OL in the first round WTF!

[OCinBuffalo]

Yes but big bodies usually pan out well early in the draft, as opposed to tiny skill guys.

You mean like the tiny skill guy we drafted #1, 14th overall last year? Yeah I'd would rather have another guard, on a team that already has 3 good ones, than Mashawn Lynch. How about that tiny skill guy, Peyton Manning, or his brother Eli? Or the list of 100s of solid to HOF skill players drafted in the first round? Yeah, I'm sure their teams wished they had drafted a guard instead.

 

This team shouldn't subscribe to either "skills guys always" or "big guys always" thinking. Ever!. Instead, we need to pick the best player available, based on his grade and our draft position, and what the coaching staff wants to emphasize, that's it.

 

Enough of this dogmatic, "good GM draft big guy first, me like", mentality. It is lame. We're talking about a very involved, very complicated set of problems to solve when we talk about the draft, and simplistic thinking very rarely solves complex problems. In this case, this year, we have needs at CB and WR(I personally would add C). Second priority is TE, the lines, and backup QB, third is the rest. That's what we need to worry about this year. Unless we solve the problems we are facing this year, they will remain as problems next year. You can't fix a whole team with one draft pick. What is hard to understand about that?

 

Case in point, we drafted Whitner because he was a "this year" solution to a "this year" problem. Levy knew darn well that you can't fix an entire offensive line with one draft pick, so he didn't choose the stupid option, as donahoe did, and try. Rather, he fixed a single position with a high choice that he knew would solve the problem, and he was right. Then he did what he did in FA, and that was right.

 

Now, precisely because of the players drafted over the last 2 years, we are talking about fixing 1-3 spots, instead of talking about entire units on O and D needing to be replaced. If that is not obvious progress, I don't know what is.

 

Edit: BTW, the more I read about this guard from Virginia, the more I like. IF he is there and IF he is the best graded player at the time, and IF somebody can make a case to me why we need to do better than Dockery and Butler while at the same time passing up a chance to do better at WR/trade down, then I am all ears. Pass all those ifs and I wouldn't mind seeing him here.

[bernie]

If Branden Albert OL Virginia is there at 11 and the Bill take him I would be fine with that. Put him at RG and we are a center away from a great OL

[BillsFan Trapped in Pats Land]

Mike Williams really played well, didn't he.

Robert Gallery, Kenyatta Walker, the road to hell is paved with failed 1st round o lineman.

[Dibs]

Yes but big bodies usually pan out well early in the draft, as opposed to tiny skill guys.

That is really not the case inkman. There have been a huge number of busts with the big bodies drafted early.....particularly at OT & DE.

 

I've done a quick check & found however that OG looks to be the safest pick in the first round out of all positions.

In the last 14 drafts there have been 13 OGs selected in the first round & none......I repeat none of them have been what most would call 'busts'. This is an amazing figure! It seems to be that evaluating talent at the OG position is much easier to do than with every other position.

The only negative with the Albert situation is that of the 13 OGs drafted, only 4 were selected above 20(19,17,14,10). IMO this is perhaps more an indication of the positions perceived importance rather than any real 'talent' factor.

 

I would be very happy if we drafted Albert......however there are two questions in my mind which I would want answered before I was totally sold on the choice.

1: How good/bad is Butler?

2: Can any of our OLs(including Albert) play C?

These Qs to me are important because as I see it we are locked at LT, LG & RT for the near future & if Butler is going to blossom into a solid+ OG......and with C being our major area of need on the OL.....if we can't replace C then even though it would probably be a good pick & a safe pick it would be a wasted pick.

[Sen. John Blutarsky]

I would be less than pissed with that selection. All skill players get way better when the QB gets 5 seconds to throw and the RBs can run through holes the size of Mike Williams' arse.

 

WR's will still be there later. We've still got ammo to move back up for a corner if we want one.

[Sen. John Blutarsky]

The only negative with the Albert situation is that of the 13 OGs drafted, only 4 were selected above 20(19,17,14,10). IMO this is perhaps more an indication of the positions perceived importance rather than any real 'talent' factor.

Lends even more credence to being able to swap with Philly, add Sheppard, draft Albert and get a WR in round 2. Anyone have beef with that scenario? I'm stupidly happy if that happens.

[stinky finger]

Robert Gallery, Kenyatta Walker, the road to hell is paved with failed 1st round o lineman.

How exactly have the Lions fared with their WRs, who, BTW, were MUCH more heralded than this group.?

 

Trenches, my friend. It begins and ends with the OL & DL. EVERYTHING else works off of them.

[Dibs]

How exactly have the Lions fared with their WRs, who, BTW, were MUCH more heralded than this group.?

 

Trenches, my friend. It begins and ends with the OL & DL. EVERYTHING else works off of them.

Robert Gallery #2 overall

Mike Williams #4

Leonard Davis #2

Gerard Warren #3

Andre Carter #7

Courtney Brown #1

etc, etc, etc

 

One could just as easily say....."How exactly did the Cardinals fare with their drafting for the lines?" In 9 years(1996-2003) they drafted 6 linemen in the 1st round(3, 3, 21, 2, 12, 18). Again I find myself saying that the most important part of drafting is picking a player(regardless of position) who actually ends up a quality NFL player for the team that drafts him.

 

One argument it to say that drafting the lines is the better tactic to build a good team(which I subscribe to myself).

It is a totally different argument to say one should draft the lines because the bust rate is better than WR......which it isn't.....or at least not dramatically.

[Steely Dan]

I think that might be the only way the pick makes sense. Walker was pretty good last year though. He's no chump.

 

I agree but imagine if he was a depth guy. That'd be even better.

