IDBillzFan Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Gotcha. So how is he doing for Marv? What has he done that should cause people to change those opinions?816503[/snapback] Better question. What has he done to deserve being considered a bust? Have a good training camp and then get hurt? That makes him a bust? That makes it a bad decision? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 I do agree with the approach of going after guys that man the lines. I just don't think it was realistic to expect us to land Hutch at the price he came at and the situation. It was almost a foregone conclusion that he was going to stay with the Seahawks at the time. That's not to say we shouldn't pay good money to an available FA lineman. It just isn't reasonable to expect a team in this market to pay out a record contract like the one Hutch received. 816498[/snapback] It isn't going to get any easier (imo) to get a premier player at almost any position, let alone up front. Because of the cap increases, teams seem much more equipped to hang on to their most talented players, assuming of course that they have any. For example....we do not have to lose Fletcher next season. He is a prime candidate for the "franchise tag." Steinbach is probably the best OG who is slated to be a UFA. If he does enter the market, he will have few good players to compete with, and will probably command 40 million dollars or so. Is he "worth it?" Sure he is if you have the cap space and a big enough need. Well, the Bills have both. We shall see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Better question. What has he done to deserve being considered a bust? Have a good training camp and then get hurt? That makes him a bust? That makes it a bad decision? 816507[/snapback] Can't answer the questions I raised eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 With Bentley I know that because He publicly stated that he wanted to "go home" and play for Cleveland. With Hutch, you should know already that the Seahawks were raped by the Vikes on a contract clause and he was hugely overpaid, even cosidering the quality player he is. 816449[/snapback] The Bills were approximately $10 million below the salary cap. What would prevent them from offering a front loaded contract to an impact player thereby putting other teams at a negotiating disadvantage and lowering the cap impact in future years, thereby giving the Bills more flexibility in signing players in the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Can't answer the questions I raised eh? 816516[/snapback] Sure. Up until his injury, all reports from people attending training camp was that he was having a very good camp and was actually close to earning a starting position. Then he got hurt. So let's recap. Good camp. Got hurt. Now, you're turn. Why is he a bust? Why was bringing him in a bad decision? Because Marv should have known he would get hurt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 If he was truly that good, was there a need to draft Whitner in the top 10? Sure. Up until his injury, all reports from people attending training camp was that he was having a very good camp and was actually close to earning a starting position. Then he got hurt. So let's recap. Good camp. Got hurt. Now, you're turn. Why is he a bust? Why was bringing him in a bad decision? Because Marv should have known he would get hurt? 816549[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
34-78-83 Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 The Bills were approximately $10 million below the salary cap. What would prevent them from offering a front loaded contract to an impact player thereby putting other teams at a negotiating disadvantage and lowering the cap impact in future years, thereby giving the Bills more flexibility in signing players in the future? 816526[/snapback] All I can say is that it's just not the type of contract you're gonna see in this market and under this ownership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Sure. Up until his injury, all reports from people attending training camp was that he was having a very good camp and was actually close to earning a starting position. Then he got hurt. So let's recap. Good camp. Got hurt. So good training camp = great pickup? Now, you're turn. Why is he a bust? Why was bringing him in a bad decision? Because Marv should have known he would get hurt? 816549[/snapback] To date, I haven't criticized Bowen. I have been critical of Marv's pick of a coach, his draft, how he addressed the offensive line fiasco, his dealings with Sam Adams and Eric Moulds, picking up light weight defensive linemen and giving a sweet contract to Peerless Price but I have not been critical of Bowen. Isn't someone who takes up cap space and roster space but does absolutely nothing for you on game day the definition of a bust? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 If he was truly that good, was there a need to draft Whitner in the top 10? 