CFLstyle Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 the point of the picture was that it was a very, very difficult 45 yard kick. also, for those who don't remember, it was practically a blizzard, not a light snowfall. it's not for nothing that that is now regarded as perhaps the greatest kick in nfl history. please don't try and argue that a 45 yarder in sunny, 40 degree weather into a 20 mph wind (at best) was more difficult than AV's. Also, christie's 48 yard game winner against NE in 1999 in a howling rainstorm tells me that some kickers rise to the occasion. Lindell chose not to, and that wasn't unreasonable. the bills still had a lot of time, and 4th and 5 isn't an insurmountable down/distance situation. i, however, would have elected to kick the field goal. 878340[/snapback] Lindell chose not to? Did you even follow the game? He was going out there to kick and then the coaches called him back. He didn't make that decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 26, 2006 Author Share Posted December 26, 2006 Lindell chose not to? Did you even follow the game? He was going out there to kick and then the coaches called him back. He didn't make that decision. 878346[/snapback] not true - in one of the stories after the game, it was reported that DJ asked RL how he felt, and he said he wasn't confident he could make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFLstyle Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 so why was he running out onto the field and then called back by the coach? Makes no sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 26, 2006 Author Share Posted December 26, 2006 don't know - confusion, i guess. in the end, I don't think that DJ coached poorly that day. they were in a position to beat a good team at the very end, and they didn't get it done. if losman converts the fourth down, then all would be well and we'd be talking about how they pulled out another close one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v246/big...nd20raiders.jpgI like Lindell a lot, but "coward" is the word that comes to mind. 878067[/snapback] There was no 30 mph wind to kick in that game. Sorry. You're arguing apples and oranutangs here. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 Bironas has a stronger leg than Lindell. (Lindell would never make a 60 yard kick without a 20mph wind at his back). Bironas BARELY squeaked in a 42 yarder earlier in the game, kicking into the wind. Tell me how Lindell, with his weaker leg, and ever weaker late-game history, would have been able to punch through a 45 yarder? 878107[/snapback] No, I think folks just wanted to march out the kicker so they could blame him for missing a very difficult kick. So they could have an excuse, you know? It's totally ridiculous. Rian Lindell says he would get the distance about 20% of the time, but I say more like less than 10% from what we've seen. Then you add in his lack of clutch over his career.....you are talking about a 1 in 20 chance at making that kick. Going for it was far and away the right choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGTEleven Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v246/big...nd20raiders.jpgI like Lindell a lot, but "coward" is the word that comes to mind. 878067[/snapback] You are so off on this that it is ridiculous. I was at the Jets game in week three. At the same end of the field under basically the same conditions, Lindell kicked the tar out of a 36 yard attempt. It probably would have gone from 55 on a still day. It looked like it would hit the screen if not go over. The wind made it look like it hit a brick wall. When it fell (barely beyond the crossbar), it fell at virtually 180 degrees to the ground. For him to make it from 45 that day would have been the greatest kick in the history of the NFL. If the Titans game conditions were remotely similar, he had zero chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmac17 Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 it was practically a blizzard, not a light snowfall yes, it was snowing hard and in huge flakes but it was as calm as could be from a wind perspective - so the real issue was getting a good hold and good footing on the turf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olaf Fub Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 A man has got to know his limitations. Lindell knows his. He thought he couldn't make it and he and Jauron did what they thought gave us the best chance to win. I kind of respect him for it. The NFL is filled with big egos. His humility and desire to put the team first is refreshing. Credit the Titans D on that 4th down. That play wasn't designed to be a Hail Mary. The Titans secondary had everyone covered and JP threw the bomb only after it was his only choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RkFast Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 Tell that to Scotty Norwood... 878338[/snapback] Whats nine FEET in football? Its nuttin, I tell ya! Nuttin!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 26, 2006 Author Share Posted December 26, 2006 No, I think folks just wanted to march out the kicker so they could blame him for missing a very difficult kick. So they could have an excuse, you know? It's totally ridiculous. Rian Lindell says he would get the distance about 20% of the time, but I say more like less than 10% from what we've seen. Then you add in his lack of clutch over his career.....you are talking about a 1 in 20 chance at making that kick. Going for it was far and away the right choice. 