell her the time and that we need to leave in the near future because her bed time is appproaching around the corner (I would have gladly streched it an extra half hour if necessary but things are not happening like that). So my wife tells my sis outside who calls her husband and asks where the hell is he? To make a long story short he comes huffing into the house at 7:15pm and proceeds to stomp around the house like a little boy and says "after today I am done." to my sister. I of course try to bite my tongue and not get into any arguments but my sister who loves confrontation proceeds to tell me that I made a "federal case out of this." Not wanting to get into an argument or shouting match that my sister loves to do...I pick up my daughter, her things, my things, and proceed to walk out of the house quietly to my car then I call my wife and ask her to come to the car and she does and I say"get in...we are leaving." She reluctently does and tries to do the right thing and calls them and says we are heading back to the hotel. She gets an earful from my sister on the other end who lauches into a tirade about how they bent over backwards for us and that we are being ungrateful....blah...blah...blah. I have had enough emotional abuse from her and her chaotic ways and decide to end the visits so we spend the final day doing other things without them(and enjoying it) and drive home the following morning. My daughter gave us some no so subtle hints she is ready to leave to and had enough. I refuse to get into a fight with a crazy person like her because it is fruitless and I want to set an example for my child. I need space and I am through talking with them and they think I am using the children as a bargaining chip for some reason. We will not do that. Did I handle this correctly? Any help or advice is appreciated...thanks Sorry to hear that man...I think you did everything right. Depressing thing is, I think I may be married to your sister...
JoeFerguson Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Right there you reinforced that she is a mother/authority figure to you so you shouldn't be surprised when she responds as such. It would never occur to me to ask permission to turn on a TV (or grab a beer out of the fridge, etc.) at one of my siblings houses. Yeah, that was a pretty telling statement. If you can't get along with your own siblings then I don't know if I can relate to you.
MarkyMannn Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 and I have a daughter who is 22 months ............... my daughter is a great kid who listens 98% of the time, By my calculations and parental experience, that drops 7% per year so that by the time she is 16 she won't want to hear poop from you
Fan in San Diego Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 By my calculations and parental experience, that drops 7% per year so that by the time she is 16 she won't want to hear poop from you
HelloNewman Posted June 2, 2008 Author Posted June 2, 2008 Thanks for all the feedback from everyone so far. I do have to ask permission for everything in that house because the last time I did not I never heard the end of it so I was damned if I did ask and damned if I did not ask permission. When other relatives come to my house I say "make yourself at home." I try not to control them unless necessary and I see them taking a blow torch to the rug or something . Everyone who says I need to minimize contact with her is absolutely positively correct....perhaps meeting in a neutral place is also a correct solution too. Maybe out of the 4 day trip I take 2 days to visit and then 2 days to do other things without them. Unfortunately she is driven by money and it has affected the way she looks at other people who make less or are not as well off as her. It is sad really because she will just end up pushing people away because she talks down to people and is very judgemental towards them (including me and her own parents too). I do not like confrontation and I have discussed this with her many times to no avail...it just resets itself every time we go down to visit. I have to prove again and again that I am not a retarded 3 year old. When I mention what transpired to my in-laws they lift their eyebrows and wonder what her problem is. Anyway, she does not bring much to the table for me either so why bother? My little niece will still get gifts and presents and cards mailed to her because it is not her fault but for my sanity I need to keep her at a distance and contact to a minimum.
the_franchise Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Yeah, you did the right thing by not shivving her. Although I probably would have said this about the remote deal: "Its a ing remote, unless i missed a meeting with the remote people about the buttons being different I think I can handle it, now cook my pot pie." Something along those lines. Now seeing as how she "bent backwards" for you, you should point it out that you bent over the other way for her. Gas prices, food prices, and everything else that goes into traveling is like getting raped. If you haven't told her that yet you should. And to set the record straight, let her know you cant stand to visit with her for the above reasons and that if she cant fix her issues that it will be sometime before you visit again. Of course doing this in your polite way would probably be the best, if she decides she wants to argue, simple hang up and try on another day. She'll get the point.
BuffaloBud Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 One thought in hindsight, why not ask the BIL if you could ride along to the store and when you get there pick up the tab for some beers / wine with dinner? He might open up and help the cause with sis.
stuckincincy Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 Thanks for all the feedback from everyone so far. I do have to ask permission for everything in that house because the last time I did not I never heard the end of it so I was damned if I did ask and damned if I did not ask permission. When other relatives come to my house I say "make yourself at home." I try not to control them unless necessary and I see them taking a blow torch to the rug or something . Everyone who says I need to minimize contact with her is absolutely positively correct....perhaps meeting in a neutral place is also a correct solution too. Maybe out of the 4 day trip I take 2 days to visit and then 2 days to do other things without them. Unfortunately she is driven by money and it has affected the way she looks at other people who make less or are not as well off as her. It is sad really because she will just end up pushing people away because she talks down to people and is very judgemental towards them (including me and her own parents too). I do not like confrontation and I have discussed this with her many times to no avail...it just resets itself every time we go down to visit. I have to prove again and again that I am not a retarded 3 year old. When I mention what transpired to my in-laws they lift their eyebrows and wonder what her problem is. Anyway, she does not bring much to the table for me either so why bother? My little niece will still get gifts and presents and cards mailed to her because it is not her fault but for my sanity I need to keep her at a distance and contact to a minimum. HelloNewman - They are a pair of self-centered jerks. You will never change that. Forget the psychobabble previously posted. Your sister and BIL violated any and all gracious actions that one affords to a guest - the general idea being that one invites company into one's house because you like them and like to hear what's new, what their thoughts are about friends and family are these days, and to show some amity and generosity of spirit. You tried to be accommodating, but it's proven to be a lost cause. Sorry that that has happened... but you and your wife don't deserve to be stuffing yourselves with antacids over their actions. Perhaps some day they will come around. It's not your job to wait for that. Yes - all have different personalities. Yes - we all shoulder certain things from our family that we would not support for others, because we care and have a history together. So understanding and tolerance is the rule. But rudeness, imperiousness cuts cruel and hard when a special relationship is exploited. By all means, keep up caring about the little niece, in the small ways you can. Sadly, your tale seems to say she will need it - these two seem to be far more in love with themselves than with their little one. Move on - hug your dear wife and child...that's your miracle worked. You can't work one for your sister.
Bmwolf21 Posted June 2, 2008 Posted June 2, 2008 HelloNewman - They are a pair of self-centered jerks. You will never change that. Forget the psychobabble previously posted. Your sister and BIL violated any and all gracious actions that one affords to a guest - the general idea being that one invites company into one's house because you like them and like to hear what's new, what their thoughts are about friends and family are these days, and to show some amity and generosity of spirit. You tried to be accommodating, but it's proven to be a lost cause. Sorry that that has happened... but you and your wife don't deserve to be stuffing yourselves with antacids over their actions. Perhaps some day they will come around. It's not your job to wait for that. Yes - all have different personalities. Yes - we all shoulder certain things from our family that we would not support for others, because we care and have a history together. So understanding and tolerance is the rule. But rudeness, imperiousness cuts cruel and hard when a special relationship is exploited. By all means, keep up caring about the little niece, in the small ways you can. Sadly, your tale seems to say she will need it - these two seem to be far more in love with themselves than with their little one. :blink: Move on - hug your dear wife and child...that's your miracle worked. You can't work one for your sister.
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