Losman Under the Gun

[Dan]

Well, this is the heart of the issue.  I know John from Hemet hasn't had a chance to respond yet, but I'll jump in anyways.

 

Contrary to what some people around here believe, I don't hate JP Losman, andI don't root for JP Losman to fai.  On the other hand, I do think that JP Losman is better this year than he was last year (admittedly I don't feel that is saying much), and I think that JP Losman should start against New England on Sunday, and the week after that, etc.

 

As near as I can tell, what has drawn the ire of so many people here is that last season, when many people were arguing that "JP Losman is performing about as well as I would expect for a QB of his experience", I had the temerity to point out that in fact JP Losman was actually performing substantially below what we should expect for a QB of hist experience.

 

You argue, "why not let your young QB gain experience?"  The reason why not, is that JP Losman was performing at an extraordinarily abysmal level - a level that as near as I can tell was almost unparalleled for a QB who had been through two NFL training camps.  Let's take a look at the statistical measures of JP Losman's performance at that time:

 

Game #2 @Tampa Bay - 11 of 28 (a mere 39.3%) for 113 yards (a measely 4.0 yards per attempt).    O.k. this was one bad game, admittedly a tough road game against a solid defense.

 

Game #3 vs. Atlanta - 10 of 23 (a mere 43.5%) for only 75 yards (a dreadful 3.26 yards per attempt).  Now, its time to be concerned - with two terrible games in a row, this one at home.

 

Game #4 vs. New Orlens @ San Antonio - 7 of 15 (a mere 46.7%) for a pathetic 75 yards for the second week in a row (5 YPA).  What's more, this was the same New Orleans Saints defense that the Green Bay Packers had rung up 50+ points on. 

 

For three games now, Losman was performing at a level that indicated that he belonged nowheres near an NFL playing field on Sunday.  I don't see how you could continue to trot out Losman under center in those circumstances - and even if you did, how you could avoid losing the team.  The other 52 players on the team know what an NFL QB looks like, even without the stats, they could just see that he was not playing at anything remotely approaching an NFL level.  It would be hard to continue playing at a peak level when you knew in your heart that your QB was giving you absolutely no chance to win the game. 

 

Mularkey was not a good coach, but he made the absolutely right decision in this case - even if for no othe reason than that it was very much a "no-brainer."   

 

JDG

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I do see your point about JP's poor play last season. He did look misearable. However, given that a career backup was the only option, I still say you leave him in. No player ever got better by riding the bench. It takes playing time, plain and simple. We all knew he was raw and needed extra playing time; yet so many have seemed so quick to forget that.

 

As far as loosing the rest of the team...that's easy. You tell them in no uncertain terms, that I'm the coach and I'll decide who plays and who doesn't. If you don't like that, the door is right there. Have a nice season sitting on your couch. There is no excuse for a player ever questioning the coaches decision. Period. None of those "veteran" palyers were doing a darn thing to help the team win, either. So, until I saw some effort from them; they have zero input. One of the more vocal critics (perhaps) was Moulds. How many times did he run back for the ball? How many drops did he have? How was his blocking downfield? I'd have told him and all the players, to look in the mirror if they want to see someone that's not giving it their all to win each week.

 

As bad as JP may have looked and occasionally still looks, I don't think anyone can ever say it was because he wasn't trying. Perhaps more than any other player, he's given every bit of effort each and every week of the year to win. So, to fault him and favor a spoiled vet, is completely wrong and leads to new coaches.

[Ozymandius]

I do see your point about JP's poor play last season.  He did look misearable.  However, given that a career backup was the only option, I still say you leave him in.

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Benching him after the fourth game last season was absolutely the right thing to do. So was inserting him back in as the starter later in the season. His play was much improved in the second half of the season but that improvement was only made possible by giving him a "timeout" after the fourth game to sit and learn from the sidelines. He was clearly an overwhelmed headcase at that point and needed some time to sort things out.

[Dibs]

That's a good question.  I checked nfl draft history (http://www.drafthistory.com/positions/qb.html ) to see how QBs that were taken bottom of the first round or second round turned out (presumably, those could be peers we can compare JP to).  Here's a complete list of names going back 15 years (parentheses indicate in what round they were picked and what pick within the round)

 

Kellen Clemens (2,17)

Tarvaris Jackson (2,32)

Aaron Rodgers (1,24)

Jason Campbell (1,25)

JP Losman (1,22)

Kyle Boller (1,19)

Rex Grossman (1,22)

Patrick Ramsey (1,32)

Drew Brees (2,1)

Quincy Carter (2,22)

Marques Tuiasosopo (2,28)

Shaun King (2,19)

Charlie Batch (2,30)

Jim Druckenmiller (1,26)

Jake Plummer (2,12)

Tony Banks (2,12)

Todd Collins (2,13)

Kordell Stewart (2,28)

Tommy Maddox (1,25)

Dan McGwire (1,16)

Todd Marinovich (1,24)

Brett Favre (2,6)

Browning Nagle (2,7)

 

That's not a list that should bring great comfort.  Overwhelmingly, with very few exceptions.........

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I tend to think if you were going for comparable draft position you should use players say....within 12(or so) spots. You did this(6 spots) on the positive side but went 42 spots on the negative side. Don't get me wrong here, I do not believe that drafting a QB is easy & I fully know that 1st round QBs are a lucky dip(even in the top 3) but I find your list has a whole lot of names that are not what I would consider to be JPLs drafting peers.....you also missed off Pennington.

 

NEW LIST(Probowlers...and Grossman in BOLD)

 

Jay Cutler(1,11)

Aaron Rodgers (1,24)

Jason Campbell (1,25)

Ben Roethlisberger(1,11)

JP Losman (1,22)

Kyle Boller (1,19)

Rex Grossman (1,22)

Patrick Ramsey (1,32)

Drew Brees (2,1)

Chad Pennington(1,18)

Daunte Culpepper(1,11)

Cade McNown(1,12)

Jim Druckenmiller (1,26)

Tommy Maddox (1,25)

Dan McGwire (1,16)

Todd Marinovich (1,24)

 

As you can see, my new list is smaller & still shows a low percentage of success.

It does however show a much higher success than Ozy's list.....also....Drunkonmiller was 1997 whereas McGwire & Marinovich were 1991 & Maddox 1992 which IMO is enough time difference to drop them from the list(different drafting era)......also......players in their 1st or 2nd years should not be counted as busts yet.....I'm gonna drop them too......also.....JPL should not be part of the list since we are comparing the relative success of his peers.

 

NEW (improved) LIST(Probowlers...and Grossman in BOLD)

 

Ben Roethlisberger(1,11)

Kyle Boller (1,19)

Rex Grossman (1,22)

Patrick Ramsey (1,32)

Drew Brees (2,1)

Chad Pennington(1,18)

Daunte Culpepper(1,11)

Cade McNown(1,12)

Jim Druckenmiller (1,26)

 

WOW....that gives 5 out of 9 success stories from JPLs peers.

Looking at these stats, I'd be inclined to see how he further pans out myself.

[ganesh]

WOW....that gives 5 out of 9 success stories from JPLs peers.

Looking at these stats, I'd be inclined to see how he further pans out myself.

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JP will make it 6 out of 10.....This coaching staff is completely behind him and see positives in his play every game.....It is a matter of time before he goes on to be a level headed QB who can play in the NFL....The guy has learnt to reduce his mistakes and also learn from his mistakes. As long as his teammates are backing him to the tilt, he will be fine.