finally someone with a clue not mindlessly ...

[truth on hold]

The receivers are below avg.,  the O-line is below avg., but the QB is just plain poor right now. He could make this thing better- more efficient- but he just does not have the ability to.

 

Why do you guys think Mark Brunnell is getting benched?  His numbers are better than JP.  But when you listen to the reasoning, Brunnel is not getting the ball down the middle of the field to his playmakers,,,,he is taking the easy dump offs too often,,,,he is failing in the red zone,,,he's just not making plays.  He does not have any more or less time than JP in the pocket.  Just like Brunnell,  JP Losman's numbers are totally flawed.  Both are pretty decent between the 30 yard lines but on the critical parts of the field they cannot make enough plays.

837594[/snapback]

except for the occasional evans, who are buffalos playmakers @ WR & TE?

[zow2]

except for the occasional evans, who are buffalos playmakers @ WR & TE?

837607[/snapback]

 

It's funny how in training camp so many fans loved our WR depth. People were upset because we had to cut 2 or 3 guys. Anyway, i said the receivers are not great but i do believe they are competent enough to run good short or medium range routes. I feel like our offense is so forced and out of sync that when they hit a 15 yd pass it is more lucky than planned.

[34-78-83]

theyre throwing less and less as the season goes on because they see more and more how much it costs them in sacks, plays for little or no yards and turnovers. theyve stopped throwing because JP has no one to throw it to. you'd see his completion percentage drop a lot if he put it up over 30x a game.  it's easiest to have a high completion rate when the opposing defense plays mostly run with run-blitzes and plays man on your WRs. if your WRs cant get open in single coverage they cant get open, period.

837473[/snapback]

 

They're throwing less because they don't get the time to throw, not because the WR's aren't getting open. Go and listen to the Coach talk about this himself at the official site, multimedia section. Sure, it happens once in a while that none of the receivers get open, or JP misses seeing an open guy, but is certainly not the crux of the matter. When you run a 5 step drop passing play, and cannot get past 2 and 1/2 seconds before the qb gets contacted, it's the line. Jp's completion % hasn't really wavered whether throwing 13 passes or 30 passes.

 

Also, blaming the offense's problems mostly on the line is not "mindless". It's reality. And it has been a problem here since the mid nineties. At times, they've been able to run block pretty well, but the pass protection has been consistently putrid throughout those years, with the only spell of success coming from a Qb who's whole game was based on improvising and running in circles.

[/dev/null]

A clue?

 

This sounds like a job for the Hardley Boys

[bluv]

The receivers are below avg.,  the O-line is below avg., but the QB is just plain poor right now. He could make this thing better- more efficient- but he just does not have the ability to.

 

Why do you guys think Mark Brunnell is getting benched?  His numbers are better than JP.  But when you listen to the reasoning, Brunnel is not getting the ball down the middle of the field to his playmakers,,,,he is taking the easy dump offs too often,,,,he is failing in the red zone,,,he's just not making plays.  He does not have any more or less time than JP in the pocket.  Just like Brunnell,  JP Losman's numbers are totally flawed.  Both are pretty decent between the 30 yard lines but on the critical parts of the field they cannot make enough plays.

837594[/snapback]

But JP doesn't throw a lot of easy dumpoff passes; ala Holcomb for most of the TE's and RB's are helping with the blocking. The biggest difference between the two is that Brunell is an aging QB with no upside and a weakening arm and doesn't have the ability or arm strength to throw the ball down the field; ala Holcomb. JP can and when those plays are called he has shown that he can make all the throws. And in the redzone, not having a dominant run blocking O-line, smaller WR's, and not receiving threat at TE become even bigger factors in the redzone when the field shrinks and defenses have less real estate to cover.

 

I know you will come back and say look at Peyton Manning and what a great QB like him can do and change the game; well what if we had Peyton? What if I had Beyonce', Janet, J'Lo, Hyatt,Jessica,Electra, & Halle as sex toys for every day off the week anytime I choice; sounds great doesn't it!

[AnthonyF]

If you don't call plays that are throws to the end zone, you are not going to score in the redzone. Play call, when it is a pass is usually thrown to the 8 yard line and then ask for the receiver to make it in the endzone. How about throwing it in to the endzone once in a blue moon?

 

Let's blame our bad redzone play on JP's inability to hand off the ball properly.

 

Vs. Indy JP made one bad pass in the redzone (to Royal 5-7 yards short of the end zone). He completed a throwaway pass to Peerless for -2 yards and that wonderful sack by Freeny when the OC decided he should be blocked by our TE on an obvious passing situation. Add to that maybe if JP is in the shot gun, he could survey the blocking scheme (if not then yes he may not be ready to QB in this league), see the mismatch vs. Freeny and either change the play, call time out or dump off quick....

 

Oh the other plays in the Redzone all draws outside the 10 yard line....

