What Do You Make Out Of Bush's 'Surge' Plan?

[rockpile]

You know that with this post, you're going to have to spend about 5 pages explaining sarcasm to molson golden showers, right?

 

I am an anarchist. I do not have to do anything except pay taxes.

 

THAT could take five pages to explain.

[molson_golden2002]

Cliff Notes: War sucks and the government sucks at taking care of people, no matter how much taxpayer money they steal.

No! It's a cakewalk, remember? Not surprised you would want to kick it down to the cliff notes and leave out the real details of what is happening to our troops. Progress indeed!

[Alaska Darin]

No! It's a cakewalk, remember? Not surprised you would want to kick it down to the cliff notes and leave out the real details of what is happening to our troops. Progress indeed!

You mean because I was pro "Iraq Invasion", you mindless twit?

[molson_golden2002]

Cliff Notes: War sucks and the government sucks at taking care of people, no matter how much taxpayer money they steal.

Sure, we should cut taxes and let the soldiers buy private health insurance. Close Walter Reed and the VA. Reminds me of the day this war started. The GOP controlled House passed a resolution praising the soldiers....and President Bush!! for their bravery. Later that night they cut funding for the VA! What fvcking a** holes! You may consider taxes to help the wounded soldiers theft, I call it social justice.

[molson_golden2002]

You mean because I was pro "Iraq Invasion", you mindless twit?

Nope, I figure you didn't support this great 'liberal' experiment, but you have complained about the lack of media coverage of the 'progress' and generally have a knee jerk reaction to any criticism of the war, except when you blame it on liberal extravagence. So, I posted something showing the darest side of the war the media barely metions--flag drapped caskets? What flag drapped caskets?--and you reacted predictably, downplaying it. Americans love the cliff notes of war, not the longer real version.

[Alaska Darin]

Nope, I figure you didn't support this great 'liberal' experiment, but you have complained about the lack of media coverage of the 'progress' and generally have a knee jerk reaction to any criticism of the war, except when you blame it on liberal extravagence.

You're right. I have complained about the lack of media coverage of the "progress." You know why? Because I've been on the ground in that situation and the natives watch fukkin' CNN too. Because the natives never see anything positive being broadcast, but see the most heinous rumors trumpeted as concrete fact for days on end, it tends to put them in a more restless mood where the troops are concerned, which PUTS THE TROOPS IN DANGER. But we can pretend it's for some political capital for a party I don't support.

 

Please give us some more sloganeering along the lines of: "you support the troops." Trust me, they don't want your ignorant kind of support.

So, I posted something showing the darest side of the war the media barely metions--flag drapped caskets? What flag drapped caskets?--and you reacted predictably, downplaying it. Americans love the cliff notes of war, not the longer real version.

You let me know when you've attended the funeral of someone you've served with who died right next to you. Then you'll have the right to that discussion, you liberal piece of sh--. Drapped? Moron.

[molson_golden2002]

You're right. I have complained about the lack of media coverage of the "progress." You know why? Because I've been on the ground in that situation and the natives watch fukkin' CNN too. Because the natives never see anything positive being broadcast, but see the most heinous rumors trumpeted as concrete fact for days on end, it tends to put them in a more restless mood where the troops are concerned, which PUTS THE TROOPS IN DANGER. But we can pretend it's for some political capital for a party I don't support.

 

Please give us some more sloganeering along the lines of: "you support the troops." Trust me, they don't want your ignorant kind of support.

 

You let me know when you've attended the funeral of someone you've served with who died right next to you. Then you'll have the right to that discussion, you liberal piece of sh--. Drapped? Moron.

Democracy is a B word, ain't it? Iraq has a free press, you know. If you are going to fight a war to extend, among other things, freedom of the press, then you better be ready for it. And stop making CNN out to be some type of all powerful opinion maker, they are not. They didn't lose this fiasco, it was lost before it started. You can't put together a non-nation with democratic institutions. The three sections of Iraq can only be held together by force. This was a failure from the time it was on the drawing board. CNN is not putting the troops in danger, the people who sent them there are. It's pretty pathetic of you trying to blame this on the news media. You claim to be an extremly independent thinker, but in reality you just take the basic GOP/Bush talking points and change them around a little bit and out comes a different version of the same argument: Its the medias fault! Grow up!

