who tinkled in Jerry's cornflakes this a.m. J.P.?

[ExiledInIllinois]

Maybe JP pissed in his own cornflakes and blackballed himself by his own doing... Who in the world wants a guy calling out the coaching staf and owner...

 

Good luck JP... Unfortunately, Ralph is too cheap to see you on your way... He has got to be a major distraction this year... And that spells trouble!

 

Just my two cents... Wow, this situation really sucks... If I was Ralph, I would send this kid on his rich way... Everybody makes mistakes, to think they will get juice out of this turnip is preposterous.

[Mickey]

Whatever. The crusade is getting tired, I must say. The offense wasn't historically bad because of Jauron. It sucked under Mularkey, and it sucked for two out thre three years Williams was here. Anyway, I suggesting sticking to the topic at hand -- Losman -- and not blaming Jauron for his performance (an utterly unverifiable charge in any event). Do you honestly think JP's been hamstrung by the coaching? From my perch, I saw him perform poorly in the last few outings he played in (sans the Cincy game), and it's not as if he didn't have the opportunity to make plays. I like JP and am not unhappy that he's our backup, but he's not a very good NFL QB. He may be one day, but he ain't now. When's the last time you saw a positive comment about JP from a member of *any* other team in the league?

That was the worst offense in the history of the franchise. We could bicker about whether it was slightly less historically bad with Trent behind center than it was with JP but the bottom line was that the offense simply sucked. I can't even imagine not holding the head coach and the OC responsible for such poor production. That is very much the kind of performance that gets QB's benched and head coaches fired. Jauron gets a pass because he hasn't been the coach that long and the horrendous injury situation gives him a pretty good excuse. If JP does end up the backup and the team doesn't play a lot better this year, then JP and DJ might end up sharing a ride out of town.

[nucci]

Maybe JP pissed in his own cornflakes and blackballed himself by his own doing... Who in the world wants a guy calling out the coaching staf and owner...

 

Good luck JP... Unfortunately, Ralph is too cheap to see you on your way... He has got to be a major distraction this year... And that spells trouble!

 

Just my two cents... Wow, this situation really sucks... If I was Ralph, I would send this kid on his rich way... Everybody makes mistakes, to think they will get juice out of this turnip is preposterous.

Contracts are not guaranteed. It will cost Wilson nothing to cut Losman. I am so sick of these stupid comments of Ralph being cheap.

[ExiledInIllinois]

Contracts are not guaranteed. It will cost Wilson nothing to cut Losman. I am so sick of these stupid comments of Ralph being cheap.

 

I didn't know that... Sorry Ralph!

 

[K-9]

Injuries...

 

They lost a starting DE for 11 games, replaced by another DE they signed to a fat contract. They lost a serviceable pedestrian LB who wasn't going to be on anyone's All-Pro list, for 10 games, and a 2nd round rookie who showed better than his camp competition at the LB spot. And would have gotten an education about playing in the NFL had he not been injured. A RB for 3 games. An intact OL save 1 and one half games missed by the LT.

 

Most clubs would be very happy with so few losses to the starting 22.

 

I appreciate what you're saying but you have to look at the context of ALL the injuries as they occurred. The fact they DIDN'T lose All Pros is not the point. The point is they lost guys penciled in as STARTERS or who would have gotten serious playing time in the front 7 rotation. They lost depth, to say the least. Especially early on waiting for Hargrove to get back. So yeah little impact on the STARTING 22 but a helluva LOT on the depth chart. How did they set a record for most guys on IR?

 

The key was the secondary though. Lost their starting safety, then the backup. Lost their starting CB and Nickel. Losing their MLB, the key to successful cover 2 pass D in the Bills' version was critical. Sure he was a rook and again not an ALL Pro, but he got ALL the reps that mattered and I'm pretty sure the Bills didn't want DeGorgio to start.

 

The injuries forced the Bills to alter their schemes along the front seven dramatically. Fewell, to his credit was able to adapt to the personnel changes but he didn't have the freedom or flexibility to do some of the things he wanted due to the limitations of both talent and experience he was forced to play.

 

All of that had an impact on what the Bills offensive philosophy would be. During the first half of the season especially after JP went down, all bets were off. They HAD to go conservative to protect a vulnerable (at best) defense and a rookie greenhorn QB with a rookie RB and little help other than Evans at receiver.