[zow2]

But JP doesn't throw a lot of easy dumpoff passes; ala Holcomb for most of the TE's and RB's are helping with the blocking. The biggest difference between the two is that Brunell is an aging QB with no upside and a weakening arm and doesn't have the ability or arm strength to throw the ball down the field; ala Holcomb. JP can and when those plays are called he has shown that he can make all the throws. And in the redzone, not having a dominant run blocking O-line, smaller WR's, and not receiving threat at TE become even bigger factors in the redzone when the field shrinks and defenses have less real estate to cover.

 

I know you will come back and say look at Peyton Manning and what a great QB like him can do and change the game; well what if we had Peyton? What if I had Beyonce', Janet, J'Lo, Hyatt,Jessica,Electra, & Halle as sex toys for every day off the week anytime I choice; sounds great doesn't it!

837630[/snapback]

 

Are their any dominant O-lines anymore??? Are San Diego and KC "Dominant" or is it that LT and Larry Johnson are awesome RB's?!? I think it's the latter. Don Banks was on WGR yesterday and specifically said the O-lines around the NFL are a problem for nearly every team. HE even called the BIlls average and said they are not the worst...sub-par YES, but not the worst or bottom 3. Anyway, Anthony Thomas for his last two teams (Dallas & New Orleans) had 43 carries for 92 yds.....a paltry 2.1 ypc avg. For the Bills he has 59 for 243,, a 4.1 avg. So are the Bills O-line dominant run blockers? NO, but they are certainly doing a capable job imo.

 

B/T/W/ i would bever compare JP to Peyton. That's not fair and JP will never get to that level. I just want him to at least be comparable to a Romo, Pennington or even a Brian Griese for that matter.

[bluv]

Are their any dominant O-lines anymore???  Are San Diego and KC "Dominant" or is it that LT and Larry Johnson are awesome RB's?!?  I think it's the latter.  Don Banks was on WGR yesterday and specifically said the O-lines around the NFL are a problem for nearly every team.  HE even called the BIlls average and said they are not the worst...sub-par YES, but not the worst or bottom 3.  Anyway,  Anthony Thomas for his last two teams (Dallas & New Orleans) had 43 carries for 92 yds.....a paltry 2.1 ypc avg.    For the Bills he has 59 for 243,, a 4.1 avg.  So are the Bills O-line dominant run blockers? NO, but they are certainly doing a capable job imo.

 

B/T/W/  i would bever compare JP to Peyton.  That's not fair and JP will never get to that level.  I just want him to at least be comparable to a Romo, Pennington or even a Brian Griese for that matter.

837643[/snapback]

True; there aren't many dominant O-lines. Before the shuffle was made to the offensive line I think they received too much blame. But after the shift the pass blocking has been horrendous. But back to the issue; it doesn't take a dominant line line to block in the red zone. But answer this: how come very team we play against the O-line suddenly becomes dominant and run the ball down our throats in the red zone or run the clock out at the end of games? Or how come most teams find ways to keep our pass rush under control and QB's have ample time to throw except for a few plays here or there? An opposite question on offense: how come when we play teams that are he worse in the league at stopping the pass one week and the run the next, they suddenly become at least average or great at stopping it? Reality: because we are just not a very good team and poor in the trenches on both sides and we are rebuilding and fans seem to forget that. And in the red zone these shortcomings are definitely exploited and brought to the front even more. On both sides, offense and defense there is nowhere to hide. If you are weak up front, it will show. On offense if you have either big receiving targets at either WR or TE, a big bruising back, or an experience QB who can thread the needle consistently you may can get by and make an extra play or two that the average team won't. We have none of the above. We have suspect blocking, small WR, no passing threat at TE, and average RBs. SUre some can pin it all on JP or another specific player but in reality if you have no threats you have no options the defense has to respect thus you have no success!

 

And if you want to compare JP to Romo or Pennington, they both have been in the league longer. Romo has played with the same coach and system for the past 4 years and has proven Pro Bowl quality receiving threats. If we had TO, Glenn, and Whitten and we had even the pass blocking we had before the last 2 games when we made the shuffle, I'd be way more critical of JP and the playcalling. But all we have is an unproven #1 WR and a bunch of #3 WR; I won't even mention our TEs! That combined with the poor pass blocking the past 2 weeks all you can expect from JP and Fairchild is to not lose games by turnovers.

[ganesh]

The receivers are below avg.,  the O-line is below avg., but the QB is just plain poor right now. He could make this thing better- more efficient- but he just does not have the ability to.

 

Why do you guys think Mark Brunnell is getting benched?  His numbers are better than JP.  But when you listen to the reasoning, Brunnel is not getting the ball down the middle of the field to his playmakers,,,,he is taking the easy dump offs too often,,,,he is failing in the red zone,,,he's just not making plays.  He does not have any more or less time than JP in the pocket.  Just like Brunnell,  JP Losman's numbers are totally flawed.  Both are pretty decent between the 30 yard lines but on the critical parts of the field they cannot make enough plays.

