Pat Tillman's Brother on the Administration

[Pete]

I didn't say they couldn't speak their mind.  I just suggested that being martyrs doesn't give them any insight.

Just America.  Unquestionably we deserve it, and I will celebrate the next attack, presuming I survive it.  Feel free to report me as an enemy combattant, if it makes you feel better.

812085[/snapback]

Why are you gonna celebrate the next 9/11? Beleive me I am no fan of our government or our foreign policy but celebrating the next 9/11 is sick

[Bungee Jumper]

Why are you gonna celebrate the next 9/11?  Beleive me I am no fan of our government or our foreign policy but celebrating the next 9/11 is sick

812091[/snapback]

 

No, "sick" is focusing on your bread and circuses, pretending that it gives you some sort of insight into the world. The "next 9/11" is simply "just desserts".

[TPS]

Trying...desperately...to...care... 

 

People like you, and TPS, and Cindy Sheehan, and Kevin Tillman are the reason this country deserves to be attacked by terrorists.

811964[/snapback]

 

If what I (and some others) say generates this kind of reaction, maybe you ought to take some time off and do some things that bring a little cheer to your life Tom--seriously.

[true_blue_bill]

Trying...desperately...to...care... 

 

People like you, and TPS, and Cindy Sheehan, and Kevin Tillman are the reason this country deserves to be attacked by terrorists.

811964[/snapback]

America deserves to be attacked because people here protest against a stupid, senseless, counter-productive, emotionally driven war? You are a total moron.

[bobthebuilder]

I didn't say they couldn't speak their mind.  I just suggested that being martyrs doesn't give them any insight.

Just America.  Unquestionably we deserve it, and I will celebrate the next attack, presuming I survive it.  Feel free to report me as an enemy combattant, if it makes you feel better.

812085[/snapback]

 

 

What you are spewing here is what is called a "self-displaced personality". In other words, on the computer, you can be anyone you want to be...you can post asinine thoughts, ramble with free extent, and elicit thoughts and responses to your liking.

 

No idiot can possibly in their right mind beleive that America "unquestionably" deserves to be attacked. You say you will celebrate the attack? What if your family is involved? Will you "celebrate" it then?

 

 

Im not a huge fan of internet message boards, because any baseless idiot can post garbage and not be held accountable for their statements. I would like you to step up and right a letter to the editor to your local newspaper about your feelings. Then, when you do, you can post the online link here for all of us to see.

 

Step up to the plate, big man. Write a letter. If you think we "unquestionably" deserve it, and will celebrate it, then be held accountable for your feelings. But I know you wont do it. You reek of a displaced personality who loves the fact that he can get away with anything he posts on the internet. Thats why I think you dont even really beleive what you are saying.

[Bungee Jumper]

America deserves to be attacked because people here protest against a stupid, senseless, counter-productive, emotionally driven war? You are a total moron.

813185[/snapback]

 

No, America deserves to be attacked because Americans can't be bothered to understand the world and the people in it. All Americans understand is how to be victims - of the GOP, of Arabs, of corporations, of Bill Clinton, of racism... This country's worst enemies are its own citizens blindly following the American Cult of Victimization, believing that insight and martyrdom and the same damn thing.

 

So have your martyrdom, America. Wallow in it. Next time, your martyrdom will probably be nuclear...won't Americans be special then?

[Bungee Jumper]

What you are spewing here is what is called a "self-displaced personality". In other words, on the computer, you can be anyone you want to be...you can post asinine thoughts, ramble with free extent, and elicit thoughts and responses to your liking.

 

No idiot can possibly in their right mind beleive that America "unquestionably" deserves to be attacked. You say you will celebrate the attack? What if your family is involved? Will you "celebrate" it then?

Im not a huge fan of internet message boards, because any baseless idiot can post garbage and not be held accountable for their statements. I would like you to step up and right a letter to the editor to your local newspaper about your feelings. Then, when you do, you can post the online link here for all of us to see.

 

Step up to the plate, big man. Write a letter. If you think we "unquestionably" deserve it, and will celebrate it, then be held accountable for your feelings. But I know you wont do it. You reek of a displaced personality who loves the fact that he can get away with anything he posts on the internet. Thats why I think you dont even really beleive what you are saying.

813446[/snapback]

 

Again, trying...desperately...to...care...

 

The nice thing about the internet, too, is that while you don't have to believe a thing I type...I don't have to justify anything to you, either.

[bobthebuilder]

Again, trying...desperately...to...care...

 

The nice thing about the internet, too, is that while you don't have to believe a thing I type...I don't have to justify anything to you, either.

813462[/snapback]

 

 

Which exactly verifies every point I made about you. Thanks for letting me win this one easily. I've seen hobos put up a better debate.

[Bungee Jumper]

Which exactly verifies every point I made about you. Thanks for letting me win this one easily. I've seen hobos put up a better debate.

813499[/snapback]

 

What am I supposed to tell you? "You can read my letter in the paper on Monday?" That I declined my security clearance and job with DoD because I can't in good faith defend this country? That I haven't said anything in this thread that I haven't spoken, in person, directly to people in the past 48 hours? You wouldn't believe me anyway. So what's there to debate?

