CoachChuckDickerson Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Want to see a QB who only has two to five seconds to get rid of the ball on every play? Watch Walter. That is what a QB who has no time looks like.
PacificCoastBillsFan Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Did you hear Thiesman say it is the "OC" fault for the sacks because he is not getting him out of the pocket.
Risin Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Want to see a QB who only has two to five seconds to get rid of the ball on every play? Watch Walter. That is what a QB who has no time looks like. 827668[/snapback] No matter how you rationalize it, JP gets crap for time. Also, Andrew has 3 TD's 9 Int's. No matter what protection JP had, those stats wouldn't fly here. Poor Chuck, when will you get a clue?
Dan Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Agreed. And look how much worse the Raiders look. They had as many sacks in the 1st quarter as J Lo had all day yesterday.
Reed83HOF Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 That is the worst OL in the league...terrible...
Dibs Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Want to see a QB who only has two to five seconds to get rid of the ball on every play? Watch Walter. That is what a QB who has no time looks like. 827668[/snapback] You are absolutely correct! Because the Raiders have one of the worst performing lines in history....that means that our line is actually good enough. Good point you make.
BillsCelticsAngelsBama Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Dan Marino didn't get sacked much, even in his later years, and his line was not all that good(they couldn't run block for crap). But he had a quick drop and the offense was designed to take advantage of his arm. Losman has a better than average arm and with a different game plan maybe we could have more production. But what do I know? P.S. NO, I am not comparing Losman to Marino !! Just don't like the way we are utilizing our talent with the unimaginative predictable play-calling.
truth on hold Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Want to see a QB who only has two to five seconds to get rid of the ball on every play? Watch Walter. That is what a QB who has no time looks like. 827668[/snapback] the reality is there is no awesome o-line this year in the nfl. some of them can run block and not pass, some vice versa. but if anyone thinks in this age of free agency there's this mountain of an offensive line like the cowboys had in the mid-90's that kept pressure off lead-foot aikman and opened huge holes for the average anywhere-else back emmitt, they are clearly not paying attention. many posters on this board have this fanciful notion of a mythic offensive line that provides infinite time for the QB and grand-canyon size holes for the backs. biggest things they miss as a result is the lack of size and physicality in the receiving corp and losmans need to develop better feel for where the pressure is coming from.
Dibs Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Dan Marino didn't get sacked much, even in his later years, and his line was not all that good(they couldn't run block for crap). But he had a quick drop and the offense was designed to take advantage of his arm. Losman has a better than average arm and with a different game plan maybe we could have more production. But what do I know? P.S. NO, I am not comparing Losman to Marino !! Just don't like the way we are utilizing our talent with the unimaginative predictable play-calling. 827751[/snapback] Not arguing here...just adding my 2 cents....IIRC Marino used his(considerable) influence to make sure his OL were very adept at pass protection. It was like everything was geared to support him as a pocket passer.
Ray Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 the reality is there is no awesome o-line this year in the nfl. some of them can run block and not pass, some vice versa. but if anyone thinks in this age of free agency there's this mountain of an offensive line like the cowboys had in the mid-90's that kept pressure off lead-foot aikman and opened huge holes for the average anywhere-else back emmitt, they are clearly not paying attention. many posters on this board have this fanciful notion of a mythic offensive line that provides infinite time for the QB and grand-canyon size holes for the backs. biggest things they miss as a result is the lack of size and physicality in the receiving corp and losmans need to develop better feel for where the pressure is coming from. 827756[/snapback] That is exactly correct. The people who want JP to have 5 seconds to throw every pass and the WRs to have 5-10 yards separation from the defenders are clueless. Watch the NFL---basically all OL's are pretty equal on about 25 teams. There is no dominant line. JP gets a lot of time on many passes. Tom Brady does not get a lot of time to throw many times but he's accurate and knows how to read defenses and make quick decisions. People have to get out of fantasy land thinking that some wonderful LT and RT are going to make JP better. He has got to make himself better. The idea that you are going to get 5 pro-bowlers on the line giving him 5 seconds to throw on every down is preposterous. You have to live with an average OL.
