Alaska Darin Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 The Bills defense was very bad prior to the bye week changes. Now the key player in that change(Clements) is gone, and the steady, consistent, durable MLB is gone as well. I'm not a big fan of Fletcher, he can't stack and shed so his defenses will always be vulnerable to the run at his position, but he and Clements were the guys who came away with the turnovers. That's kinda' important. There are really no solutions in FA. The draft........well let's just say we aren't going to replace that production next season from the draft. The next time that happens will be the first. And that is to get back to last year's level. Which wasn't good enough. Not to throw a wet blanket on the acquisition of a good guard and some JAGs but, how is this progress? Have the Bills gone from being one of the worst run defenses to being the worst defense? That's it. I'm renouncing my fandom. We're the worst defense in the NFL, the other experts here have already proven that the OLine guys we signed are gonna suck hind tit, and we all know Marv and Dicky J are gonna blow the draft like a nickle whore the day the rent was due. Oh the humanity. Pats' wagon, here I come. No way Adelphia (sic) Thomas and Teddy Bruschi aren't going to rule the world. Is it March 4th yet? That was my personal designated panic date.
AKC Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 $80M for clements is way too much for his position. First I don't think any cornerback is worth that much, second Clements isn't that good to command that much money and third Bills management hopefully have a plan to replace him. Very few, if any, players are expendable as long as management has a plan to replace him with an adequate substitution. Clements was good but certainly wasn't great. He played to the level of the team around him. To command that much money be spent on one CB requires that that CB be able to play great no matter what. Fletcher, it was time to let him go especially at the money he signed for. 5 yards and a ton of tackles is 32 years and could hit the wall at any time and had a difficult time playing the run in the cover 2 defense. He isn't the answer let him go. Once agail we will have to see if the bills have a plan to replace him. The Redskins overpaid as they usually do. Better them than the Bills. It seems to work well for them. I wouldn't say Nate's new contract is "way too much" for one of the best corners in the league today for the right defense. Even if Marv and Co. fail, they do appear to be completely focused on setting their roster based exactly upon the personell priorities as they've been defined by our schemes on both sides of the ball. If that's true, and the evidence seems to be stacking up, it'll be hard to imagine them watching NClements walk without drafting Okoye with our first pick if he's there. The only way you make up for two "regular joe" corners in the league today is to have a consistent push from the middle of your defensive line. Even with our full rotation of DTs last year, including McCargo, we were not consistent in providing middle pressure. I agree Nate is a salary casualty of our new defense, while London was a skill casualty. I'm not so sure that the team is thinking of Crowell as the long-term answer to take the Mike spot, but one good about this D is it doesn't require a Brian Urlacher to play in the middle and there are a number of ways to fill that hole.
obie_wan Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 I agree Nate is a salary casualty of our new defense, while London was a skill casualty. I'm not so sure that the team is thinking of Crowell as the long-term answer to take the Mike spot, but one good about this D is it doesn't require a Brian Urlacher to play in the middle and there are a number of ways to fill that hole. I think you are wrong here. This defense does need an outstanding player at MLB. That player has to be able to fill holes on running plays, be able to cover the deep middle of the field on pass plays and be smart enough to know when to do each. Patrick Willis fills this hole just like Whitner filled the SS slot last year.
Acantha Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 I think you are wrong here. This defense does need an outstanding player at MLB. That player has to be able to fill holes on running plays, be able to cover the deep middle of the field on pass plays and be smart enough to know when to do each. Patrick Willis fills this hole just like Whitner filled the SS slot last year. I agree that MLB is an important piece to this defense, and I have to argue that Okoye is the must pick if he is there. IMO the defense has 3 huge question marks...MLB, CB, and DT. Given the players that are currently on the team, DT at least has some potential based on two rookies getting better after being in the system for a year. MLB could possibly be filled by Crowell, but that would leave a whole at OLB (again, the potential is there for Ellison who showed some good signs). CB on the other hand is just plain horrible right now. McGee is not a number one CB, I don't care what anyone says, and Ashton hasn't played yet. They NEED to upgrade CB. As things stand now, I would have to say CB is addressed first, with LB in the second....and this is from someone who hates to say that because I don't think there is a CB in the draft worthy of the 12th pick.
