Calvin Johnson

[Bill from NYC]

1) How many would give up a 1st and 2nd this season, and a 1st and 3rd in 08?

 

2) Would this even be enough to get him?

 

If anyone cares, I would actually be willing to make this trade. The Bills OL has improved, and if Johnson is even almost as good as advertised, this would give the Bills the best pair of receivers that I can remember on any football team in many years.

Backs are easy to get as compared to other positions, and perhaps we could luck out and find another LB in the draft.

 

I know this is far fetched, but we have little else to talk about.

[R. Rich]

1. Not I

 

2. It would depend on the asking price and @ which pick the offer is made. For the top overall pick? Probably not, but for the 3rd overall? Who knows?

[Bill from NYC]

1. Not I

 

2. It would depend on the asking price and @ which pick the offer is made. For the top overall pick? Probably not, but for the 3rd overall? Who knows?

 

Rich, Badol says that Johnson has more talent coming out of college than Michael Westbrook. Were you there when he said that?

Do you agree?

[R. Rich]

Johnson has a world of talent. He's got great size, speed, hands, runs good routes, and can really do some special things on the field. That said, to give up 4 draft picks for the guy, and then be @ a disadvantage in two drafts, I'd have to pass. The NFL has become a league where turnover is far too quick to count on anything, such as a refurbished OL or a young core of QB/WR/RB, to remain intact past even one season. If the move backfires (guys leave in FA, get injured, flop, etc.), then you've not only stunted the team's growth yet again, but you've got an even longer recovery period to wait due to the lost picks. I'd rather just wait and see what the Bills can get w/ the picks we do have.

[Dawgg]

NO WAY.

 

If the Bills were one player away, then we can talk. But this team has too many holes to justify a trade like that.

 

1) How many would give up a 1st and 2nd this season, and a 1st and 3rd in 08?

 

2) Would this even be enough to get him?

 

If anyone cares, I would actually be willing to make this trade. The Bills OL has improved, and if Johnson is even almost as good as advertised, this would give the Bills the best pair of receivers that I can remember on any football team in many years.

Backs are easy to get as compared to other positions, and perhaps we could luck out and find another LB in the draft.

 

I know this is far fetched, but we have little else to talk about.

[Last Guy on the Bench]

Though it's a tempting thought, I don't think I'd take Johnson even if happened to have the 1st pick in the draft. I do think he's the best player, but it would throw our payroll way out of whack and result in our losing Lee Evans.

 

Lee's going to be up for a monster contract in a few years (I think he has three to go on his original one). There is no way we could re-sign him and carry a contract like Johnson's at the same position. I don't think you can spend that big a chunk of your cap on just the WR position. Perhaps Johnson will be better than Evans (everyone seems to think he'll be an all-timer, but we'll see). But is he better than Evans AND say Adrian Peterson (or fill in any other big name draftee/free agent superstar)? I doubt it.

 

It's tough to overspend on any one position, but at times it may be worth it along the lines or in the defensive backfield. I don't think WRs have enough of an impact on the game to carry two superstar contracts.

 

I'm sure there are many that would happily let Evans go in two or three years if we had Johnson. But I think that's a fool's game. It hurts the psyche of a team to jettison your best players just because something new and shiny comes along. I know this is all hypothetical anyway, but I say we should be working to keep Evans in a Bills uniform into the twilight of his career and spread our other big contracts around to other positions.

 

(That being said, I'd be as excited as anyone to see what Evans and Johnson could do together for a year or two.)

[Bill from NYC]

Though it's a tempting thought, I don't think I'd take Johnson even if happened to have the 1st pick in the draft. I do think he's the best player, but it would throw our payroll way out of whack and result in our losing Lee Evans.

 

Lee's going to be up for a monster contract in a few years (I think he has three to go on his original one). There is no way we could re-sign him and carry a contract like Johnson's at the same position. I don't think you can spend that big a chunk of your cap on just the WR position. Perhaps Johnson will be better than Evans (everyone seems to think he'll be an all-timer, but we'll see). But is he better than Evans AND say Adrian Peterson (or fill in any other big name draftee/free agent superstar)? I doubt it.

 

It's tough to overspend on any one position, but at times it may be worth it along the lines or in the defensive backfield. I don't think WRs have enough of an impact on the game to carry two superstar contracts.

