Pyrite Gal Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 That's a great plan. Who's going to pay for it? 854192[/snapback] The private sector through the purchase of bonds initially offered by a NYS authority which can get far better rates of return on the investment than private sector bonds because of the lower risk in government securities. In the long run NYS will pay back the bonds when they mature using tax revenues spread across all the taxpayers in the state and what ever largesse is negotiated for a cut of the revenues from the stadium. It results in a great deal for WNY if this is the method chosen for cash generation as the costs are spread across all taxpayers and thus the much larger population center downstate shares in the costs but WNY gets most of the revenue in the form of the job estra generated starting with construction and going through the heightened activity in ghe depressed urban core. The question is not whether the upfront cash can be generated (Ralph can do this himself if he chose to go into debt now for the likely greater returns in profit from theNFL cash cow, however, the question for him is why should he borrow when local taxpayers are willing to pay him the money for this product). The question is whether the political leadership of NYS is wiling to spread this debt cost over the entire state for WNY. My sense is the answer can be yes as: 1. When NYC and its suburbs split evenly between the Dems and GOP, then WNY wields disproportionate power as the major swing area in the state, If NYS flosts the bond for a WNY stadium authoroty and locks the Bills in here then Spitzer and the Dems will get the credit for holding this team in WNY for the forseeable future. 2, The Bills are actually the one team which plays in NYS and were they to move it would be an unacceptable embarassment for the state. 3. Floating a bond for WNY strngthens the hands of those who wish to see a similar authority to be created to build a stadium in NYC. 4. The $800 million cost is large to the normal person but really is chump change in the huge NYS market of finanical generation led by the Wall St. cash cow and the tax dollars it generates. 5. Stadiums are genarally not the best or even a good investment for cash generation by a state or municipality. However. Buffalo is so moribund in terms of downtown activity by like it or not the urban core of the region this investment will not have to move the dial very far in terms of increased activity to mark a substantial increase in urban core activity. If one builds a stadium as laid out by the article in Buffalo Rising that is design to look beyond the central failing of an NFL Stadium that it only provides 8 regular season and 2 preseason dates to build othersatellite draws which generate more regular traffic it can be a positive investment for the City and the surrounding suburbs who like it or not have their vitality determined in many ways by the vitality of urban core. It is going to be difficult to bring off but it is not complex at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 4. The $800 million cost is large to the normal person but really is chump change in the huge NYS market of finanical generation led by the Wall St. cash cow and the tax dollars it generates. 854248[/snapback] New York State...leading the nation in tax-supported public debt, one dollar at a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 (edited) If one builds a stadium as laid out by the article in Buffalo Rising that is design to look beyond the central failing of an NFL Stadium that it only provides 8 regular season and 2 preseason dates to build othersatellite draws which generate more regular traffic it can be a positive investment for the City and the surrounding suburbs who like it or not have their vitality determined in many ways by the vitality of urban core. 854248[/snapback] That's sort of what the Hamilton County, OH commissioners said, when they floated a popular vote to raise the county sales tax by 1/2% (they originally wanted 1 %, but even the stupidest of voters objected to that) to build Mike Brown's free new stadium for him. The big proponent of the project, one of the commissioners, was employed by the B'gals at an upper-6 figure salary after he lost his re-election bid. The new stadium has resulted in no detectable increase of downtown activity over the old facility. Recent team successes have an effect, but that would be the case if the old Riverfront stadium still stood. Due to sales tax shortfalls, the county has recently been forced to refinance because the income can't service the debt obligations. Edited December 2, 2006 by stuckincincy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeLuca1967 Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 The private sector through the purchase of bonds initially offered by a NYS authority which can get far better rates of return on the investment than private sector bonds because of the lower risk in government securities. In the long run NYS will pay back the bonds when they mature using tax revenues spread across all the taxpayers in the state and what ever largesse is negotiated for a cut of the revenues from the stadium. It results in a great deal for WNY if this is the method chosen for cash generation as the costs are spread across all taxpayers and thus the much larger population center downstate shares in the costs but WNY gets most of the revenue in the form of the job estra generated starting with construction and going through the heightened activity in ghe depressed urban core. The question is not whether the upfront cash can be generated (Ralph can do this himself if he chose to go into debt now for the likely greater returns in profit from theNFL cash cow, however, the question for him is why should he borrow when local taxpayers are willing to pay him the money for this product). The question is whether the political leadership of NYS is wiling to spread this debt cost over the entire state for WNY. My sense is the answer can be yes as: 1. When NYC and its suburbs split evenly between the Dems and GOP, then WNY wields disproportionate power as the major swing area in the state, If NYS flosts the bond for a WNY stadium authoroty and locks the Bills in here then Spitzer and the Dems will get the credit for holding this team in WNY for the forseeable future. 2, The Bills are actually the one team which plays in NYS and were they to move it would be an unacceptable embarassment for the state. 3. Floating a bond for WNY strngthens the hands of those who wish to see a similar authority to be created to build a stadium in NYC. 4. The $800 million cost is large to the normal person but really is chump change in the huge NYS market of finanical generation led by the Wall St. cash cow and the tax dollars it generates. 5. Stadiums are genarally not the best or even a good investment for cash generation by a state or municipality. However. Buffalo is so moribund in terms of downtown activity by like it or not the urban core of the region this investment will not have to move the dial very far in terms of increased activity to mark a substantial increase in urban core activity. If one builds a stadium as laid out by the article in Buffalo Rising that is design to look beyond the central failing of an NFL Stadium that it only provides 8 regular season and 2 preseason dates to build othersatellite draws which generate more regular traffic it can be a positive investment for the City and the surrounding suburbs who like it or not have their vitality determined in many ways by the vitality of urban core. It is going to be difficult to bring off but it is not complex at all. 854248[/snapback] How does the new 'Yankee Stadium' play into something like this? I know the Yankees are picking up most of the tab. Also, How much sense does it really make to build a $800 million stadium in such a depressed area when it's only used 10 times a year. And what happens to the Ralph? The Aud already costs the city a nice chunk of change every year to maintain. What type of drain will the Ralph be on the county? Do you tear it down? It costs $40,000 to raise a house in the city. I can't imagine the cost of a stucture like the Ralph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 A meeting of Erie County and City of Buffalo public sector workers should fill it up... 854068[/snapback] hehehe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 You're undoubtedly right. From the article: "Now, if you listen to Wilson, and maybe we should, Buffalo is in danger of losing its football team. Our ticket prices are the lowest in the league and when we fail to sell-out games, the resulting black-outs cost the franchise millions in lost television revenue. Now it also seems likely that the remaining games may not sell out, thus having a string of 5 consecutive games blacked-out. This would be a major." Incomplete sentences are a forte here. 854049[/snapback] If that was true. Why wouldn't the Bills "donate" the tickets? The Bills get their TV money before the season even starts so that sounds like a bunch of bullsh--. The Bills get paid if the game is on or not. 854104[/snapback] You've put the em-fah'-sis on the wrong sill-ah'- bull. It was the incomplete sentence I was keying on, my good man To whit: "This would be a major." - not the communistic TV revenue sharing plan. As a former resident of Upstate/Western NY, I gladly defer in practical matters such as garbage pickup, police enforcement and stadium building to the current crop of locals. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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