 

And I never said "I support the troops" I don't "support" them any more than I support a janitor at the local school. I support them as human beings who are being exploited for their bravery. They should be brought home so they can enjoy their lives, not stationed on a street corner next to al-Sadr's militia men "guarding" something. If you idea of 'supporting' them is to leave them in that fvcking worthless hell hole then you really need to look in the mirror.

 

And last point, I have every fvcking right to discuss this topic. Just because you went to a funeral of a soldier you knew gives you no more "right" than anybody else to discuss this topic. Democracy sucks, don't it?

[Alaska Darin]

And stop making CNN out to be some type of all powerful opinion maker, they are not.

Ever heard the term "the pen is mightier than the sword"? You think that was coined for a reason? You ever been on the ground in a third world country during any kind of strife? CNN and the liberal news outlets are the very opinion you regurgitate here every day.

They didn't lose this fiasco, it was lost before it started. You can't put together a non-nation with democratic institutions. The three sections of Iraq can only be held together by force. This was a failure from the time it was on the drawing board.

Agreed.

CNN is not putting the troops in danger, the people who sent them there are. It's pretty pathetic of you trying to blame this on the news media. You claim to be an extremly independent thinker, but in reality you just take the basic GOP/Bush talking points and change them around a little bit and out comes a different version of the same argument: Its the medias fault! Grow up!

My opinion comes from being on the ground and doesn't have any close parallels to what politicians are saying. If you think that the media doesn't embolden and shape public opinion, you're a bigger idiot than I thought (and that's quite a leap, really).

And I never said "I support the troops" I don't "support" them any more than I support a janitor at the local school.

That tells the rest of us all we need to know about you.

I support them as human beings who are being exploited for their bravery. They should be brought home so they can enjoy their lives, not stationed on a street corner next to al-Sadr's militia men "guarding" something. If you idea of 'supporting' them is to leave them in that fvcking worthless hell hole then you really need to look in the mirror.

I can see how you'd get that from anything I've typed. Perhaps you should pretend I'm not me, and read my posts in a less adversarial manner - that'd at least keep you from looking like as big an idiot as you likely are.

And last point, I have every fvcking right to discuss this topic. Just because you went to a funeral of a soldier you knew gives you no more "right" than anybody else to discuss this topic. Democracy sucks, don't it?

Blockhead, you were questioning ME, not the topic. I could give a flying rat's ass about your opinion on that topic - hence the reason YOU haven't earned the right to discuss it with ME. Try and use some logic, instead of the estrogen that is coursing through your veins by the keg full.

[Tux of Borg]

And I never said "I support the troops" I don't "support" them any more than I support a janitor at the local school. I support them as human beings who are being exploited for their bravery. They should be brought home so they can enjoy their lives, not stationed on a street corner next to al-Sadr's militia men "guarding" something. If you idea of 'supporting' them is to leave them in that fvcking worthless hell hole then you really need to look in the mirror.

Molson_Golden2002's plan.

1) Withdrawal from Iraq

2) Let Iraq become a terrorist safe haven.

3) Dump the problem onto our kids.

 

Good plan.

[/dev/null]

Molson_Golden2002's plan.

1) Withdrawal from Iraq

2) Let Iraq become a terrorist safe haven.

3) Dump the problem onto our kids.

 

Good plan.

 

More thought out than some of the other plans i've heard

 

1. Withdraw from Iraq

2. ???

3. Teach the world to sing in perfect harmony

[PastaJoe]

Molson_Golden2002's plan.

1) Withdrawal from Iraq

2) Let Iraq become a terrorist safe haven.

3) Dump the problem onto our kids.

 

Good plan.

 

Bush's plan.

1) Send more combat troops into a civil war.

2) Continue to let Iraqis kill our troops.

3) Dump the problem onto the next president.

[Alaska Darin]

Bush's plan.

1) Send more combat troops into a civil war.

2) Continue to let Iraqis kill our troops.

3) Dump the problem onto the next president.

Uh, you forgot:

 

1a. Spend billions more on their infrastructure while ignoring our own.

2a. Profit

[Tux of Borg]

Bush's plan.

1) Send more combat troops into a civil war.

2) Continue to let Iraqis kill our troops.

3) Dump the problem onto the next president.

 

 

The war against Jihad Islam won't end when Bush leaves office. I also disagree that this administration is simply passing off the problem. (hence the title of this thread)

 

Evan Kohlmann wrote a good article about the Ever-Mutating Iraq Insurgency.