Lv-Bills Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 This pearl of wisdom from one of the minds behind the "We're DOOOOOMED" era of TBD sarcasm. How's that workin' out for ya'? Nice. LOL, not only that, but I'm pretty sure this is the same person who loves to play the "It's only the pre-season jackass" card too. He then plays the it's only the opener card, and the season is early card with regularity too. It's just his way. Don't let it bother you. Trademark LA. You'd think after about seven years, he'd realize that you can kinda see that we could very well be in trouble on defense again. I hear your argument Bad Ol........I hope Marv still has some thoughts on how to address the defense. He's been ok so far, let's see what's up his sleeve yet.
34-78-83 Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 re: Nate I was one of his biggest supporters and fully aware of the value he brought to the defense. With that said I'm sure the Bills gave him a generous offer, but just not an offer such as the blockbuster offered by Frisco. I certainly place no blame on the staff for not making such an offer to him. It's just too much for their situation. I really hate to see him go, but it turns out that we had no chance at him and he played it smart with his agent by not re-signing last year when we wanted to get a deal done for him. Of course the defense will suffer for not having him, but instead of trying to determine and place blame we need to place hope that the team will do enough to make his loss hurt a lot less than it potentially could. IE Okye/Branch at DT, a decent Corner in FA, or whatever... Wrt Fletcher, I believe that if the Bills wanted to re-sign him, they could have. I really liked him as both player and leader, but apparently they have other plans.
JAMIEBUF12 Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 nope its not the worst defense right now because with this new mauling run blocking offensive line the bills are gonna go on 8 minute drives and keep our defense off the field! lol lol
BEAST MODE BABY! Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 I think we DO have one of the worst, if not THE worst defense, in the NFL today. In fact, we're going to get our asses handed to us tomorrow. Oh, wait. We don't play tomorrow. We don't play for SIX FREAKING MONTHS. LA, always bringing the funny to TBD. I can't believe Wes Walker burned us for 3 TDs on punt returns and how Adalius Thomas sacked Losman 11 times when we played the Patriots last week.
dave mcbride Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Yes. I love this!! Based on what evidence, may i ask? ypc? yards/pass attempt? turnovers? yards per game? Or -- gulp -- haven't they actually played any games yet? You naysayers are too much -- I actually think you derive more pleasure out of Bills' failures than their successes, if only because they fulfill your consistently gloomy predictions. They may end up sucking, but neither you nor I know if that's going to be the case. Basically, you should relax and have fun watching the games. Badol's big man, Mr. Sam Adams, may well have been the worst "name" DT in the NFL in 2005 (he sucked in 06 too, btw). Yet it was never acknowledged by his very vocal advocates. The Bills' defense, for all of its significant flaws, was markedly better in the second half of last season in comparison to 05, when they very well may have had the worst defense in the league. They lose one important guy -- Clements -- who is now (remarkably) the highest paid defensive player in the league. Fletcher was never that great (I love that people are waxing nostalgic about this guy's turnover ability, btw -- every decent MLB comes up with turnovers), and he's not getting any younger. It's not that bad.
dave mcbride Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Derrick Dockery is 3 steps forward, and losing Clements and Fletcher is one step back? I've heard of the glass being half full or half empty, but that's ridiculous. I understand the idea of improving the defense by controlling the clock and getting leads on offense, but you still have to be able to play some defense. Badol, you're better than this. Clements is good, obviously, but a 31 year old London Fletcher is the very definition of "JAG." He's never been that good, and his calling card seems to be his ability to avoid injury. As you and I both know, there is not a player in the league (aside from Brett Favre, I guess) for whom that calling card works forever.