816554[/snapback] Gee, I don't know. New defensive coordinator. New defensive scheme. Maybe the new folks looked at the current roster and realized the scheme versus the roster would have to be tweaked. And then there's this thing called "depth"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Yeah. Had him confused with someone else. But if he played in Chicago, and sucked there, he'd suck here, too. Don't stray from the point just because you found someone else make a mistake other than you. 816466[/snapback] So you can't even emember where a Buffalo Bills FA signee played last year and you expect me to respect your opinion on any football related post? yeah, not happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Isn't someone who takes up cap space and roster space but does absolutely nothing for you on game day the definition of a bust? 816575[/snapback] So every player who gets hurt and can't play is a bust? Man, Seattle and Pittsburgh have some serious bust issues at quarterback, I suppose. And that Levar Arrington. He's obviously got bust written all over him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Gee, I don't know. New defensive coordinator. New defensive scheme. Maybe the new folks looked at the current roster and realized the scheme versus the roster would have to be tweaked. And then there's this thing called "depth"... 816577[/snapback] Bowen was picked up this year. Shouldn't the front office have figured out whether or not he would be a good fit for this scheme before they signed him? Should they have picked a coaching staff that was slavish to a particular scheme instead of one that would fit the scheme to the talents of the players at hand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 The new defensive coordinator and scheme were in place before the draft and free agent signings. As the Bills laid out their offseason plan, they went after Bowen and pretty much decided they would take Whitner even if Reggie Bush was on the board (sarcasm, though these days you never know). Depth at the line positions is something good teams spend premium picks addressing. Depth at strong safety is what laughingstock organizations focus on... no wonder we sit here today headed for yet another season without a playoff berth. Gee, I don't know. New defensive coordinator. New defensive scheme. Maybe the new folks looked at the current roster and realized the scheme versus the roster would have to be tweaked. And then there's this thing called "depth"... 816577[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 So every player who gets hurt and can't play is a bust? Man, Seattle and Pittsburgh have some serious bust issues at quarterback, I suppose. And that Levar Arrington. He's obviously got bust written all over him. 816585[/snapback] Oh come on, the man hasn't done a thing in a Bills uniform when it counted. You can't say that about the Seattle or Pittsburgh issues. With respect to Arrington, Washington didn't think he was worth the jack so they let him go. How's he doing for the Giants? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marauderswr80 Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 name one GM in the NFL that has made a great move all the time, show me a GM that has never made a mistake.... Im all ears..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Scott Pioli. name one GM in the NFL that has made a great move all the time, show me a GM that has never made a mistake.... Im all ears..... 816607[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Oh come on, the man hasn't done a thing in a Bills uniform when it counted.Because he hasn't had a chance to. But that immediately makes him a bust to you guys. With respect to Arrington, Washington didn't think he was worth the jack so they let him go. How's he doing for the Giants?816598[/snapback] He's out for the year, so it appears he is a bust. But what's more problematic is that Coughlin should have KNOWN he was going to get hurt. Which is how this whole conversation got started. Marv screwed up with Bowen because of " bad luck." I understand how badly you guys need this team to suck, but to be critical of the Bowen pick-up because we should have known he was going to get hurt is just ridiculous. And again...that is the topic that has led us to this point in the discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Because he hasn't had a chance to. But that immediately makes him a bust to you guys. He's out for the year, so it appears he is a bust. But what's more problematic is that Coughlin should have KNOWN he was going to get hurt. Which is how this whole conversation got started. Marv screwed up with Bowen because of " bad luck." I understand how badly you guys need this team to suck, but to be critical of the Bowen pick-up because we should have known he was going to get hurt is just ridiculous. And again...that is the topic that has led us to this point in the discussion. 816610[/snapback] That Len Bias...what a bust...Celts really scr*wed up there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 That Len Bias...what a bust...Celts really scr*wed up there... 816620[/snapback] They should have KNOWN he was an eight ball away from BUST! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted October 25, 2006 Share Posted October 25, 2006 Because he hasn't had a chance to. But that immediately makes him a bust to you guys. 816610[/snapback] Brings us back to the question, what is the definition of a bust? He's out for the year, so it appears he is a bust. But what's more problematic is that Coughlin should have KNOWN he was going to get hurt. Given his history of injuries, his inability to break into the starting lineup with Washington even when he was healthy and his talk of possible retirement if he ever suffered another knee injury, was giving him a big contract a good idea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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