 

I'm sure there are many that would happily let Evans go in two or three years if we had Johnson. But I think that's a fool's game. It hurts the psyche of a team to jettison your best players just because something new and shiny comes along. I know this is all hypothetical anyway, but I say we should be working to keep Evans in a Bills uniform into the twilight of his career and spread our other big contracts around to other positions.

 

(That being said, I'd be as excited as anyone to see what Evans and Johnson could do together for a year or two.)

 

You make some great points, but I take exception to your comments wrt defensive backs.

We just let one of the best in the game get away. He was most certainly one of our best players, no?

 

That said, you are right. It is completely hypothetical, and I am not trying to make a strong case to trade for CJ.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

As great of a talent Calvin Johnson is. I dont think you win football games with the premiere wideout. I'd much rather live by the old adage of run the ball and stop the run to win football games then cater to the madden crazy crowd and espn showoffs. Give me boring grind it out football 150- 175 yard rushing efforts with an average passing game over the air it out style. Calvin Johnson is really tempting because he has all the talent in the world. Great speed off the snap. Willing to go over the middle. Andre Johnson v 2 but faster and better.

 

I'd be much more willing if he slips to give up our 1st and 2nd and next years first to move up to 5-6 to take adrian peterson, Which is pretty much about what we gave up for JP Losman, and we'd still be able to adress the right guard position as well as get more defensive line help, so corners like mcgee wont be as terribly exposed as the weak link that he is.

[Last Guy on the Bench]

You make some great points, but I take exception to your comments wrt defensive backs.

We just let onne of the best in the game get away. He was most certainly one of our best players, no?

 

What, you don't think at times it would be OK to spend all of your day one picks and half your payroll on DBs?

 

I don't either, generally, but I do think paying a superstar CB and a superstar Safety on some teams make sense (e.g., Chris McAlister and Ed Reed.) I think paying two superstar receivers almost never makes sense, though the 2006 Colts and the 1999 Rams seem to throw a wrench into that argument.

 

As for Nate, yes he was one of our best players, and I was sad to see him go, but I think it made sense for two reasons:

 

1) It wasn't because we wanted some other shiny new corner (e.g., Samuel); it was because we were shifting priorities and money to other parts of the team (OL). A totally different thing.

 

2) Like most of our big name defensive players, Nate was outstanding in a lot of ways, but not really a gamebreaker. This defense has driven me crazy for the last few years, becase it was full of players who played great in the middle of the game and great when we got a lead, but almost never made a big play at the end of a close game to stop the other team. Spikes in particular is like this - get a lead and he's an animal, but when has he ever closed a tight game out with a big play (something seemingly every freaking New Engalnd Patriot does consistently)? I think the defense got a little better in this respect last year, and I give Jauron and Fewell a lot of credit for that. Im sure you can come up with a few game-saving plays over the last several years, but overall, the leaders on this defense have been a big disappointment to me in the fourth quarter when the game has been on the line. And that includes Nate. Our backfield will be worse without him, but I'm hoping that Levy and Jauron can fill this team (over time) with defensive leaders who know how to close out games. Whether those guys are currently on the team remains to be seen.

[Dr. Fong]

Although I believe Johnson has the potential to be an elite level receiver that's too much to give up for a guy that touches the ball at best a dozen times a game.

[clownments22]

i'd do it, the dude is a freak. i think he'll be a hall of famer if he's on the right team. we could make up lost time later on the defensive side.

[The Dean]

1) How many would give up a 1st and 2nd this season, and a 1st and 3rd in 08?

 

2) Would this even be enough to get him?

 

If anyone cares, I would actually be willing to make this trade. The Bills OL has improved, and if Johnson is even almost as good as advertised, this would give the Bills the best pair of receivers that I can remember on any football team in many years.

Backs are easy to get as compared to other positions, and perhaps we could luck out and find another LB in the draft.

 

I know this is far fetched, but we have little else to talk about.

 

 

Who are you and what have you done with Bill?

 

A wide receiver? The REAL Bill from NYC wouldn't be caught dead promoting this.

 

I'd love to see a talent like this on the Bills, but I wouldn't trade our first and an additional 3rd to get him. We have too many more important holes to fill. Beside, when you mortgage all of those picks on one guy, you are too open if that move doesn't pan out. What if this guy gets injured? Then you just don't lose that one guy, you lose FOUR guys.