 

America's enemies deserve to be killed. Americans are their own worst enemies. Americans deserve to be killed. QED.

[IBTG81]

What am I supposed to tell you?  "You can read my letter in the paper on Monday?"  That I declined my security clearance and job with DoD because I can't in good faith defend this country?  That I haven't said anything in this thread that I haven't spoken, in person, directly to people in the past 48 hours?  You wouldn't believe me anyway.  So what's there to debate?

 

America's enemies deserve to be killed.  Americans are their own worst enemies.  Americans deserve to be killed.  QED.

813510[/snapback]

 

I can't effing believe you just said that.

 

The last comment you made is one of the most disgusting comments I've ever seen on here.

 

Go ahead. Throw out a Honda Fit joke, or a telephone pole joke. I'd rather drive my Fit listening to Yanni than have the attitude and feelings you do.

[bobthebuilder]

What am I supposed to tell you?  "You can read my letter in the paper on Monday?"  That I declined my security clearance and job with DoD because I can't in good faith defend this country?  That I haven't said anything in this thread that I haven't spoken, in person, directly to people in the past 48 hours?  You wouldn't believe me anyway.  So what's there to debate?

 

America's enemies deserve to be killed.  Americans are their own worst enemies.  Americans deserve to be killed.  QED.

813510[/snapback]

 

I thought you didnt have to justify anything to me?

 

Now thats what I was looking for...a little spirited debate. Yes, I know how to stir up the debate pot. Call it a gift.

 

 

In your world, an enemy should be killed? Explain this to me. Explain WHY we should all commit suicide. I want to hear your thoughts about all of this. I have not seen your other posts, so forgive me for seeing your original post and wanting to debate. Isnt that what an internet message board is for? A little discourse and debate?

 

The floor is yours. I shall be open minded.

[meazza]

I thought you didnt have to justify anything to me?

 

Now thats what I was looking for...a little spirited debate. Yes, I know how to stir up the debate pot. Call it a gift.

In your world, an enemy should be killed? Explain this to me. Explain WHY we should all commit suicide. I want to hear your thoughts about all of this. I have not seen your other posts, so forgive me for seeing your original post and wanting to debate. Isnt that what an internet message board is for? A little discourse and debate?

 

The floor is yours. I shall be open minded.

813546[/snapback]

 

Not that I have any strong views on what Tom said, but I think you don't understand what he was trying to say.

[Chilly]

When I went to type this post, I was going to say that I didn't think American's deserved to be attacked. As I went to type deserve, it made me stop and question that word.

 

I don't disagree that American's deserve to be attacked. Right now, America is a "victim" of their own policies over the years.

 

Celebrate the attack? That might be a bit over the top for me. Though, I would suspect that Tom would be saying "celebrate" in the sense that it might be the only thing that shakes us from our political landscape, rather then being happy that people are hurt.

[bobthebuilder]

Not that I have any strong views on what Tom said, but I think you don't understand what he was trying to say.

813595[/snapback]

 

 

Exactly. I am trying to understand and grasp how he came to his own conclusions.

 

And if he cant provide an explanation, then I resort to what I said earlier...he doesnt really beleive those things, and is an attention whore who loves to stir the internet masses.

[Bad Things]

Kevin Tillman's opinions really don't qualify for any more media attention than that of the average citizen.

 

However... there were many people on this board that seemed to be over-the-top in admiration for both Tillman brothers when they signed up for the military. rah rah rah.

Many claimed them as heroes that we should all strive to become ourselves.

 

When Pat was killed by his own troops, he became a sort of martyr to some.

Then, we found out that the government repeatedly covered up the fact that his own troops shot him. (This slightly soiled his amazing story.)

 

Now that his brother has expressed dismay as to the disaster that we've been led into... the same people that nearly worshipped him, simply marginalize him and throw him out with the trash.

 

Pathetic.

 

 

By the way, its been a heck of a long time since I've come over here to this board so I thought I'd ask the same questions again.

Have we found any WMD's yet?

Any at all?

Most here were soooo sure that they'd be there.

 

Why should Kevin Tillman's opinion deserve any more media attention than say............mine?

811973[/snapback]

[JimBob2232]

Kevin Tillman's opinions really don't qualify for any more media attention than that of the average citizen.

 

However... there were many people on this board that seemed to be over-the-top in admiration for both Tillman brothers when they signed up for the military.  rah rah rah.

Many claimed them as heroes that we should all strive to become ourselves.

 

When Pat was killed by his own troops, he became a sort of martyr to some.

Then, we found out that the government repeatedly covered up the fact that his own troops shot him.  (This slightly soiled his amazing story.)

 

Now that his brother has expressed dismay as to the disaster that we've been led into... the same people that nearly worshipped him, simply marginalize him and throw him out with the trash.

 

Pathetic.

By the way, its been a heck of a long time since I've come over here to this board so I thought I'd ask the same questions again.

