truth on hold Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 last time Bills played they sacked brady 3x and knocked him down 3 other times. and the pats vaunted running game barely did anything. they performed no better and arguably worse than the bills 0-line. the difference is in the "talent" position with a QB that can read defenses, wideouts that run routes and make catches and a defense that can force turnovers, coaches that come up with good game plans and adjustments during the game, and GM's that make good off-season personnel moves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 The Bills are getting back exactly what they've put into the OL, which is next to nothing. You can't sign other teams rejects and retreads and expect to be any good. The Bills have repeatedly proven this to be true over the years, consistently fielding some of the worst OLs in the league since the mid 1990s. To make the point all too clear, all one has to do is take a quick look at the Bills' draft history since 1990. They've drafted only 7 OL on the first day of the draft in the last 16 years. Lets see, that's 7 picks for 5 starting positions in almost two decades. That's a pathetic effort, especially in light of the fact that the Bills OL was falling apart as early as 1994. The only free agents of any consequence that they've bothered with have been Chris Villarial and Joe Panos. Villarial has been a serviceable starter when he's actually healthy. Panos was a flop. By contrast, the Bills have drafted 13 DBs in the first three rounds in the same time period. That's enough to have turned the entire starting defensive backfield over 3 times, compared to just once on the OL. Of course, I must also mention that 7 of those 13 picks were taken in the first round. Poor effort equals poor results. The Bills are getting exactly what they've paid for over the years. They've tried to build an OL on the cheap and it hasn't worked and probably never will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fewell733 Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 last time Bills played they sacked brady 3x and knocked him down 3 other times. and the pats vaunted running game barely did anything. they performed no better and arguably worse than the bills 0-line. the difference is in the "talent" position with a QB that can read defenses, wideouts that run routes and make catches and a defense that can force turnovers, coaches that come up with good game plans and adjustments during the game, and GM's that make good off-season personnel moves. 824856[/snapback] Two things: 1) The Bills O-Line seems to fold when it matters most; the Pats line seems to give Brady all day in those situations 2) There is only one Tom Brady - he is the exception to the QB rules. He makes gold out of sh**. That doesn't mean I don't hate his guts. The Pats wouldn't be anything - all those geniuses would look how they looked in '99- if they didn't strike gold with Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 last time Bills played they sacked brady 3x and knocked him down 3 other times. and the pats vaunted running game barely did anything. they performed no better and arguably worse than the bills 0-line. the difference is in the "talent" position with a QB that can read defenses, wideouts that run routes and make catches and a defense that can force turnovers, coaches that come up with good game plans and adjustments during the game, and GM's that make good off-season personnel moves. 824856[/snapback] Points taken. Everything you say may well be true but that still doesn't exonerate the offensive line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfanmiami(oh) Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 last time Bills played they sacked brady 3x and knocked him down 3 other times. and the pats vaunted running game barely did anything. they performed no better and arguably worse than the bills 0-line. the difference is in the "talent" position with a QB that can read defenses, wideouts that run routes and make catches and a defense that can force turnovers, coaches that come up with good game plans and adjustments during the game, and GM's that make good off-season personnel moves. 824856[/snapback] Serious question...Do you watch the games? If you do and can't see that the o-line play has been horrible, you need your eyes checked... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 Yeah, the OL is a scapegoat. Coaches frequently want to make multiple changes on the OL unnecessarily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluv Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 I'll agree to an extent. Half of our sacks have been the result of JP holding the ball to long waiting for plays to develop. While they are far from an elite blocking group I'll say we are way better than the Cardinals and Raiders up front and about equal to the Pats upfront. The biggest difference between the Pats and Bills is one of course having an experience QB in Brady vs basically a rookie QB who has played under 2 different systems. The other is that the Pats are so much better at gameplanning, scheming, and putting their players in position to make plays. Our playcalling is OK at times but our gameplanning and adjustments suck big time! This is had made the O-line and our skilled players look worse than they really are for their is no chemistry or offensive identity whatsoever besides running WM constantly up the middle for no gain! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarthur31 Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 The Bills are getting back exactly what they've put into the OL, which is next to nothing. You can't sign other teams rejects and retreads and expect to be any good. The Bills have repeatedly proven this to be true over the years, consistently fielding some of the worst OLs in the league since the mid 1990s. To make the point all too clear, all one has to do is take a quick look at the Bills' draft history since 1990. They've drafted only 7 OL on the first day of the draft in the last 16 years. Lets see, that's 7 picks for 5 starting positions in almost two decades. That's a pathetic effort, especially in light of the fact that the Bills OL was falling apart as early as 1994. The only free agents of any consequence that they've bothered with have been Chris Villarial and Joe Panos. Villarial has been a serviceable starter when he's actually healthy. Panos was a flop. By contrast, the Bills have drafted 13 DBs in the first three rounds in the same time period. That's enough to have turned the entire starting defensive backfield over 3 times, compared to just once on the OL. Of course, I must also mention that 7 of those 13 picks were taken in the first round. Poor effort equals poor results. The Bills are getting exactly what they've paid for over the years. They've tried to build an OL on the cheap and it hasn't worked and probably never will. 824875[/snapback] Man you make too much sense. And you've pinpointed our problem exactly. Are you sure you're not lost? Maybe you intended to post elsewhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted November 6, 2006 Author Share Posted November 6, 2006 I'll agree to an extent. Half of our sacks have been the result of JP holding the ball to long waiting for plays to develop. While they are far from an elite blocking group I'll say we are way better than the Cardinals and Raiders up front and about equal to the Pats upfront. The biggest difference between the Pats and Bills is one of course having an experience QB in Brady vs basically a rookie QB who has played under 2 different systems. The other is that the Pats are so much better at gameplanning, scheming, and putting their players in position to make plays. Our playcalling is OK at times but our gameplanning and adjustments suck big time! This is had made the O-line and our skilled players look worse than they really are for their is no chemistry or offensive identity whatsoever besides running WM constantly up the middle for no gain! 824962[/snapback] A-train comes in and averages 4.8 yards on 20 carries, including a 14-yard TD run. it's shown that many times losman has been hanging in the pocket because most of the time there's no one open to throw it to. the o-line needs to stop being used the scapegoat and this team needs to do a better job of selecting for "talent" positions. for starters they need a big wide receiver that can win battles against outsize DBs even when they appear covered. every good team seems to have such a guy: colts/walker, pats/gabriel, giants/burress, bears/muhammed etc etc. im not saying the o-line is perfect and doesnt need some upgrading too. i am saying people need to move off this idealized thought of an o-line that provides infinite pass protection and grand canyon size holes for runners. it doesn't exist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdubs Posted November 6, 2006 Share Posted November 6, 2006 is this thread for real? apparently you didn't watch the game yesterday where JP had no time in the pocket all day and was pressured for the most part. they aren't a convenient scape goat, THEY ARE THE SCAPE GOAT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdubs Posted November 6, 2006 Share Posted November 6, 2006 A-train comes in and averages 4.8 yards on 20 carries, including a 14-yard TD run. it's shown that many times losman has been hanging in the pocket because most of the time there's no one open to throw it to. the o-line needs to stop being used the scapegoat and this team needs to do a better job of selecting for "talent" positions. for starters they need a big wide receiver that can win battles against outsize DBs even when they appear covered. every good team seems to have such a guy: colts/walker, pats/gabriel, giants/burress, bears/muhammed etc etc. im not saying the o-line is perfect and doesnt need some upgrading too. i am saying people need to move off this idealized thought of an o-line that provides infinite pass protection and grand canyon size holes for runners. it doesn't exist 826609[/snapback] run blocking and pass protection are 2 totally different things buddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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