BADOLBILZ Posted March 4, 2007 Author Posted March 4, 2007 re: Nate I was one of his biggest supporters and fully aware of the value he brought to the defense. With that said I'm sure the Bills gave him a generous offer, but just not an offer such as the blockbuster offered by Frisco. I certainly place no blame on the staff for not making such an offer to him. It's just too much for their situation. I really hate to see him go, but it turns out that we had no chance at him and he played it smart with his agent by not re-signing last year when we wanted to get a deal done for him. Of course the defense will suffer for not having him, but instead of trying to determine and place blame we need to place hope that the team will do enough to make his loss hurt a lot less than it potentially could. IE Okye/Branch at DT, a decent Corner in FA, or whatever... Wrt Fletcher, I believe that if the Bills wanted to re-sign him, they could have. I really liked him as both player and leader, but apparently they have other plans. They chose not to pay Nate Clements $10M per year, and instead decided to pay Dockery and Walker $12M per year. That's what it amounts to. Let's not over-rationalize, they made a choice. All the "can't afford" stuff was nonsense, as I have been saying all offseason. We'll see if it pays off.
34-78-83 Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Well if you put it that way, I imagine the way they are looking at it is: Huge upgrade at starting LG AND Moderate upgrade at RT > Pro Bowl Corner And yes, whether or not they are right is to be determined...
BADOLBILZ Posted March 4, 2007 Author Posted March 4, 2007 That's it. I'm renouncing my fandom. We're the worst defense in the NFL, the other experts here have already proven that the OLine guys we signed are gonna suck hind tit, and we all know Marv and Dicky J are gonna blow the draft like a nickle whore the day the rent was due. Oh the humanity. Pats' wagon, here I come. No way Adelphia (sic) Thomas and Teddy Bruschi aren't going to rule the world. Is it March 4th yet? That was my personal designated panic date. I knew "Darin the Doomed" couldn't be far behind LA. The faux Pats/Bruschi worship is almost as old as the doomed stuff. But thanks for the insight. Yawn.
BADOLBILZ Posted March 4, 2007 Author Posted March 4, 2007 Badol, you're better than this. Clements is good, obviously, but a 31 year old London Fletcher is the very definition of "JAG." He's never been that good, and his calling card seems to be his ability to avoid injury. As you and I both know, there is not a player in the league (aside from Brett Favre, I guess) for whom that calling card works forever. Actually Fletcher's calling card was leading his team in tackles for like 8 straight years or something. I'm not a big Fletcher fan, but he made a lot of plays. "JAG" means "just a guy", Fletcher's anything but ordinary.
BADOLBILZ Posted March 4, 2007 Author Posted March 4, 2007 Badol's big man, Mr. Sam Adams, may well have been the worst "name" DT in the NFL in 2005 (he sucked in 06 too, btw). Yet it was never acknowledged by his very vocal advocates. The Bills' defense, for all of its significant flaws, was markedly better in the second half of last season in comparison to 05, when they very well may have had the worst defense in the league. What a jackassed response. The Bills go out and have a terrible year in run defense in 2006, and you are ragging me about Adams. Hate to break it to you, Dave, but Adams was a pro-bowl alternate in 2005 and the Bills defense clearly fell apart in games at NE and Miami where the Bills blew leads after Mularkey benched him. But I'm sure the Bengals missed the playoffs this year because of Adams. Yeah, their rush defense was a lot better than Buffalo's, to the tune of about a half yard per carry AND 25 yards less per game(which is a lot, Dave), but WTF, he wasn't a Buffalo Bill so he must suck. Next year when the Bills are giving up 5.0 ypc, make sure to remind me how overrated London Fletcher and Nate Clements were.
IDBillzFan Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 This pearl of wisdom from one of the minds behind the "We're DOOOOOMED" era of TBD sarcasm. How's that workin' out for ya'? Here's a little tip for ya, Skippy. Back then, we were doomed. The difference between back then and today is today you can at least see the direction the team is trying to take. Today you can see they're not afraid to second-guess themselves and make changes on the fly to better the team. Today you can see they're not afraid to cut people and bench people who can't make a difference, regardless of who that person may be. Today I have a lot of confidence in this team's staff, and it dawns on me that you have to be one miserable !@#$ to see the team moving in the right direction and start bitching about the work that still needs to be done with six !@#$ing months ahead of you. How's that perpetual bitchin' and whining working out for ya?