Have we found any WMD's yet?

Any at all?

Most here were soooo sure that they'd be there.

814708[/snapback]

 

 

Not to hijack the thread...but...Before you get all high and mighty about not finding WMDs, besure to focus the effort on the real issue, the intellegence community, and not republicans (or democrats) in congress. In fact, with everyone believing so rongly they had them, I think it is more likely they were moved out of the country before the invasion than them never having them in the first place.

 

Now, this is what some leading democrats said about Iraq and WMDs.

 

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."

- Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002

 

"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."

- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002

 

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."

- Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998

 

"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real..."

- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003

 

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force -- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."

- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

 

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."

- President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

 

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."

- President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998

 

"We must stop Saddam from ever again jeopardizing the stability and security of his neighbors with weapons of mass destruction."

- Madeline Albright, Feb 1, 1998

 

"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."

Letter to President Clinton.

- (D) Senators Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, others, Oct. 9, 1998

 

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."

- Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998

 

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."

- Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999

 

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and th! e means of delivering them."

- Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002

 

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."

- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

 

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."

- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

 

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."

- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002

 

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."

- Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002

 

"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."

- Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002

[Bad Things]

OK, so you have some qoutes from people (Dems) saying that Iraq had WMD.

 

My questions was if any were found.

 

I remember coming here and reading a post from DC Tom stating that he personally knew of a team of specialists that were hot on the trail of weapons in Iraq. Boy, were people here impressed, let me tell you.

 

If you believe that EVERYBODY thought Iraq had WMD's you're wrong. Try to think back to all of the world-wide protests. This so-called "Bad intellegence" was only "bad" because it had to be moulded to support the Bush administrations claim.

Screw the weak-kneed dems. They're chickshiats bought off by the same big business interests as the Repugs. Go Green

 

Not to hijack the thread...but...Before you get all high and mighty about not finding WMDs, besure to focus the effort on the real issue, the intellegence community, and not republicans (or democrats) in congress. In fact, with everyone believing so rongly they had them, I think it is more likely they were moved out of the country before the invasion than them never having them in the first place.

 

Now, this is what some leading democrats said about Iraq and WMDs.

 

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."

- Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002

 

"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."

- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002

 

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."

- Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998

 

"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real..."

- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003

 

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force -- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."

- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

 

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."

- President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

 

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."

- President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998

 

"We must stop Saddam from ever again jeopardizing the stability and security of his neighbors with weapons of mass destruction."

- Madeline Albright, Feb 1, 1998

 

"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."

Letter to President Clinton.

- (D) Senators Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, others, Oct. 9, 1998

 

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."

- Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998

 

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."

- Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999

 

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and th! e means of delivering them."

- Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002

 

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."

- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

 

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."

- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

 

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."

- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002

 

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."

- Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002

 

"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."

- Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002

814721[/snapback]

[Hollywood Donahoe]

OK, so you have some qoutes from people (Dems) saying that Iraq had WMD.

 

My questions was if any were found.

 

If you believe that EVERYBODY thought Iraq had WMD's you're wrong...

Everybody knows that Iraq had WMD at one point, the issue was that they were not disposing of them as outlined in the '91 ceasefire.

 

The natural assumption by most was these WMD were still in Iraqi possession, but its entirely possible that they were destroyed in a fashion that violated the ceasefire, or even moved to another location. In any event, though, Iraq was in violation of its terms of surrender.

 

At least that's my understanding of the situation.

[blzrul]

When I went to type this post, I was going to say that I didn't think American's deserved to be attacked.  As I went to type deserve, it made me stop and question that word.

 

I don't disagree that American's deserve to be attacked.  Right now, America is a "victim" of their own policies over the years.

 

Celebrate the attack?  That might be a bit over the top for me.  Though, I would suspect that Tom would be saying "celebrate" in the sense that it might be the only thing that shakes us from our political landscape, rather then being happy that people are hurt.

813602[/snapback]

That the American people ALLOW this country to implement and follow bad policy means that they have to live with the results. Our failure to be outraged and express that outrage, in a country where we are supposedly free to do so, must appear to the world to be tacit approval of stupid policy. Erego, we "deserve" the attacks.

 

Fact is we all know what it takes to be a good neighbor. People are people the world over. Most good, and very few not. It's not easy to stand up against bad things - which is why America gets attacked. We've become lazy to where, until it hits US in the ass, it's just too much bother.

[Bungee Jumper]

When I went to type this post, I was going to say that I didn't think American's deserved to be attacked.  As I went to type deserve, it made me stop and question that word.

 

I don't disagree that American's deserve to be attacked.  Right now, America is a "victim" of their own policies over the years.

 

Celebrate the attack?  That might be a bit over the top for me.  Though, I would suspect that Tom would be saying "celebrate" in the sense that it might be the only thing that shakes us from our political landscape, rather then being happy that people are hurt.

813602[/snapback]

 

Wow. You actually got it.

 

 

Except that I'm at a point now where stupid people dying of their own stupidity doesn't inspire a lot of sympathy in me. And Americans, generally, are really, really !@#$ing stupid.