BillsCelticsAngelsBama Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Not arguing here...just adding my 2 cents....IIRC Marino used his(considerable) influence to make sure his OL were very adept at pass protection. It was like everything was geared to support him as a pocket passer. 827758[/snapback] I think that Jason Peters and Terrence Pennington could be coached to do exactly the same (potentially). Peters is a very good athlete and Pennington has the size to stop the defensive ends just by a push; if they have quick slants like the Dolphins did. But this could take quite a different approach to moving the ball than we are(n't) doing right now.
BuffOrange Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 "Two to five seconds?" 827718[/snapback] I'll take that any week myself.
generaLee83 Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 That is the worst OL in the league...terrible... 827683[/snapback] It is possible that by the end of this season the Raiders will have the worst O-line in history.
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 It is possible that by the end of this season the Raiders will have the worst O-line in history. 827807[/snapback] Yeah, they are pretty horrible but the QB wasn't helping matters. Just like Bledsoe, RJ, and lately JP, QBs can make lines look at lot worse than they are. Walter had time to get rid of the ball and simply held on too long. Also, the Raiders proved that there is no exact science in building a line. Everyone had Gallery being a HOFer.
bluv Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 the reality is there is no awesome o-line this year in the nfl. some of them can run block and not pass, some vice versa. but if anyone thinks in this age of free agency there's this mountain of an offensive line like the cowboys had in the mid-90's that kept pressure off lead-foot aikman and opened huge holes for the average anywhere-else back emmitt, they are clearly not paying attention. many posters on this board have this fanciful notion of a mythic offensive line that provides infinite time for the QB and grand-canyon size holes for the backs. biggest things they miss as a result is the lack of size and physicality in the receiving corp and losmans need to develop better feel for where the pressure is coming from. 827756[/snapback] That's a point I have been trying to make all year about a lot of positions. No team has a Pro Bowler at every position and most of the good players that they do have have flaws. I have less patience with the guys who are paid to produce but who don't and are fully healthy. Like Nate Clemens; he is not a bad players by any means but for his play there is no way he should be the highest paid player on this team as for most games he is not a game changer. Is he a bad player; not by any means. Even take a player like Gandy who we had treated like he was the worst LT in the league; he had gave up what 4-5 sacks all year and 3.5 in ONE game. I mean while he is far from a elite, there are better options out there and Peters may be a better option on this team at LT he was far from being the garbage LT he was made out to be. He was a stopgap player there for one and last year exceeded most expectations as most really wanted him to flop last year so that they could throw one more shot at Donahoe. Plus he was a cheap option and we got more than our money worth for him and after watching him play one game at his natural position he looked pretty good. The Raiders would look at him as an upgrade! Now CV is a different story as he is paid much more and expected to produce and he is definitely not getting the job done in the pass or running game and he should be villified way more than Gandy ever was!
PromoTheRobot Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 You are absolutely correct!Because the Raiders have one of the worst performing lines in history....that means that our line is actually good enough. Good point you make. 827695[/snapback] One notch over "crap" makes you good enough?? PTR
stuckincincy Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Not arguing here...just adding my 2 cents....IIRC Marino used his(considerable) influence to make sure his OL were very adept at pass protection. It was like everything was geared to support him as a pocket passer. 827758[/snapback] And a pair of terrific receivers in Mark Clayton and Mark Duper for much of his career.
D_House Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 Also, the Raiders proved that there is no exact science in building a line. Everyone had Gallery being a HOFer. 827815[/snapback] Definitely. I looked at the Raiders depth chart, and addition to Gallery at LT, they have a 2nd round pick at RT (Langston Walker) and C (Jake Grove). Manning the G spots are a rookie 6th rd pick and an UDFA (Barry Sims). Isn't this the very model for building an O-line? High draft picks on the tackle positions, a quality C, and low round, lunch pail guys at G? So what is the Raiders problem? Coaching? Scouting?
Cornerville Posted November 7, 2006 Posted November 7, 2006 I think almost any OL would look bad in today's NFL if an OC has the QB taking 7-9 step drops and playing the game like it was 1965. I feel bad for those players and especially the QB
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