 

Unlike those who detest Jauron, I would say he did his BEST coaching by playing close to the vest and protecting his injured defense as best he could with a VERY limited offense.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Bill from NYC]

I just took that as a random number when Sullivan wrote that "it divided the team". If it were just Evans and a couple others, he would have said it.

 

I think it's probably accurate, 50-50, although the vast majority of the players likely aren't taking sides at all, and will support whomever is in there. They probably like both of them. It's pretty obvious they both have strengths and weaknesses. It's pretty obvious that they are both good guys and team players and their teammates probably like them both a lot.

 

It's also self-evident that players don't like to be jerked around by management and feel for their teammates that do, especially when money is involved. And they know Losman was screwed out of a lot of money (at least from a player's perspective, management may have an entirely different view on this). They also probably very much respect what he did last year by not making a stink.

 

I don't necessarily agree with the rest of your post, but the bolded makes a great point. Seriously, I cannot argue this at all.

 

I guess it comes down to Trent "winning" over the locker room. I strongly believe that he has the talent to do just that, but I guess we will have to wait and see.

[K-9]

I just took that as a random number when Sullivan wrote that "it divided the team". If it were just Evans and a couple others, he would have said it.

 

I think it's probably accurate, 50-50, although the vast majority of the players likely aren't taking sides at all, and will support whomever is in there. They probably like both of them. It's pretty obvious they both have strengths and weaknesses. It's pretty obvious that they are both good guys and team players and their teammates probably like them both a lot.

 

It's also self-evident that players don't like to be jerked around by management and feel for their teammates that do, especially when money is involved. And they know Losman was screwed out of a lot of money (at least from a player's perspective, management may have an entirely different view on this). They also probably very much respect what he did last year by not making a stink.

 

I assume you're talking about his incentive clause vis-a-vis the number of snaps he took in '07? Simply put, JP screwed himself by not KEEPING the job the SECOND time he was given a chance to last season. Even after the NE debacle the coaches gave him another opportunity to prove himself against Jax the following week. Again, he screwed the pooch. Had he done enough to hold onto the job, he would have had the requisite number of plays EASILY. He would have had 11 starts plus the quarter against the Jets.

 

What players do you know for sure feel JP was 'screwed' out of a lot of money? Other than JP himself I mean. This myth that the Bills sat him so they wouldn't have to pay that incentive is COMPLETE BS. Quite the contrary, it is one they HOPE to pay and one that's also considered easily attainable, barring injury.

 

WRT the injury question, I've asked someone to get me some clarification on JP's clause as I'm interested to know if the language stipulates that the player has to be 'able' to perform as defined by team doctors. If that's the case then at least two complete games and nearly ALL of the first NE game are discounted thus making it even EASIER for JP to have attained the bonus.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[IDBillzFan]

No. I think Jerry is spot on... Why the phuck is JP still here? Because nobody wants him.

 

But it hasn’t happened, and I suspect there’s one main reason: No one wanted him, not enough to give up anything of consequence. The Bills keep saying they don’t intend to deal him. The more they say it, the more evident it becomes that they’re worried people will think they’re desperate to get rid of him.

I have no problem with people agreeing with the moron.

[Kelly the Dog]

I assume you're talking about his incentive clause vis-a-vis the number of snaps he took in '07? Simply put, JP screwed himself by not KEEPING the job the SECOND time he was given a chance to last season. Even after the NE debacle the coaches gave him another opportunity to prove himself against Jax the following week. Again, he screwed the pooch. Had he done enough to hold onto the job, he would have had the requisite number of plays EASILY. He would have had 11 starts plus the quarter against the Jets.

 

What players do you know for sure feel JP was 'screwed' out of a lot of money? Other than JP himself I mean. This myth that the Bills sat him so they wouldn't have to pay that incentive is COMPLETE BS. Quite the contrary, it is one they HOPE to pay and one that's also considered easily attainable, barring injury.

 

WRT the injury question, I've asked someone to get me some clarification on JP's clause as I'm interested to know if the language stipulates that the player has to be 'able' to perform as defined by team doctors. If that's the case then at least two complete games and nearly ALL of the first NE game are discounted thus making it even EASIER for JP to have attained the bonus.

 

GO BILLS!!!

