Mark my words.......

[Dawgg]

all that matters is stats, or in the case of guys like bob sanders being loved in the media.

 

ow every non lineman is a write off. db's are totally replacable, none have ever made a real contribution to a pro football team. back up left tackles are worth the 11th over all pick tho.

 

oh, and dbs don't help the pass d

 

Yes, because that's what I said

 

Clements was a great player (still is) and I would have rather kept him than overpay for Derrick Dockery. But that's a different story altogether. In any case, you can keep telling yourself over and over again that Whitner is an elite safety... doesn't mean that he is. Maybe this year with a better surrounding cast.

[drnykterstein]

I do not want Dawgg running any team I cheer for, ever.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

I'm a huge Whitner fan (considering dropping some cash for a jersey, actually), but I can't begin to understand the argument that he's an elite NFL safety. You can't just be solid, you need to be seen making an IMPACT on a game to be classed up there.

 

He doesn't really need to be an "elite" safety to be a good pick and a great player, though, so who cares. Oh well, he's not Ed Reed...

[Bill from NYC]

all that matters is stats, or in the case of guys like bob sanders being loved in the media.

 

Did you ever see Ronnie Lott play? I don't have the foggiest idea what his stats were, but HE was an elite safety. Colin, nobody has a right to expect Whitner to be that good, #8 or not, but let's not put him up with the greats until he proves himself.

 

I guess this conversation is centered around how one defines the word "elite," no?

[Ramius]

i see this thread has dug up the last 2 remaining whitner bashers, dawgg and bill.

 

Nothing he does on the field can ever make him good enough in their eyes. Hell, the guy could turn into a HOF safety, and these 2 would be at his induction ceremony unfurling a giant sign that reads "Reach." When interviewed, they would proclaim "well, he is ok, but the bills could have traded down 2 spots, gotten 6 1sts, 2 seconds, 8 3rds and a 4th round draft pick and still taken him."

[Bill from NYC]

i see this thread has dug up the last 2 remaining whitner bashers, dawgg and bill.

 

Nothing he does on the field can ever make him good enough in their eyes. Hell, the guy could turn into a HOF safety, and these 2 would be at his induction ceremony unfurling a giant sign that reads "Reach." When interviewed, they would proclaim "well, he is ok, but the bills could have traded down 2 spots, gotten 6 1sts, 2 seconds, 8 3rds and a 4th round draft pick and still taken him."

 

Wow....did you read my last post in this thread. That was bashing? I have said time and again that Whitner is good. Why don't you tell me whether or not you agree that he is "elite?" Not in the future mind you....now. Is he "elite?"

 

I agree with one premise that you have put forth; it isn't as much about him as it is about how drafting him was a dumb idea.

[colin]

Did you ever see Ronnie Lott play? I don't have the foggiest idea what his stats were, but HE was an elite safety. Colin, nobody has a right to expect Whitner to be that good, #8 or not, but let's not put him up with the greats until he proves himself.

 

I guess this conversation is centered around how one defines the word "elite," no?

 

lott = best ever.

 

there is a whole lot of elite room before you get to the best ever.

 

also JUST LIKE YOUR SUPER FAVORITE POSITION O LINE much of the good stuff secondary players do goes unnoticed. not getting thrown at is the highest compliment to a cover guy.

[stewy23]

Whitner was solid last year...which is a pretty strong endorsement considering how bad our pass defense was.

 

As we all know, things were bad last season:

- opposing QB's had all day to find open receivers

- our defensive backfield was in shambles due to injury

- our defense was on the field way too much due to an ineffective offense

 

If the defense can improve on those three things we'll get a chance to see if Whitner has what it takes to be a premiere safety in the NFL. Right now, he's just plain good (which is a good thing.) I think he has the potential to be great and I really hope that everything around him doesn't fall apart this year and he gets a chance to shine.

[Ramius]

Wow....did you read my last post in this thread. That was bashing? I have said time and again that Whitner is good. Why don't you tell me whether or not you agree that he is "elite?" Not in the future mind you....now. Is he "elite?"

 

I agree with one premise that you have put forth; it isn't as much about him as it is about how drafting him was a dumb idea.

 

perhaps i went a bit overboard. You did seem to be looking positively upon whitner towards the end of last year. Not dawgg, however. Whitner isnt elite yet. But his play was extremely strong last season, especailly given the fact that we had a poor front 7 that he was playing behind, and got virtually no help from the other safety spot. He was alone out there. But, he did play well, and you can see that his play is steadily improving. The kid appears to be a budding star, and i think its easy to see that he's got the potential to be a top-5 safety in the NFL. I would already consider him in the top 12 safeties in the NFL.

 

And for the record, NO, i dont agree with you that drafting him was a dumb idea. Just because there may have been perceived "better" options available doesnt make his selection dumb.

[colin]

perhaps i went a bit overboard. You did seem to be looking positively upon whitner towards the end of last year. Not dawgg, however. Whitner isnt elite yet. But his play was extremely strong last season, especailly given the fact that we had a poor front 7 that he was playing behind, and got virtually no help from the other safety spot. He was alone out there. But, he did play well, and you can see that his play is steadily improving. The kid appears to be a budding star, and i think its easy to see that he's got the potential to be a top-5 safety in the NFL. I would already consider him in the top 12 safeties in the NFL.

 

And for the record, NO, i dont agree with you that drafting him was a dumb idea. Just because there may have been perceived "better" options available doesnt make his selection dumb.

 

alone??!!?

 

he had george mutha effin wilson beside him.

 

and what about greer, king, and kiwanuka? i can name all of those players off the top of my head.