837594[/snapback]

 

Mark Brunnell is being benched because the Redskins like the Bills want to look at their future....They know what they can get from Brunell and he is not taking them to the playoffs...They want to find out about Campbell...

[Rubes]

Okay, I'm going to throw something out there. Take it for what it's worth, just a stream of consciousness.

 

The best way to defend the Bills passing attack is to do two things: get pressure on JP (not much of a challenge, really), and play tight coverage on the receivers. None of this zone crap.

 

Why? Why play tight man coverage against a team with speedy receivers? Isn't that asking for trouble with the deep pass?

 

Not against this team. It is so easy to generate pressure on JP that there is almost never the opportunity to throw deep. That requires a deep drop, time to let the receivers run deep, set, and throw. Ain't gonna happen. Defenses don't have to worry much about medium to deep passing routes, because they just don't have the time to develop, at least not most of the time. That's especially true once we get inside the 30 yard line.

 

In the NFL, all receivers can get open, eventually. If it's against tight man coverage, it might take a little longer. But against the Bills, you don't have to worry about that. You'll almost never have to hold coverage for a long time. JP will get sacked long before then.

 

So are the receivers a mess? Yes, but not entirely. They're obviously not great at beating tight coverage over short distances.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

But JP doesn't throw a lot of easy dumpoff passes; ala Holcomb for most of the TE's and RB's are helping with the blocking. The biggest difference between the two is that Brunell is an aging QB with no upside and a weakening arm and doesn't have the ability or arm strength to throw the ball down the field; ala Holcomb. JP can and when those plays are called he has shown that he can make all the throws. And in the redzone, not having a dominant run blocking O-line, smaller WR's, and not receiving threat at TE become even bigger factors in the redzone when the field shrinks and defenses have less real estate to cover.

837630[/snapback]

He can make all the throws? He consistently underthrows outs and launches fly routes 5 yards out of bounds. I mean, when is the last time he threw an accurate deep ball?

 

That said, I'm still pulling for the guy.

[BuffaloWings]

Charles Robinson of Yahoo Sports wrote in today's rankings:

 

"Buffalo Bills (3-6) – With the concentration on quarterback J.P. Losman, has anyone noticed that the tight end and wide receiver spots are a mess? Lee Evans is inconsistent and Peerless Price looks like just another mediocre wideout. Come to think of it, is there anything beyond running back Willis McGahee that looks promising on this offense?"

 

I've been saying this for a while now.  The o-line certainly has issues but I put more of the passing game's problems on the lack of productivity at the WR and TE positions.  Other than the occasional open Evans, JP simply has no one else he can go too.  I feel sorry for the guy with the pocket collapsing around him and the receivers covered like white on rice.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Aii5...=yhoo&type=lgns

837389[/snapback]

I think Robinson is missing the boat here....

 

Evans and Price aren't tearing it up because the OL can't pass protect long enough for JP to get them the ball. I can see it if the WRs were dropping the balls or not running the right routes or something similar. The Bills passing game is anemic because of the OL....not because of the WRs and TEs.

 

Jake Long - that's all we need to start with.

[BADOLBILZ]

Charles Robinson of Yahoo Sports wrote in today's rankings:

 

"Buffalo Bills (3-6) – With the concentration on quarterback J.P. Losman, has anyone noticed that the tight end and wide receiver spots are a mess? Lee Evans is inconsistent and Peerless Price looks like just another mediocre wideout. Come to think of it, is there anything beyond running back Willis McGahee that looks promising on this offense?"

 

I've been saying this for a while now.  The o-line certainly has issues but I put more of the passing game's problems on the lack of productivity at the WR and TE positions.  Other than the occasional open Evans, JP simply has no one else he can go too.  I feel sorry for the guy with the pocket collapsing around him and the receivers covered like white on rice.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Aii5...=yhoo&type=lgns

837389[/snapback]

 

The receivers are fine. Not suited for a 3 step drop game whatsoever, but plenty skilled. TE is awful though, as it has been for most of the last 15 years.

 

It's the OL and Losman. The OL is not even remotely adequate at blocking, and it's come to the point now that on the occasion that Losman does have time to throw from the pocket he's unsure. I mean, I've never seen an instance where a team was running the ball so much, even on obvious passing downs, and they still couldn't hold even a brief block in the passing game. Usually that shuts a pass rush down cold.

[bluv]

He can make all the throws? He consistently underthrows outs and launches fly routes 5 yards out of bounds. I mean, when is the last time he threw an accurate deep ball?

 

That said, I'm still pulling for the guy.