878427[/snapback] i didn't want him to fail - i just thought it was a 50/50 shot, and he's a pretty good kicker to boot. lest we all buy into the lie that hurricane katrina somehow came back to life over the ralph on sunday (note how one poster has increased the windspeed from 20 mph to 30 mph in this thread), steve christie, who had a weaker leg than lindell by 1999, made a far more difficult kick in late 1999 from 48 yards - into driving wind and rain in a foxboro sandpit. all of this being said, i don't think going for it was an awful decision by any stretch. at the end of the day, it was really six dozen of one, half dozen of another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 26, 2006 Author Share Posted December 26, 2006 yes, it was snowing hard and in huge flakes but it was as calm as could be from a wind perspective - so the real issue was getting a good hold and good footing on the turf. 878435[/snapback] ball is heavier and the air was colder too - that factors in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 ball is heavier and the air was colder too - that factors in. 878470[/snapback] Yup. A hard football travels a much shorter distance then a soft football. When I used to do some place kicking we would substitute an old softened ball on kickoffs. That adjustment increased my kickoff average 7 yards from the previous season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Drane Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 For anyone who went to the last 4 home games....the wind was pretty consistant for all 4. Lindell can make it 35 yards into the wind....and 60 yards with it. If we were going the other way, I would have more confidence in us trying a field goal from the 50 over Lindell trying that 45 yarder. People have every right to complain about the confusion involved, but the call to go for it was 97% correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 ball is heavier 878470[/snapback] The refs would have changed the ball out for AV's kick...no sand lot rules in the NFL, especially at Foxborough. And wouldn't cold air be thinner/less dense than moist/40-degree air, ergo less resistence? Better to just have a and let it go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 26, 2006 Author Share Posted December 26, 2006 The refs would have changed the ball out for AV's kick...no sand lot rules in the NFL, especially at Foxborough. And wouldn't cold air be thinner/less dense than moist/40-degree air, ergo less resistence? Better to just have a and let it go. 878504[/snapback] Touche, and LOL! I'm lettin' it go ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 i didn't want him to fail - i just thought it was a 50/50 shot, and he's a pretty good kicker to boot. lest we all buy into the lie that hurricane katrina somehow came back to life over the ralph on sunday (note how one poster has increased the windspeed from 20 mph to 30 mph in this thread), steve christie, who had a weaker leg than lindell by 1999, made a far more difficult kick in late 1999 from 48 yards - into driving wind and rain in a foxboro sandpit. all of this being said, i don't think going for it was an awful decision by any stretch. at the end of the day, it was really six dozen of one, half dozen of another. 878468[/snapback] You are just flat out wrong. Sorry. Sit at the 50 yard line in this stadium for 150 or so games and then tell me about the "slightly inclement" conditions. A 50/50 shot? Here's the truth for a lot of you out of towners who don't get to many games.....the wind alters WAY too many games here, and it's worse now than it was before they closed up the tunnel end with luxury boxes. It used to be a factor 3-4 times per year. Now, when it's NOT a factor it's news. It can be dead calm in the parking lot and nearly the same in the stands, and the flags on the posts can be flapping gently, but the wind is whipping and swirling on the field, and especially in that scoreboard endzone. As Lori says, the ball reaches the goal line and hits a brick wall. I'm all for playing in the elements, but I'm getting sick of this man-made wind tunnel effecting the outcome of games and the quality of offensive football we get to see. If the field were tilted toward one endzone over the other, it would be no different than it is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 Were you there? Were you at the game? Did you feel the wind? Did you see it swirl? I was. I was there. I saw it. It would have been more likely we could have made a 1st down than made the FG. Let's not be silly here, OK? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v246/big...nd20raiders.jpgI like Lindell a lot, but "coward" is the word that comes to mind. 878067[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 ball is heavier and the air was colder too - that factors in. 878470[/snapback] Yeah, and it was about 7 feet in the air when it cleared the LOS because nobody could get footing to get up to block it. Lindell and Bironas's didn't have that option on Sunday, such a kick would have been sent right back at them. Two TOTALLY different situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 26, 2006 Author Share Posted December 26, 2006 You are just flat out wrong. Sorry. Sit at the 50 yard line in this stadium for 150 or so games and then tell me about the "slightly inclement" conditions. A 50/50 shot? Here's the truth for a lot of you out of towners who don't get to many games.....the wind alters WAY too many games here, and it's worse now than it was before they closed up the tunnel end with luxury boxes. It used to be a factor 3-4 times per year. Now, when it's NOT a factor it's news. It can be dead calm in the parking lot and nearly the same in the stands, and the flags on the posts can be flapping gently, but the wind is whipping and swirling on the field, and especially in that scoreboard endzone. As Lori says, the ball reaches the goal line and hits a brick wall. I'm all for playing in the elements, but I'm getting sick of this man-made wind tunnel effecting the outcome of games and the quality of offensive football we get to see. If the field were tilted toward one endzone over the other, it would be no different than it is now. 878550[/snapback] Badol, I hear you and trust you, but this was a game where the kickers went 8 for freaking 8. yeah, i know, it obviously gets shakier at the longer distances, but still -- this was hardly raiders at cleveland in the 1981 afc championship game, where even extra points were dearly bought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts