tennesseeboy Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Why would the Bills lock up 50-70 million dollars with a cap hit somewhere near the $15,000,000 escalating to something like $25,000,000 at the end of his contract when he's no longer the player he was? If it gets THAT high, I think we let him go. I was thinking something along the lines of Champ Bailey money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 The question to be asked imo is why on earth did Marv make this idiotic promise to not use the tag on him? In a small group of UFAs, we could have got a 1st round pick for him, or so one would think. This move hurt the Buffalo Bills. So that Nate would sign the 1 year tender and come into camp without a hold out...If you starting as a GM of a team, you want to start in a good faith manner than be a jerk...Marv chose to be the earlier and committed to the non-tagging option. May be Marv was already one step ahead in knowing that NC doesn't want to be in Buffalo and hence get another year out of him. I also think that was the reason why they tried to trade him during the season to Tampa Bay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 A stud DL that pressures the QBwill make an average secondary that much better. I wouldnt be surprised if we let NC go pick up a backup til Youboty is ready and draft a stud DE like Moses or grab that DE from Michigan whos name I forgot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 So that Nate would sign the 1 year tender and come into camp without a hold out...If you starting as a GM of a team, you want to start in a good faith manner than be a jerk...Marv chose to be the earlier and committed to the non-tagging option. May be Marv was already one step ahead in knowing that NC doesn't want to be in Buffalo and hence get another year out of him. I also think that was the reason why they tried to trade him during the season to Tampa Bay. Good points, but I don't think that exercising his rights under the CBA would have categorized Marv as a "jerk," as much as a good GM trying to do the right thing for his football team. Now if he leaves, we will get nothing in return. I can only construe this as bad news. Your point about Marv knowing things that we don't is of course true. Hopefully this is why he drafted Youboty, and can address other needs such as OG, DT, and LB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Top 25 NFL Player Salaries for 2005-20061. Vick, Michael $ 23,102,750 Atlanta Falcons 21. Manning, Eli $ 9,305,000 New York Giants BWAHAHAHAHA..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Good points, but I don't think that exercising his rights under the CBA would have categorized Marv as a "jerk," as much as a good GM trying to do the right thing for his football team. Now if he leaves, we will get nothing in return. I can only construe this as bad news. Your point about Marv knowing things that we don't is of course true. Hopefully this is why he drafted Youboty, and can address other needs such as OG, DT, and LB. The "jerk" aspect is from the players viewpoint. Here is a first time GM and he is screwing his own player because he wouldn't negotiate what the players worth is. If that view point is spread around the NFL, then players will avoid coming to the Bills or use the Bills as the last resort...I don't think Marv wanted to enter a new job with that kind of "feet wetting". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrite Gal Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 The "jerk" aspect is from the players viewpoint. Here is a first time GM and he is screwing his own player because he wouldn't negotiate what the players worth is. If that view point is spread around the NFL, then players will avoid coming to the Bills or use the Bills as the last resort...I don't think Marv wanted to enter a new job with that kind of "feet wetting". A lot depends upon what in fact the Bills and NC agreed to in regards to whether the Bills in fact agreed not to tag NC and let him walk this year as part of the negotiations last year when it is REPORTED they made this agreement with NC. It would be unreasonable for Marv to be declared a jerk for exercising the rights NC's representative's the NFLPA agreed to if that is the total agreement both parties made. However, Marv would clearly be a jerk if he simply went back on his word and agreed not to use the Bills rights to franchise Nate for 07 and then did the opposite. It really is a who knows for sure outside of the two parties guessing game for us observers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oneonta Buffalo Fan Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 He's not interested on being with a losing team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lv-Bills Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Top 25 NFL Player Salaries for 2005-20061. Vick, Michael $ 23,102,750 Atlanta Falcons 2. Hasselbeck, Matt $ 19,005,280 Seattle Seahawks 3. Pace, Orlando $ 18,000,000 St. Louis Rams 4. Jones, Walter $ 17,701,320 Seattle Seahawks 5. Brady, Tom $ 15,654,180 New England Patriots 6. Bailey, Champ $ 13,507,625 Denver Broncos 7. Smoot, Fred $ 12,300,000 Minnesota Vikings 8. Rolle, Samari $ 12,000,990 Baltimore Ravens 