 

 

You mean like the tiny skill guy we drafted #1, 14th overall last year? Yeah I'd would rather have another guard, on a team that already has 3 good ones, than Mashawn Lynch. How about that tiny skill guy, Peyton Manning, or his brother Eli? Or the list of 100s of solid to HOF skill players drafted in the first round? Yeah, I'm sure their teams wished they had drafted a guard instead.

 

This team shouldn't subscribe to either "skills guys always" or "big guys always" thinking. Ever!. Instead, we need to pick the best player available, based on his grade and our draft position, and what the coaching staff wants to emphasize, that's it.

 

Enough of this dogmatic, "good GM draft big guy first, me like", mentality. It is lame. We're talking about a very involved, very complicated set of problems to solve when we talk about the draft, and simplistic thinking very rarely solves complex problems. In this case, this year, we have needs at CB and WR(I personally would add C). Second priority is TE, the lines, and backup QB, third is the rest. That's what we need to worry about this year. Unless we solve the problems we are facing this year, they will remain as problems next year. You can't fix a whole team with one draft pick. What is hard to understand about that?

 

Case in point, we drafted Whitner because he was a "this year" solution to a "this year" problem. Levy knew darn well that you can't fix an entire offensive line with one draft pick, so he didn't choose the stupid option, as donahoe did, and try. Rather, he fixed a single position with a high choice that he knew would solve the problem, and he was right. Then he did what he did in FA, and that was right.

 

Now, precisely because of the players drafted over the last 2 years, we are talking about fixing 1-3 spots, instead of talking about entire units on O and D needing to be replaced. If that is not obvious progress, I don't know what is.

 

Edit: BTW, the more I read about this guard from Virginia, the more I like. IF he is there and IF he is the best graded player at the time, and IF somebody can make a case to me why we need to do better than Dockery and Butler while at the same time passing up a chance to do better at WR/trade down, then I am all ears. Pass all those ifs and I wouldn't mind seeing him here.

 

One of those guys would be great as a depth guy and Albert would upgrade the line and....

 

 

I would be less than pissed with that selection. All skill players get way better when the QB gets 5 seconds to throw and the RBs can run through holes the size of Mike Williams' arse.

 

WR's will still be there later. We've still got ammo to move back up for a corner if we want one.

 

What he said.

 

 

How exactly have the Lions fared with their WRs, who, BTW, were MUCH more heralded than this group.?

 

Trenches, my friend. It begins and ends with the OL & DL. EVERYTHING else works off of them.

 

Run and stop the run. Football 101.

[stinky finger]

Robert Gallery #2 overall

Mike Williams #4

Leonard Davis #2

Gerard Warren #3

Andre Carter #7

Courtney Brown #1

etc, etc, etc

 

One could just as easily say....."How exactly did the Cardinals fare with their drafting for the lines?" In 9 years(1996-2003) they drafted 6 linemen in the 1st round(3, 3, 21, 2, 12, 18). Again I find myself saying that the most important part of drafting is picking a player(regardless of position) who actually ends up a quality NFL player for the team that drafts him.

 

One argument it to say that drafting the lines is the better tactic to build a good team(which I subscribe to myself).

It is a totally different argument to say one should draft the lines because the bust rate is better than WR......which it isn't.....or at least not dramatically.

Point being, The OL & DL are more important. I understand it's not foolproof, but fortifying the lines is always smart. Not to mention we're an injury away from trouble. It seems to me a false sense of security with our OL.

[inkman]

Robert Gallery #2 Raiders

Mike Williams #4 Bills

Leonard Davis #2 Cardinals

Gerard Warren #3 Browns

Andre Carter #7 49ers

Courtney Brown #1 Browns

Maybe the teams drafting these players should come into question.

[inkman]

This team shouldn't subscribe to either "skills guys always" or "big guys always" thinking. Ever!. Instead, we need to pick the best player available, based on his grade and our draft position, and what the coaching staff wants to emphasize, that's it.

Yes and I hope this franchise has the people in place to make the right choice. They did well last year and based on that I will give them the benefit of doubt.

[Dibs]

Maybe the teams drafting these players should come into question.

You are implying that those teams drafted those players when all 'the good' teams would not have done so......and let them drop out of the 1st round.

Far more likely that those teams have underperformed due to those players busting out.

[Sherman]

In today rag, which sucks here the football writer says OL in the first round for the Bills. Branden Albert from VA. I think the bills need more help somewhere else. By the way first wideout goes to dallas.

 

Could he or Butler be converted to center?

[Orton's Arm]

Edit: BTW, the more I read about this guard from Virginia, the more I like. IF he is there and IF he is the best graded player at the time, and IF somebody can make a case to me why we need to do better than Dockery and Butler while at the same time passing up a chance to do better at WR/trade down, then I am all ears. Pass all those ifs and I wouldn't mind seeing him here.

I've been thinking about this guy, and I'm not so sure taking him would represent the best possible move.

• Brad Butler is a solid if unspectacular player. This team has bigger needs than finding an upgrade to him.
  
• I've read that Albert sometimes takes downs off; which is not something I want to see in an offensive lineman. I'd welcome comments about this from those who have seen this guy play.
  
• Some teams seem to be thinking in terms of moving Albert to tackle, which is typically a higher paid position. That shouldn't create any problems right away. But once his first contract is done; he might decide he can get more money elsewhere, by moving to tackle, than by staying in Buffalo and remaining a guard.
  

Taking Albert probably wouldn't be a disaster. In fact, it would probably be a pretty good move; allowing the Bills to significantly upgrade the right guard position. I just feel there are other ways the 11th overall pick could be used that would help this team more than Albert would.

[Dr. Fong]

I don't have a problem with taking an OL in the first round. Just not so sure about THIS OL. Drafting for need only keeps you spinning your wheels you need to improve the overall talent of your team to be successful.