It was taken before they put him in the second time. I know it pretty much for a fact, from a person directly involved, at least as much as one can know without being in the room. I do know for a fact that Losman himself is 100% convinced of it, and was told that is what happened. It was something like taking 80% of the snaps. Once he was ready to play, they kept Trent in for a couple more games, under Ralph's order. As soon as he couldn't reach the 80% they wouldn't have cared whether he was in or not (for the money purposes). The injury to Trent was an easy way to do it, and they couldn't take him out after a couple easy wins.

 

I agree, however, that he had a crappy year. And if he played better, there wouldn't have been a question. But players do not like the fact that money makes decisions, let alone losing 3-5 million dollars, which is what happened, and why he was pissed.

[K-9]

It was taken before they put him in the second time. I know it pretty much for a fact, from a person directly involved, at least as much as one can know without being in the room. I do know for a fact that Losman himself is 100% convinced of it, and was told that is what happened. It was something like taking 80% of the snaps. Once he was ready to play, they kept Trent in for a couple more games, under Ralph's order. As soon as he couldn't reach the 80% they wouldn't have cared whether he was in or not (for the money purposes). The injury to Trent was an easy way to do it, and they couldn't take him out after a couple easy wins.

 

I agree, however, that he had a crappy year. And if he played better, there wouldn't have been a question. But players do not like the fact that money makes decisions, let alone losing 3-5 million dollars, which is what happened, and why he was pissed.

 

Yeah, I see by the math that he could have had 11.25 starts which gets him a little more than 70% of potential plays. I'm still not sure if injury plays into it or not. If he's unable to play due to injury, do those games get stricken? I'm waiting to hear back from someone on that.

 

I'd be pissed, too. But as you suggested, I'd feel better about being pissed if I KNEW I played better than TE and had CONVINCED everyone of that.

 

If the Bills' coaching staff was convinced, at the very LEAST, that Edwards represented an equal or better chance of being as successful as JP with our offense, then they did the fiscally responsible thing, player opinions aside. I just can't see RW ignoring the coaches but then again he wanted Johnson to start against the Titans so anything's possible I guess.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[colin]

in 4 years jp

was day one starter 3 times

has been injured 3 times

has lost his job 3 times, to holcomb and a 3rd round raw rookie

 

he had a decent PER in 06, but that was a result of a couple of good games over taking bad games where he was simply asked to be a care taker (and still managed to get sacked or fumbe about once every 6 drop backs).

 

he's just not a good qb. everyone else can see it.

[tombstone56]

That was the worst offense in the history of the franchise. We could bicker about whether it was slightly less historically bad with Trent behind center than it was with JP but the bottom line was that the offense simply sucked. I can't even imagine not holding the head coach and the OC responsible for such poor production. That is very much the kind of performance that gets QB's benched and head coaches fired. Jauron gets a pass because he hasn't been the coach that long and the horrendous injury situation gives him a pretty good excuse. If JP does end up the backup and the team doesn't play a lot better this year, then JP and DJ might end up sharing a ride out of town.

 

you should know fairchild did not allow jp to audible,, thats where the riff between jp and coach fairchild started ,, offense would come to line d in 8 front ,, and he wasnt allowed to audible out ,how many times would you go to in knowing your going to get killed and not be able to change play before you got cynical?...occasionally i guess he would do it anyway to save getting killed.,so he was in doghouse alot!

 

jp first yr ,,broke leg thanks to troy vincent

jp second yr played behind a line that that just plain sucked, thats why they arent here now

jp third year gets chopped and injured by NE ,never the same,

jp this year .. still to be written,,who knows?.....

 

FAIRCHILD is history that will help whoever is at qb

 

with league emphasis on pass rush and rushers I doubt any team will have their original starter for full season in 08 !!

[Guest dog14787]

No. I think Jerry is spot on... Why the phuck is JP still here? Because nobody wants him.

 

But it hasn’t happened, and I suspect there’s one main reason: No one wanted him, not enough to give up anything of consequence. The Bills keep saying they don’t intend to deal him. The more they say it, the more evident it becomes that they’re worried people will think they’re desperate to get rid of him.

 

JP Losman is here because we want him and we are not prepared to give up on him yet. Its no surprise to me that he was not traded and that Buffalo, regardless of JP's wishes, let everyone know imediately they had no intention of letting him go for next to nothing.

