RLflutie7 Posted March 3, 2007 Posted March 3, 2007 The NFL network is running shows on NFL QBs right now. One called "Masters of the Game" and the second one on right now is called NFL QB the art and science of quarterbacking. The 1st show just had a mini-feature about Warren Moon. They talked about him going to the CFL. He said there were three strikes against him when he came out of college. He said they told him he 1. didn't have a strong enough arm. 2. didn't come from a "pro style offense". 3. he was too short. After watching the show "Third and a mile" (Black QB show on NFL network), I convinced it's because he's not 6-3. He was simply too short. P.S. Why would the NFL take Doug Williams with the 1st pick and not Moon? They were only a few years apart.
CCLXXIX Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Why do I even bother... check out the pic. Seau is 6-3 and Bress is 6-0. Moon pic w/ Junior Seau and Drew Brees
Git'er Done Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 The NFL network is running shows on NFL QBs right now. One called "Masters of the Game" and the second one on right now is called NFL QB the art and science of quarterbacking. The 1st show just had a mini-feature about Warren Moon. They talked about him going to the CFL. He said there were three strikes against him when he came out of college. He said they told him he 1. didn't have a strong enough arm. 2. didn't come from a "pro style offense". 3. he was too short. After watching the show "Third and a mile" (Black QB show on NFL network), I convinced it's because he's not 6-3. He was simply too short. P.S. Why would the NFL take Doug Williams with the 1st pick and not Moon? They were only a few years apart. Doug Flutie was too short, not Warren Moon. Are you a short man living vicariously through another short man (Doug Flutie)?
ROCCEO Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Doug Flutie was too short, not Warren Moon.Are you a short man living vicariously through another short man (Doug Flutie)? My best friend did that for years until one day he realized flutie wasnt so great.
RLflutie7 Posted March 4, 2007 Author Posted March 4, 2007 Why do I even bother... check out the pic. Seau is 6-3 and Bress is 6-0. Moon pic w/ Junior Seau and Drew Brees I see your point. Question: Why would NFL people say he was too short then? Seems odd. Plus they said he had a weak arm which is even dumber. Doug Williams was drafted in the first round before Moon came out of college. Truely, what's the difference? That's what I'm asking by making this post. What was it. Moon said it was a "double whammy" being black and having physical abilities questioned.
Albany,n.y. Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Doug Williams was drafted in the first round before Moon came out of college. Truely, what's the difference? They were in the same class-1978. The difference is that Doug Williams didn't flee to Canada before the draft & blame it on racism. Moon signed with Edmonton in March 1978, had he waited until the NFL draft, he probably would have been a mid round selection and he could have earned his way on the roster of the team that drafted him. Williams waited until the May 2, 1978 draft, was taken in the 1st round with pick 17 after Tampa Bay traded the top pick (Earl Campbell) to Houston. He was the top QB taken in that draft and a year later had Tampa in the NFC Championship game. Moon is a wife beating coward & a liar who does not belong in the Hall of Fame.
RLflutie7 Posted March 4, 2007 Author Posted March 4, 2007 They were in the same class-1978. The difference is that Doug Williams didn't flee to Canada before the draft & blame it on racism. Moon signed with Edmonton in March 1978, had he waited until the NFL draft, he probably would have been a mid round selection and he could have earned his way on the roster of the team that drafted him. Williams waited until the May 2, 1978 draft, was taken in the 1st round with pick 17 after Tampa Bay traded the top pick (Earl Campbell) to Houston. He was the top QB taken in that draft and a year later had Tampa in the NFC Championship game. Moon is a wife beating coward & a liar who does not belong in the Hall of Fame. Thanks for clearing that up. I thought Moon had played in the 1979 or 1980 Rose Bowl. I kind of had a feeling that something didn't seem right with his draft status. Now, if you are correct, for him to blame it on racism is stupid. If you want to be drafted, wait until the draft.
2003Contenders Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Thanks for clearing that up. I thought Moon had played in the 1979 or 1980 Rose Bowl. I kind of had a feeling that something didn't seem right with his draft status. Now, if you are correct, for him to blame it on racism is stupid. If you want to be drafted, wait until the draft. There is no denying that there may have been some racism involved in regards to Moon's non-selection regardless of Williams' status. Still, I could be wrong, but I would venture to say that in Williams' very short time in the league, he won more playoff games than Warren Moon did over his lo-o-o-ong career.
Albany,n.y. Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 There is no denying that there may have been some racism involved in regards to Moon's non-selection regardless of Williams' status. Still, I could be wrong, but I would venture to say that in Williams' very short time in the league, he won more playoff games than Warren Moon did over his lo-o-o-ong career. I would compare the Moon situation to Rodney Peete coming out of college. Peete slipped to the 6th round in the 1989 draft, probably due to many in the league questioning the abilities of a black QB (ironically only 1 year after Doug Williams won the Super Bowl). However, Peete signed with Detroit, didn't go to Canada, and eventually emerged as the starter on Detroit. Looking back, Doug Williams getting picked in the 1st round was an abberation-no black QB was taken in the 1st round between Williams in 1978 & 1990 when Andre Ware was picked by Detroit. Between those years, few black QBs were selected, the highest being Randall Cunningham in the 2nd round in 1985. The breakthrough year was 1995 when Houston picked Steve McNair in the 1st & Pittsburgh took Kordell Stewart in the 2nd. By 1999, 3 black QBs went in the 1st round (McNabb, A.Smith & Culpepper) and Shaun King went in round two. After 1995, or at the latest, 1999, the race of a QB has become a non issue. The NFL has come a long way since the day the Bills drafted James Harris in the 1969 draft and (from Relentless) "...in the eighth round, they selected James Harris, a black quarterback from Grambling. A Buffalo Evening News headline read 'A 6-4 Negro QB, Harris, drafted 8th by the Bills.' The story said Harris 'is a negro, one of the few of his race to be drafted as a quarterback in pro football.' " Moon could have gone the Rodney Peete route, or even the James Harris route-he did end up a starter for the Rams, and played his entire career in the NFL. He chose not to because he didn't THINK he could overcome the bias against black QBs. He's listed at 6'3" in the pro football registers in the 1980s, which was only an inch shorter than Williams, so obviously he's lying about the height thing. Moon's career is not much different than Vinny Testaverde's and I doubt Testaverde will ever get very far in HOF voting. I wish Doug Williams hadn't jumped to the USFL because maybe he would have been viewed as the true trailblazer & been given the first black QB vote instead of Moon. Personally, I'd much rather see Doug Williams in the HOF than Moon.