 

sure they might not be "nfl quality" and are one roster move away from "being out of football", but on these boards

those guys are equal to, nay, BETTER THAN clements who is getting 80 million a year (more i think, there's bonuses and stuff, it's complicated).

 

less than 1 (zero actually) corners in the nfl are worth more than league minimum. you win with o line, not with any other position.

[Bill from NYC]

And for the record, NO, i dont agree with you that drafting him was a dumb idea. Just because there may have been perceived "better" options available doesnt make his selection dumb.

 

OK. I remember you saying "don't blame the player" for the selection, but I suppose these are 2 different issues.

 

If Stroud is healthy, and McCargo and Poz make an impact, I feel as if I am entitled to expect a lot from Whitner in terms of making big plays. Both of us have seen safeties take over games. We haven't seen it yet from Donte, perhaps for the reasons you mentioned.

 

The Bills, and Bills Fans need a break. If Whitner can turn into an "elite" player, all the better for us, and I will be the very first to recognize his accomplishment. But, I have a feeling that you already know this.

[Pete]

Did you ever see Ronnie Lott play? I don't have the foggiest idea what his stats were, but HE was an elite safety. Colin, nobody has a right to expect Whitner to be that good, #8 or not, but let's not put him up with the greats until he proves himself.

 

I guess this conversation is centered around how one defines the word "elite," no?

Ronnie Lott set the bar for safety play. Do not forget that Lott started his career at CB. That is not fair, a CB that can deliver huge hits like Lott! As far as today goes, I think Bob Sanders and Troy Polamalu are elite safetys. Whenever I watch them play, it is like are 5 Polamalu's or Sanders's on the field- they are everywhere making plays. I am a big Whitner fan, but until he is as game changing as Polamalu or Sanders, I would consider him very good, but not elite- yet. Sean Taylor was one of my favorite players to watch. He had the potential to be the greatest safety to ever play the game, no offense to Ronnie Lott. So tragic

[Grouse89]

I do not want Dawgg running any team I cheer for, ever.

I completely agree

[Ramius]

OK. I remember you saying "don't blame the player" for the selection, but I suppose these are 2 different issues.

 

If Stroud is healthy, and McCargo and Poz make an impact, I feel as if I am entitled to expect a lot from Whitner in terms of making big plays. Both of us have seen safeties take over games. We haven't seen it yet from Donte, perhaps for the reasons you mentioned.

 

The Bills, and Bills Fans need a break. If Whitner can turn into an "elite" player, all the better for us, and I will be the very first to recognize his accomplishment. But, I have a feeling that you already know this.

 

If theres one thing about you bill that i will never question, its your desire to see the Bills win and do well, no matter what road they take. Its a shame i cant say that about everyone who has posted in this thread.

[Bill from NYC]

Sean Taylor was one of my favorite players to watch. He had the potential to be the greatest safety to ever play the game, no offense to Ronnie Lott. So tragic

 

Potential yes, but I have a feeling that Ronnie Lott put more into it. This is NOT to in any way take a shot at Taylor. I am simply saying that imo, Taylor had even more talent than Lott, but never would have played as well.

 

Again, jmo.

 

PS: I don't know if any films are available but if so, watch some of a safety named Larry Wilson. He was for the most part even before my time, but he was sick.

[Dawgg]

I'm a huge Whitner fan (considering dropping some cash for a jersey, actually), but I can't begin to understand the argument that he's an elite NFL safety. You can't just be solid, you need to be seen making an IMPACT on a game to be classed up there.

 

He doesn't really need to be an "elite" safety to be a good pick and a great player, though, so who cares. Oh well, he's not Ed Reed...

 

Completely agree.

 

Hey I like Whitner too -- seems like a great leader and he definitely puts forth 100%... that said, I know elite when I see it and he simply doesn't fall in that category. I love how people throw the word "elite" around like it's a dime a dozen. To put Whitner in the elite category TODAY, you have to be the ultimate homer. Well... come to think of it, I guess it all makes sense then

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

those guys are equal to, nay, BETTER THAN clements who is getting 80 million a year (more i think, there's bonuses and stuff, it's complicated).

Yes. He's getting more than 80 million a year.

 

I don't know why I read through your drivel, sometimes.

[Dawgg]

Whitner isnt elite yet.

 

This, I agree with. I will take it further by saying he has quite a ways to go before he reaches "elite" status.

 

But his play was extremely strong last season, especailly given the fact that we had a poor front 7 that he was playing behind, and got virtually no help from the other safety spot. He was alone out there. But, he did play well, and you can see that his play is steadily improving.

 

I'd agree with this too.

 

The kid appears to be a budding star, and i think its easy to see that he's got the potential to be a top-5 safety in the NFL. I would already consider him in the top 12 safeties in the NFL.

 

Potential? Of course, that's why he was drafted where he was. But he's not elite today, nor is he close.

[colin]

Yes. He's getting more than 80 million a year.

 

I don't know why I read through your drivel, sometimes.

 

 

you're 12 and haven't heard of sarcasm.

 

it's the only possibility.

[Bflojohn]

Just my two cents.... the premise of this post is that Donte Whitner will elevate his game into an elite status. My feelings are that with the offseason moves being complete, it is NOT out of the realm of possibilities that Mr. Whitner could, indeed, achieve this lofty goal. Now, will he?? I would err on the side that he will remain a vital cog in a highly improved defense going forward. By the way, I'd also offer that elite, to me, would be a series of Pro Bowl appearances and furthermore, Donte is getting awfully close to that type of recognition, IMO!!! I seriously hope he gets there for all our sakes, including his!!!