 

JP still has a big percentage of the fan base that believes in him and I would imagine the coaching staff and front office feels the same way.

 

No, were not giving JP away for nothing because he's worth something, and yes its probably more than anyone is willing to give us right now, but it would make zero sense to give him up when we need a backup. JP is and always has been a team first player. He will not be a distraction and any fan with half at least half a brain should realize we are fortunate to have two good QB's instead of one.

[Flbillsfan#1]

Yeah, I see by the math that he could have had 11.25 starts which gets him a little more than 70% of potential plays. I'm still not sure if injury plays into it or not. If he's unable to play due to injury, do those games get stricken? I'm waiting to hear back from someone on that.

 

I'd be pissed, too. But as you suggested, I'd feel better about being pissed if I KNEW I played better than TE and had CONVINCED everyone of that.

 

If the Bills' coaching staff was convinced, at the very LEAST, that Edwards represented an equal or better chance of being as successful as JP with our offense, then they did the fiscally responsible thing, player opinions aside. I just can't see RW ignoring the coaches but then again he wanted Johnson to start against the Titans so anything's possible I guess.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Injuries do not matter. Garcia in Tampa just missed out on big incentive due to injury.

[IDBillzFan]

JP still has a big percentage of the fan base that believes in him and I would imagine the coaching staff and front office feels the same way.

That can't be true because Colin says everyone knows that JP sucks. Others have stated that every GM in the NFL knows JP sucks. Hell, even Jerry Sullivan knows JP sucks.

 

So apparently the entire free world knows that JP sucks except a handful of us who don't know what we're talking about because we disagree with online fans who apparently are all-knowing.

[K-9]

Injuries do not matter. Garcia in Tampa just missed out on big incentive due to injury.

 

Appreciate the input re Garcia and wouldn't be surprised if JP's language is the same. I'll let you know when I hear back from someone who's looking into it for me. Thanks.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[colin]

That can't be true because Colin says everyone knows that JP sucks. Others have stated that every GM in the NFL knows JP sucks. Hell, even Jerry Sullivan knows JP sucks.

 

So apparently the entire free world knows that JP sucks except a handful of us who don't know what we're talking about because we disagree with online fans who apparently are all-knowing.

 

where do you actually think jp ranks in the qbs of the nfl?

 

keep in mind on our own team he is number 2 next a guy who beat him out in his rookie season.

 

what nfl team(s) do you think jp would start for?

[Adam]

JP is at least a good backup. In his "big year" he led the team to a decent 7-9 record with a line that had yet to be fixed and few weapons (I think we had an ancient Moulds that year). Last year, he was scattershot with a still weak offensive group.

 

He went into the game against the Jets and jumpstarted the offense.

 

While I am not saying to give him the starting job or even let him compete for it, I will say that he is a competent NFL quarterback. Jerry Sullivan has not shown he is competent at his job

[1billsfan]

where do you actually think jp ranks in the qbs of the nfl?

 

keep in mind on our own team he is number 2 next a guy who beat him out in his rookie season.

 

what nfl team(s) do you think jp would start for?

 

 

If he were given a fair shot at competing?...

 

He could definitely win the starting QB job for these NFL teams...Bills, Jets, Dolphins, Texans, Raiders, Chiefs, Redskins, Vikings, Bears, Panthers, Falcons, 49ers.

[IDBillzFan]

where do you actually think jp ranks in the qbs of the nfl?

 

keep in mind on our own team he is number 2 next a guy who beat him out in his rookie season.

 

what nfl team(s) do you think jp would start for?

The difference is that I try not to pretend that I know something which I don't know, and then try to pass it off as gospel.

 

What I DO know, and what folks like yourself refuse to accept or even acknowledge, is that no one knows how JP ranks because (as I've stated here a number of times in the past), he's been treated and managed only slightly better than a Britney Spears newborn. Add to that all the weaknesses on the team from a roster standpoint (no #2 WR, TE) and then add to THAT the horrific and downright perplexing playcalling by Fairchild, and THEN add to that the embarrassing and inexcusable fact that neither quarterback was allowed to audible out of some horrible playcalling, and it is impossible...goddamn impossible...for you or anyone else who spends time as an online fan to know jack shiit about what JP can or can not do or how he ranks.

 

For some reason, people like you and Jerry Sullivan simply refuse to accept or acknowledge any of these conditions.