ganesh Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 In Elway's defense, he never really had great "skill position" players around him. And his defenses were never that great either, until he SB years, despite having guys like Atwater and Simon Fletcher. 851782[/snapback] Neither does Losman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Neither does Losman. I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted November 29, 2006 Author Share Posted November 29, 2006 Since his stats look bad Elway wasn't good enough early on? Is that what you’re trying to get at AD? He led countless comebacks, and made plays. He also made some mistakes. That's what happens when you don't have to read defenses in college. These athletic QB's spend half the time outside the pocket in college, and it takes them longer to develop in the pros. Nobody’s saying he will become Elway. But to deny the recent progression, and historical proof that he's can still be a franchise QB, well it's just inaccurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartshan-83 Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Another set of stats for you all: Games: 27 Attempts: 570 Completions: 304 Percentage: 53.3 TDs: 21 Ints: 21 Guess who? 851786[/snapback] Yes. This is the guy I thought JP could become. Crazy how he started off with that accuracy and went on to be maybe the most accurate QB of all-time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 In Elway's defense, he never really had great "skill position" players around him. And his defenses were never that great either, until he SB years, despite having guys like Atwater and Simon Fletcher. 851782[/snapback] You mean like Losman has around him? No offense, but Denver had a hell of alot more talent (Dennis Smith, Rulon Jones, Mecklenburg, Louis Wright, Keith Bishop, Mark Haynes, Greg Kragen, Bobby Humphrey, Michael Brooks, Shannon Sharp, Gary Zimmerman (one of the best Olineman I've ever seen), Tom Nalen, Ted Washington, Mark Schlereth, Michael Dean Perry, Romo, Tyrone Braxton, Terrell Davis, Rod Smith, Vance Johnson, Mark Jackson, Ricky Nattiel) than you're giving them credit for. Did Elway elevate the team? Absolutely. But they were a very talented football team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pBills Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Hopefully Marv has some sense and we draft Quinn if he is available. JP is not a good QB. 851785[/snapback] And you are forgetting the imrpovement? Also, how are you basing his progress? Against whom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willis990 Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Quinn is overrated. 851790[/snapback] JP was very much overated to be selected in this first round. He is not first round material. Yes he is mobile and has a good arm but he lacks in Football intelligence. Read the scouting reports about him and you will see that were concerns about his Football intelligence i.e. processing info., looking off defenders, relying on his quickness and arm strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 I think its early to be comparing JP to Elway at this point. However, JP could turn out to be one heck of a football player. If he keeps playing like he has since the bye, he's our guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraith Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 JP was very much overated to be selected in this first round. He is not first round material. Yes he is mobile and has a good arm but he lacks in Football intelligence. Read the scouting reports about him and you will see that were concerns about his Football intelligence i.e. processing info., looking off defenders, relying on his quickness and arm strength. 851805[/snapback] What does that have to do with the present? You don't have to look hard to see that he is mentally capable of succeeding as an NFL QB. The only question that remains is if he can CONSISTENTLY apply those mental abilities. That is an important if. He's got all the tools, mentally and physically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted November 29, 2006 Author Share Posted November 29, 2006 Another set of stats for you all: Games: 27 Attempts: 570 Completions: 304 Percentage: 53.3 TDs: 21 Ints: 21 Guess who? 851786[/snapback] I always enjoy when somebody tries to disprove your entire point by criticizing one part of your argument. Even better is when they do it with providing nothing to the discussion. You can spit out statistics all day, it doesn't make my points any less valid because they're not based completely on statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Since his stats look bad Elway wasn't good enough early on? Is that what you’re trying to get at AD? He led countless comebacks, and made plays. He also made some mistakes. That's what happens when you don't have to read defenses in college. These athletic QB's spend half the time outside the pocket in college, and it takes them longer to develop in the pros. Nobody’s saying he will become Elway. But to deny the recent progression, and historical proof that he's can still be a franchise QB, well it's just inaccurate. 851796[/snapback] Dude, I'm agreeing with you. At the beginning of the year I posted that I expected the BILLS to struggle the first half of the season and hoped we'd see progress the second half (which is exactly how it's gone to this point). There are alot of stupid people out there who simply don't understand what a difficult transition it is for quarterbacks at the NFL level and attempt to use exceptions to the rule to prove their retardia. When guys like Steve Young and John Elway have such difficult adjustment periods, there's no way a guy like Losman (whose skill set lies within those two great players) doesn't deserve to grow along with the continued building of a talented team around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 I always enjoy when somebody tries to disprove your entire point by criticizing one part of your argument. Even better is when they do it with providing nothing to the discussion. You can spit out statistics all day, it doesn't make my points any less valid because they're not based completely on statistics. 851813[/snapback] Honestly, could you stop being fuggin' defensive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pBills Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 What does that have to do with the present? You don't have to look hard to see that he is mentally capable of succeeding as an NFL QB. The only question that remains is if he can CONSISTENTLY apply those mental abilities. That is an important if. He's got all the tools, mentally and physically. 851811[/snapback] All it is, is exactly what everyone already knew... he needs the playing time. He got hurt his first year, was messed around with last year and NOW, we have coaches that realize he needs the snaps to get better. The more you see and do something the better you get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartshan-83 Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 I've lost track of who's disagree with who... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobblehead Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 I was thinking Bert Jones, myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 JP was very much overated to be selected in this first round. He is not first round material. Yes he is mobile and has a good arm but he lacks in Football intelligence. Read the scouting reports about him and you will see that were concerns about his Football intelligence i.e. processing info., looking off defenders, relying on his quickness and arm strength. 851805[/snapback] Yeah, that's why if we hadn't picked him Green Bay would have. Because he wasn't worth the first rounder. I'm absolutely shocked that a guy that played his college football at Tulane would struggle with the nuances of the NFL, you know, with that schools track record of developing professional football players. How's the most ready, football intelligent QB in the last 10 years, Matt Leinhart looking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pBills Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Yeah, that's why if we hadn't picked him Green Bay would have. Because he wasn't worth the first rounder. I'm absolutely shocked that a guy that played his college football at Tulane would struggle with the nuances of the NFL, you know, with that schools track record of developing professional football players. How's the most ready, football intelligent QB in the last 10 years, Matt Leinhart looking? 851825[/snapback] Enough with the bashing of JP. He's has made strides even though he has to deal with crap before this year. He's playing well. JP should have gone through his growing pains last year, yet MM had no patience and little coaching ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted November 29, 2006 Author Share Posted November 29, 2006 Honestly, could you stop being fuggin' defensive? 851815[/snapback] Never mind, I saw your other post, I must have took your post out of context. Doing thirty things at once (and I do need to stop being defensive). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Never mind, I saw your other post, I must have took your post out of context. Doing thirty things at once (and I do need to stop being defensive). 851830[/snapback] Cool. I'd say I'll go out of my way to better explain myself, but we both know that'd be a line of crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Gary Marangi? 851751[/snapback] hey! marangi wasn't all bad! that first pass he threw against miami still brings a smile to my face. not sure what happened after that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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