 

"In the last three months, as Americans debated military options in Iraq, the Sunni insurgency there seemed to grow more extreme. A network of some of the fiercest fighters, dominated by Al Qaeda in Iraq, forged formal new alliances with several rebel groups and may have begun to draw others into its orbit, according to Evan F. Kohlmann... Until 2006, Mr. Kohlmann said, the Qaeda group was 'essentially losing' in Iraq... All that changed in February, when Al Qaeda in Iraq blew up with Askariya Mosque in Samarra, one of Shiite Islam's holiest shrines. 'That event opened the door to bloodletting between Sunnis and Shiites,' Mr. Kohlmann said, which was the intent... The Samarra bombing was followed by months of violent reprisals by Shiites against Sunnis. Al Qaeda in Iraq, virulently anti-Shiite, became a refuge for aggrieved and beleaguered Sunnis..."

[molson_golden2002]

Ever heard the term "the pen is mightier than the sword"? You think that was coined for a reason? You ever been on the ground in a third world country during any kind of strife? CNN and the liberal news outlets are the very opinion you regurgitate here every day.

 

Agreed.

 

My opinion comes from being on the ground and doesn't have any close parallels to what politicians are saying. If you think that the media doesn't embolden and shape public opinion, you're a bigger idiot than I thought (and that's quite a leap, really).

 

That tells the rest of us all we need to know about you.

 

I can see how you'd get that from anything I've typed. Perhaps you should pretend I'm not me, and read my posts in a less adversarial manner - that'd at least keep you from looking like as big an idiot as you likely are.

 

Blockhead, you were questioning ME, not the topic. I could give a flying rat's ass about your opinion on that topic - hence the reason YOU haven't earned the right to discuss it with ME. Try and use some logic, instead of the estrogen that is coursing through your veins by the keg full.

Pen might be mighter than the sword, but local leaders have a hell of a lot more sway over Iraqis than does CNN or any other network. It's laughable that CNN is a major reason the insurgency and civil war are happening. Total cop out.

 

Me? Reading your posts in an adversarial manner? I just treat you like you treat me.

[/dev/null]

Uh, you forgot:

 

1a. Spend billions more on their infrastructure while ignoring our own.

2a. Profit

 

At least with Foley gone they're not stealing anymore underpants.

[molson_golden2002]

Molson_Golden2002's plan.

1) Withdrawal from Iraq

2) Let Iraq become a terrorist safe haven.

3) Dump the problem onto our kids.

 

Good plan.

Glad you chimed in. Iraq is done. Its gone, there really is no Iraq. Its three seperate regions that hate and mistrust each other. On top of that the educated middle class has fled, there are few people to do the important thinking jobs a modern society needs. So stay there trying to get the country to function is a really bad idea that will just get more GIs killed and waste national treasure

 

Will it become a 'terrorist haven'? Who knows, but we can't stay there forever. Guess we will have to keep tabs on the place, but in the end, the Iraqis will have to settle what type of country they want to have by themselves. And maybe the idea of using diplomacy might actually help us keep tabs on terrorsits in the region.

 

Dump this problem on our kids, and energy dependence, and the national debt with the retiring baby boomers, and global warming and and and

[molson_golden2002]

The war against Jihad Islam won't end when Bush leaves office. I also disagree that this administration is simply passing off the problem. (hence the title of this thread)

 

Evan Kohlmann wrote a good article about the Ever-Mutating Iraq Insurgency.

 

"In the last three months, as Americans debated military options in Iraq, the Sunni insurgency there seemed to grow more extreme. A network of some of the fiercest fighters, dominated by Al Qaeda in Iraq, forged formal new alliances with several rebel groups and may have begun to draw others into its orbit, according to Evan F. Kohlmann... Until 2006, Mr. Kohlmann said, the Qaeda group was 'essentially losing' in Iraq... All that changed in February, when Al Qaeda in Iraq blew up with Askariya Mosque in Samarra, one of Shiite Islam's holiest shrines. 'That event opened the door to bloodletting between Sunnis and Shiites,' Mr. Kohlmann said, which was the intent... The Samarra bombing was followed by months of violent reprisals by Shiites against Sunnis. Al Qaeda in Iraq, virulently anti-Shiite, became a refuge for aggrieved and beleaguered Sunnis..."

So in other words, its a civil war