837776[/snapback]

I mean he doesn't hit every open WR; no QB does. Of course he is going to miss a target here and there but I'm not concerned with that this year as I was last year when he consistently missed open targets; that is not happening this year. And you cry about the few passes underthrowed or skipping the ball on outs, a lot of times he can't step into his throws and plus those are timimg routes. But it isn't because he doesn't have the arm strength to make such throws. While he is part of the struggles on offense he is far from being the sole source as there are no units on offense that is playing well and it starts up front. I think the only thing holding JP back is his inexeperience combined with playing on an awful offensive unit with no scheme, shaky pass protection, and limited receiving options.

[tennesseeboy]

Charles Robinson of Yahoo Sports wrote in today's rankings:

 

"Buffalo Bills (3-6) – With the concentration on quarterback J.P. Losman, has anyone noticed that the tight end and wide receiver spots are a mess? Lee Evans is inconsistent and Peerless Price looks like just another mediocre wideout. Come to think of it, is there anything beyond running back Willis McGahee that looks promising on this offense?"

 

I've been saying this for a while now.  The o-line certainly has issues but I put more of the passing game's problems on the lack of productivity at the WR and TE positions.  Other than the occasional open Evans, JP simply has no one else he can go too.  I feel sorry for the guy with the pocket collapsing around him and the receivers covered like white on rice.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Aii5...=yhoo&type=lgns

837389[/snapback]

You know the problem is that the qb gets NO time to find an open receiver. The coach has to design a game plan that relies on NO pass protection. Should we blame the receivers because they can't get open in the second or two between the time the qb takes the snap and he's sacked? I don't think so. It all boils to one thing. No pass protection.

[Bflojohn]

Someone asked 20 some posts before, but I'll chime in... Kyle Young, C, Fresno State is touted by some to be SOOO good that he could possibly play OT in the pros! Quite an astounding evaluation, IMO! Now onto the offensive woes, which are almost too numerous to mention (but I'll take a crack at it!). I find it interesting that various outlets are disecting this offense, and the truth is that, as a group, they are ready to totally implode due to ALL of the aforementioned problems. Wrong routes, dropped passes, no TE production, O-line woes that create nausea and a QB who is STILL felling his way as a Pro....man, it can't get anymore complex for Dick Jauron and Steve Fairchild! These two are WELL AWARE of the depth of distress this offense presents. The simple answer, if there is one is to find FOOTBALL PLAYERS at approximately 7 out of 11 positions, and THAT is no joke!! Difference makers are in SHORT SUPPLY in Buffalo, New York on both sides of the ball. The free agency period and the draft will HAVE TO BE extremely good (downright excellent!) to change the fortunes of this franchise. My final word on this is that the rebuilding CAN be done this next offseason by Marv Levy, now only time will tell!!

[cantankerous]

JP can and when those plays are called he has shown that he can make all the throws.

 

837630[/snapback]

 

 

hahahahahahaha, thanks for the laugh!

[SACTOBILLSFAN]

Yeah Willis looks real promising. Why does the media hype this guy up like he's better than average? I don't get it.

[Twistidfunk]

Hi all, I think this guy is right on the money.

 

Evans has made some great plays but where is he the rest of the game?

 

This entire offense is in dire need of some playmakers other than Evans.

 

Price is garbaaage.

 

If we get a top 5 pick (and I think we will) we need to get Calvin Johnson from Georgia Tech.

 

6'-5" 230ish.

 

That or use some of our 30 mill below cap money and get Jerry Porter/ Randy Moss/ Tony Gonzales. Basically anyone who is good and up for grabs. I would even take TO.

 

Reggie Wayne will not go to Buffalo.

[truth on hold]

I think Robinson is missing the boat here....

 

Evans and Price aren't tearing it up because the OL can't pass protect long enough for JP to get them the ball. I can see it if the WRs were dropping the balls or not running the right routes or something similar. The Bills passing game is anemic because of the OL....not because of the WRs and TEs.

 

Jake Long - that's all we need to start with.

837781[/snapback]

LET'S REVIEW THE RECEIVERS INDIVIDUALLY:

 

Evans: showed good promise when Moulds was here, has been inconsistent at best without him

Price: cut by ATL after siging a big contract, cut by DAL after a few games

Royal: Skins didn't want him and I can see why now given several drops, penalties and missed blocks

Reed: Bills were willing to let him go and later re-signed him after no team stepped up for him in free agency

Davis: on his 3rd team now in 3 years. after short arming a potential TD catch that could have turned around the 2nd game against NE I can see why Cleveland and the Pats passed on the guy

Roscoe Parish: drafted under the Donahue/Mularkey regime. Appears too small to be a realistic target and actually doesn't even seem as fast as advertised. Also seems to have a fumbling problem on kick returns.

 

anyone who thinks this is a good receiving corp needs their head examined