9. Henry, Anthony $ 11,604,840 Dallas Cowboys 10. Ogden, Jonathan $ 10,665,550 Baltimore Ravens 11. Stroud, Marcus $ 10,640,000 Jacksonville Jaguars 12. Woodson, Charles $ 10,537,000 Oakland Raiders 13. Baxter, Gary $ 10,510,698 Cleveland Browns 14. Bulluck, Keith $ 10,251,980 Tennessee Titans 15. Johnson, Rudi $ 10,250,000 Cincinnati Bengals 16. Samuels, Chris $ 9,550,000 Washington Redskins 17. Favre, Brett $ 9,500,000 Green Bay Packers 18. Roethlisberger, Ben $ 9,498,840 Pittsburgh Steelers 19. Lucas, Ken $ 9,400,000 Carolina Panthers 20. Muhammad, Muhsin $ 9,335,407 Chicago Bears 21. Manning, Eli $ 9,305,000 New York Giants 22. Rivera, Marco $ 9,130,280 Dallas Cowboys 23. Ferguson, Jason $ 9,129,290 Dallas Cowboys 24. Wahle, Mike $ 9,100,000 Carolina Panthers 25. James, Edgerrin $ 9,081,000 Indianapolis Colts This doesn't make sense to me. To put Nate into this category would not help the Bills long term. How many of those guys are actually worth it? Champ Bailey? Maybe? Nate fits right in with the list of CB's on this list........all pretty much overpaid, because the vast majority of them weren't on all that good of defenses or in the playoffs. Let him go, and use the money to bolster both lines. A good d-line is your best pass defense anyway. Nate is solid, but very replaceable, especially in a cover 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I'd rather see big $$$ go towards big bodies on either line or skills guys already on the team. Locking up Lee Evans and JP long term would be ideal with the cap space available. Drafting and signing big bodies along both lines would also serve the team well. Throwing huge $$$ at a good CB who often disappears and makes bonehead plays is not econmincally sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 He's not interested on being with a losing team. So the Cardinals and Redskins are out, then, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RShirley Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 We're 40 million under the cap. If we don't use it on him, we'll have to overpay somebody else who isn't as good. There are way more buyers than sellers for Cornerbacks this year. How quickly everybody forgets how terrible Nate played in 2005. After Chris Chambers dropped something like 240 yds and 15 catches, 99% of the fans wanted him out of Buffalo. Now people are saying that he is a must sign and that we should give him this kind of money............absolutely no way. He has had flashes of brilliance towards the end of the season, but has been way too inconsistent to make this kind of investment in. I can just see giving him this kind of money, having him relax and revert back to his 2005 performance level. That money should be spent going after free agents Briggs, Scott, or Steinbach. If they want to throw big money at a cornerback, then it should be Samuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
respk Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Tieing that much money up in a CB is way too much. What it comes down to for me is at $10M+ I would feel pretty bad watching Nate play at a mediocre or poor level. I would feel less bad if someone else paid him that kind of money and he was an allpro. If it requires $10M+ per year to resign Nate, let him go. We've lost with him and at $10M+ per year we could maybe sign two players who would upgrade two positions and maybe we are better in the long run. One other thing of the 7 teams with a CB in the top 20 how many made the playoffs? 2. There just might be a connection between spending that much money on one player and poor play since you have to reduce what a team spends on other positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndZoneCrew Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Top 25 NFL Player Salaries for 2005-20061. Vick, Michael $ 23,102,750 Atlanta Falcons 2. Hasselbeck, Matt $ 19,005,280 Seattle Seahawks 3. Pace, Orlando $ 18,000,000 St. Louis Rams 4. Jones, Walter $ 17,701,320 Seattle Seahawks 5. Brady, Tom $ 15,654,180 New England Patriots 6. Bailey, Champ $ 13,507,625 Denver Broncos 7. Smoot, Fred $ 12,300,000 Minnesota Vikings 8. Rolle, Samari $ 12,000,990 Baltimore Ravens 9. Henry, Anthony $ 11,604,840 Dallas Cowboys 10. Ogden, Jonathan $ 10,665,550 Baltimore Ravens 11. Stroud, Marcus $ 10,640,000 Jacksonville Jaguars 12. Woodson, Charles $ 10,537,000 Oakland Raiders 13. Baxter, Gary $ 10,510,698 Cleveland Browns 14. Bulluck, Keith $ 10,251,980 Tennessee Titans 15. Johnson, Rudi $ 10,250,000 Cincinnati Bengals 16. Samuels, Chris $ 9,550,000 Washington Redskins 17. Favre, Brett $ 9,500,000 Green Bay Packers 18. Roethlisberger, Ben $ 9,498,840 Pittsburgh Steelers 19. Lucas, Ken $ 9,400,000 Carolina Panthers 20. Muhammad, Muhsin $ 9,335,407 Chicago Bears 21. Manning, Eli $ 9,305,000 New York Giants 22. Rivera, Marco $ 9,130,280 Dallas Cowboys 23. Ferguson, Jason $ 9,129,290 Dallas Cowboys 24. Wahle, Mike $ 9,100,000 Carolina Panthers 25. James, Edgerrin $ 9,081,000 Indianapolis Colts This doesn't make sense to me. To put Nate into this category would not help the Bills long term. How many of those guys are actually worth it? Champ Bailey? Maybe? How much did Peyton Manning make that year? I thought he was WAY up there..