RLflutie7 Posted March 5, 2007 Author Posted March 5, 2007 I would compare the Moon situation to Rodney Peete coming out of college. Peete slipped to the 6th round in the 1989 draft, probably due to many in the league questioning the abilities of a black QB (ironically only 1 year after Doug Williams won the Super Bowl). However, Peete signed with Detroit, didn't go to Canada, and eventually emerged as the starter on Detroit. Looking back, Doug Williams getting picked in the 1st round was an abberation-no black QB was taken in the 1st round between Williams in 1978 & 1990 when Andre Ware was picked by Detroit. Between those years, few black QBs were selected, the highest being Randall Cunningham in the 2nd round in 1985. The breakthrough year was 1995 when Houston picked Steve McNair in the 1st & Pittsburgh took Kordell Stewart in the 2nd. By 1999, 3 black QBs went in the 1st round (McNabb, A.Smith & Culpepper) and Shaun King went in round two. After 1995, or at the latest, 1999, the race of a QB has become a non issue. The NFL has come a long way since the day the Bills drafted James Harris in the 1969 draft and (from Relentless) "...in the eighth round, they selected James Harris, a black quarterback from Grambling. A Buffalo Evening News headline read 'A 6-4 Negro QB, Harris, drafted 8th by the Bills.' The story said Harris 'is a negro, one of the few of his race to be drafted as a quarterback in pro football.' " Moon could have gone the Rodney Peete route, or even the James Harris route-he did end up a starter for the Rams, and played his entire career in the NFL. He chose not to because he didn't THINK he could overcome the bias against black QBs. He's listed at 6'3" in the pro football registers in the 1980s, which was only an inch shorter than Williams, so obviously he's lying about the height thing. Moon's career is not much different than Vinny Testaverde's and I doubt Testaverde will ever get very far in HOF voting. I wish Doug Williams hadn't jumped to the USFL because maybe he would have been viewed as the true trailblazer & been given the first black QB vote instead of Moon. Personally, I'd much rather see Doug Williams in the HOF than Moon. Great post. I forgot about Rodney Peete. I remember when Aikman and Peete played in the cross town rivalry (UCLA-USC in 1988). I'd rather see Williams in the HOF also. Moon did have a great arm and a long career. Jim Kelly would have monster stats too if he had not gone to the USFL. But it was sure fun to watch.
MDH Posted March 5, 2007 Posted March 5, 2007 I would compare the Moon situation to Rodney Peete coming out of college. Peete slipped to the 6th round in the 1989 draft, probably due to many in the league questioning the abilities of a black QB (ironically only 1 year after Doug Williams won the Super Bowl). However, Peete signed with Detroit, didn't go to Canada, and eventually emerged as the starter on Detroit. Looking back, Doug Williams getting picked in the 1st round was an abberation-no black QB was taken in the 1st round between Williams in 1978 & 1990 when Andre Ware was picked by Detroit. Between those years, few black QBs were selected, the highest being Randall Cunningham in the 2nd round in 1985. The breakthrough year was 1995 when Houston picked Steve McNair in the 1st & Pittsburgh took Kordell Stewart in the 2nd. By 1999, 3 black QBs went in the 1st round (McNabb, A.Smith & Culpepper) and Shaun King went in round two. After 1995, or at the latest, 1999, the race of a QB has become a non issue. The NFL has come a long way since the day the Bills drafted James Harris in the 1969 draft and (from Relentless) "...in the eighth round, they selected James Harris, a black quarterback from Grambling. A Buffalo Evening News headline read 'A 6-4 Negro QB, Harris, drafted 8th by the Bills.' The story said Harris 'is a negro, one of the few of his race to be drafted as a quarterback in pro football.' " Moon could have gone the Rodney Peete route, or even the James Harris route-he did end up a starter for the Rams, and played his entire career in the NFL. He chose not to because he didn't THINK he could overcome the bias against black QBs. He's listed at 6'3" in the pro football registers in the 1980s, which was only an inch shorter than Williams, so obviously he's lying about the height thing. Moon's career is not much different than Vinny Testaverde's and I doubt Testaverde will ever get very far in HOF voting. I wish Doug Williams hadn't jumped to the USFL because maybe he would have been viewed as the true trailblazer & been given the first black QB vote instead of Moon. Personally, I'd much rather see Doug Williams in the HOF than Moon. I think you're going a bit overboard in your criticism of Moon. While I agree that I don't think he's a HoF QB to compare him to Testaverde is ludicrous. Vinnie has never been the QB of an offense that teams feared, Moon has. Sure, you can call the run and shoot a "gimmick" offense, at it was, but nonetheless, they put lots of points on the board, mostly through the passing game and Moon led the attack. Moon was one of the leaders of that team and had them in the playoffs year after year (where the shortcomings of the offense became apparent). Testaverde has never accomplished anything of the sort in the Pros. He's been a steady QB who has played for a looooong time and nothing more.
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