 

The best receiver I ever saw come out of college (and similar to Johnson in some respects) was Herman Moore. Moore was a terrific receiver for the Lions. He looked to be a guy who might challenge Jerry Rice's records, but then developed vision problems and, finally, got injured (I think). He was never quite the same after that. Moore (a seemingly certain HOFer) retired with a "nice" eleven-year NFL career. Not bad for a high first-round draft pick. But, disappointing, I would think, if it cost FOUR first day picks.

 

I don't know what you're smoking tonight, Bill...but, send it to me IMMEDIATELY! Getting wasted and coming up with crazy picks is MY job! Being responsible and worrying about the important stuff, THE LINES, is your job. Do we have that straight?

[JAMIEBUF12]

i wouldn't. i also wouldn't do it if we were in position to do so. like if we had no holes on the team. the reason being........you would never in the cap age be able to afford a qb,rb and two wr's.

this is why when indy kept their other wide receiver they had to lose the edge.

 

 

go bills in"07

[Phil Indablanc]

1) How many would give up a 1st and 2nd this season, and a 1st and 3rd in 08?

 

2) Would this even be enough to get him?

 

If anyone cares, I would actually be willing to make this trade. The Bills OL has improved, and if Johnson is even almost as good as advertised, this would give the Bills the best pair of receivers that I can remember on any football team in many years.

Backs are easy to get as compared to other positions, and perhaps we could luck out and find another LB in the draft.

 

I know this is far fetched, but we have little else to talk about.

 

 

Two questions. Two somewhat indirect answers. Ditka. Ricky tick tick tick.

[Pyrite Gal]

You make some great points, but I take exception to your comments wrt defensive backs.

We just let one of the best in the game get away. He was most certainly one of our best players, no?

 

That said, you are right. It is completely hypothetical, and I am not trying to make a strong case to trade for CJ.

 

I do not think that one can draw conclusions about what we would do regarding paying to keep a player at another position based on the decision to let NC walks.

 

A: It would have been a waste to pay NC the salary the market gave to a "playmaker" when the Cover 2 we run simply is not going to use him in away that allows him to make plays. I think it was fairly predictable that in the Cover 2 the way we run it the MLB led the team in INTs. Our D has the CB releasing players to the deep zone safety coverage after about 15 yards and as long as we are going to play a D which does not emphasize NC making big plays, it made little sense to pay him a big play salary.

 

B: Different teams simply assign different value to a players. Simply because SF saw fit to give NC a record contract does not mean that NC is worth that much to the Bills as a player. In fact, one of the reasons the tag exists is this keeps a player out of the market completely because once a player is in the market he quite likely can attract a contract of a size much larger than the player is actually worth to the team which developed him. Buffalo and the 9ers both finished 7-9 but if the Bills correctly judge they are more than one player away while SF makes a judgment that a possible Pro Bowl CB will allow them to achieve some spectacular goal, NC can be reasonably worth a larger payment to another team than he is worth to the Bills or at some absolute players.

 

C: Different teams make different assessments of how good a player is and just because NC got a record breaking contract from the 9ers does not necessarily mean for sure that he is one of the best CBs in the league.

 

In fact if one looks the inretrospect stupid contract that the 9ers gave Jennings last year, there may be good reason to assume that the Bills are likely more correct in thinking NC is not worth the big cash.

 

Certainly those who watched the Bills closely such as myself insisted that JJ was injury prone and not worth a big contract and now SF has belatedly found that is true,

[bluv]

I'd rather draft Willis in the 1st, Jarret if he's available in the 2nd, and a RB in the 3rd. While Johnson is a wrokout warrior and I'd love to see him in a Bills uniform, Jarret got it done on the field with two different QBs and while he is not a speed deamon he is a playmaker. If we drafted him and ended up being a Plexico Burress type I'd be happy with that. I'm not a USC fan, but after that Bowl game against Michigan his stock was high and he seemed unattainable at the number 12 pick; now he has fallen to being maybe a 2nd round pick. Around draft time everybody get's caught up in all the workout hype; Rice, Reed, or Irvin weren't top flight athletes but they made damn good WRs!

[Beerball]

I couldn't pull that trigger unless a team was 'a player away'. If I was the pats I would consider this, but we need soooo much help right now that you can't spend 5 high picks on one player.