/dev/null Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Here's a little tip for ya, Skippy. Back then, we were doomed. The difference between back then and today is today you can at least see the direction the team is trying to take. Today you can see they're not afraid to second-guess themselves and make changes on the fly to better the team. Today you can see they're not afraid to cut people and bench people who can't make a difference, regardless of who that person may be. Today I have a lot of confidence in this team's staff, and it dawns on me that you have to be one miserable !@#$ to see the team moving in the right direction and start bitching about the work that still needs to be done with six !@#$ing months ahead of you. How's that perpetual bitchin' and whining working out for ya? huh? what were you saying? sorry, wasn't paying attention. too busy looking at your avatar
GG Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 What gets me is the criticism of not who we didn't get, but the guys that we lost who would not have made a difference in upgrading the defense this year. With free agency barely 48 hrs old, it's time to declare Bills a loser again. Never mind that the team is addressing the needs it feels are more critical at this juncture and still have 2 more months to scour free agents and see the draft, let's bring down the house now. Are we looking at improvements in a vacuum? Is this team really better with LFB and NC staying on defense and keeping Villarial & Gandy on offense? Isn't that your argument? Or are you in a perfect position to argue both sides of the line that if Bills retained both or went after Adalius, we'd have the same post on how Bills keep ignoring the offensive line? And please, if you're going to mention the money paid, please use real numbers. Nate's $10 mil/yr average is funny money. The real numbers are how much in upfront & guarantees - and that's a bit of a difference between Nate & Dockery, which allowed them to address another spot on the OL.
Koufax Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 The Bills defense was very bad prior to the bye week changes. Now the key player in that change(Clements) is gone, and the steady, consistent, durable MLB is gone as well. I'm not a big fan of Fletcher, he can't stack and shed so his defenses will always be vulnerable to the run at his position, but he and Clements were the guys who came away with the turnovers. That's kinda' important. There are really no solutions in FA. The draft........well let's just say we aren't going to replace that production next season from the draft. The next time that happens will be the first. And that is to get back to last year's level. Which wasn't good enough. Not to throw a wet blanket on the acquisition of a good guard and some JAGs but, how is this progress? Have the Bills gone from being one of the worst run defenses to being the worst defense? No. The Bills do not have the worst defense in the NFL. Let's go over the basics: D-Line, Kyle should be better, McCargo is back, Larry is in his prime, and we might add somebody else better than Tim Anderson, line better than last year. Linebackers we lost a player who is a great guy, but was not being an impact player and was mostly making tackles 7 yards downfield. Wait and see, but I don't think we let him walk because we couldn't afford him, but beacuse we expect to get better at that position. Ellison and Crowell would both be expected to contribute more next year than this year, and TKO will either contribute more (my hope) or clear some cap space. DBs, Ko and Dante have a year under their belt and should be better, Terrance had a bad year and should rebound at least somewhat, and right now we have Youboty replacing Nate (a downgrade) and hope to resign KT. I would have to give DBs a push or only slight downgrade, because of the experience factor of the safeties. But with the draft we will get an impact corner or an impact linebackers (I hope LB). And we could still sign someone on D. I think that without a question our D is better next year, especially considering it is year two of a new scheme for what was a very young D. Experience for everbody (only Spikes would be on the decline), adding McCargo, adding Youboty, and some good draft picks will make our D better than last year and nowhere near the worst in the league.
Acantha Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Are we looking at improvements in a vacuum? Is this team really better with LFB and NC staying on defense and keeping Villarial & Gandy on offense? Isn't that your argument? Or are you in a perfect position to argue both sides of the line that if Bills retained both or went after Adalius, we'd have the same post on how Bills keep ignoring the offensive line? Bingo
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