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 How much did Peyton Manning make that year? I thought he was WAY up there..... Again, this counts bonuses that players received that year. As far as I know, the highest paid players overall are Manning and Carson Palmer, but I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Again, this counts bonuses that players received that year. As far as I know, the highest paid players overall are Manning and Carson Palmer, but I could be wrong. I believe it's Palmer...$29 million - and it's guaranteed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBilliever Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 We're 40 million under the cap. If we don't use it on him, we'll have to overpay somebody else who isn't as good. There are way more buyers than sellers for Cornerbacks this year. You answered your own question. No matter what we pay for the guy, there are more buyers willing to pay more money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 The Cover 2 D we use does not require the CBs to be exceptional cover-corners to excel(as a D). It makes little sense to pay top dollar for a player with great WR blanketing skills if the defensive scheme we use calls upon this expensive skill less than other defensive systems will. What? I hear this kind of stuff and it makes me wonder what coaches are thinking? Nate is very good player. He can cover and make interceptions. If your defense can't use these skills, then maybe you need to tweak your defense to take advantage of the skills you have, instead of trying to find players who maybe aren't as good, but are a better fit for your defense. Nate is very very very good CB. Good ones cost money. Someone said we're 40 under the cap. Pay the money and put him out there. A player as good as him can adapt and a good defensive coach can adapt his defense a little to take advantage of him. Pay the man and keep him. IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 What? I hear this kind of stuff and it makes me wonder what coaches are thinking? Nate is very good player. He can cover and make interceptions. If your defense can't use these skills, then maybe you need to tweak your defense to take advantage of the skills you have, instead of trying to find players who maybe aren't as good, but are a better fit for your defense. Nate is very very very good CB. Good ones cost money. Someone said we're 40 under the cap. Pay the money and put him out there. A player as good as him can adapt and a good defensive coach can adapt his defense a little to take advantage of him. Pay the man and keep him. IMHO. Hes a good CB, but not the greatest, and he is not that good in the system that is being run here, he can cover and make interceptions, but recently he has not made many and has not looked that great as everyone is making him out to be. The defence that is being run does not require a corner like Nate, and there are bigger holes to fill that will require more attention. The Bills can get away with having a lesser CB back there if the lines are built to stop the run. Nate is a luxury in this defence and is not a necessity. I think Fletcher is more important to this D then Clements is, and Fletcher was the leader of the D, not Clements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Hes a good CB, but not the greatest, and he is not that good in the system that is being run here, he can cover and make interceptions, but recently he has not made many and has not looked that great as everyone is making him out to be. The defence that is being run does not require a corner like Nate, and there are bigger holes to fill that will require more attention. The Bills can get away with having a lesser CB back there if the lines are built to stop the run. Nate is a luxury in this defence and is not a necessity. I think Fletcher is more important to this D then Clements is, and Fletcher was the leader of the D, not Clements. I think you're wrong here for a few reasons and I have been one of Nate's strongest critics over the years on this board. This past year, for the most part, and for the majority of the season, Nate was terrific. And throw that stuff about the system and the Cover 2 and zones out the window because it simply wasn't true. The second half of the year Nate was on the best WR on the other team no matter where he lined up, and Nate basically shut him down, whomever he was. One of the major reasons, if not the major reason, that Whitner and Simpson did not get beat or look lost this year as rookies was because of how Nate took away the main threat and usually the teams main deep threat. He was terrific, and better than he ever was, regardless of the number of picks. Nate made the pass rush better, too, because QBs would look to their #1 target and then have to look to their #2. If he wasnt there the ball flies out of the QBs hands a lot easier and quicker and the Bills do not have the 7th ranked pass defense. The coaches put a lot of trust and responsibility on Nate in the second half of the year and he played his best football. And again, I have criticized him as much as anyone here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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