JDG Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Scottenheimer >>> Mularkey 788141[/snapback] Ain't that the truth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Am I a losman hater?I really really want losman to do well. But yes, right now we'd be better off with drew brees. 788160[/snapback] You clearly have a deep visceral hatred of JP Losman...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalove Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Kurt Warner? Chris Simms? 787596[/snapback] When I said a QB DIRECTLY responsible for 2 losses, I meant name me another QB who has DIRECTLY put points on the opponents' board via defensive scores, which by the end of the game were the difference in the final score (i.e. a saftey, a fumble/int. return for a TD, etc.) None of the QBs you guys mentioned have committed this kind of team suicide. Losman is the only starter in this category and he's done it 2 of 3 times. We lost to NE by 2 points b/c of his safey and as it turned out against NYJ we lost by a TD which was the direct result of his 2nd fumble returned for a TD. No QB has twice put the winning points on the opponents board like Losman - not Warner (1 time if you count his fumble which prevented a game-winning FGA last week), not Rothlisberger (0), not Simms (0), not Favre (0), and not even Aaron Brooks (0). He's our limitation and he's horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaBills Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 A QB like Drew Brees??? Just watching the game last night made me think of it...would a guy like Brees have made the Bills a playoff contender or would the Bills still have the same problems as they have now? Discuss. 786997[/snapback] Right now, Drew Brees is clearly better than JP. But if you follow Brees's career so far, he didn't have a breakthrough year until his 4th season, which was his third season as a starter. This is JP's third year, and this will be his first full season as a starter. I think JP will end up being better than Brees because he has better physical tools. It just takes time for some quarterbacks to really understand the mental part of the NFL. But then they blossom, and sometimes in their fourth year. So yeah, I'd take Brees right now, but I'd rather have Losman on the Bills because this is a talented team. They just happen to be very young. If JP continues to get better, I believe that he is a QB who can end up being an All-Pro. So I'll just wait on JP, no thanks on Brees. I just want JP to show continued improvement this year. I don't expect him to be someone who we can depend on to win the game. Next year is when I expect JP to become an elite quarterback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syhuang Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Depends on how you look at it. Both Brees and Losman started for the first time in the second year in the League. In Losman's first nine games, he had *two* sub-100 yard passing days. Drew Brees had *zero* (although he came close once). In Losman's first nine games, he had *three* sub-50% completion days. Drew Brees had *zero*. Overall, Brees wasn't nearly as bad in his first nine games as Losman was.... JDG 788139[/snapback] You have to understand that passing yards and complete percentanges are part of the QB rating formula. The stats you mentioned are already included in my comparison. In fact, QB rating considers more stats than merely passing yards and complete percentages. Also, it's funny you ignored Losman's performance this year and only made your argument based on his stats last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 A QB like Drew Brees??? Just watching the game last night made me think of it...would a guy like Brees have made the Bills a playoff contender or would the Bills still have the same problems as they have now? Discuss. 786997[/snapback] Of course the bills would be better with Brees. They still would need a real pass rush to be a serious contender. Schobel--the sack gatherer-in meaningless games- doesnt quite cut it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Are we going to go into this crap again. Just like Travis and his 20 fumbles a year that he only lost 8 and therefore he was only 3 times worse then the average NFL running back instead of 7 times. 787373[/snapback] VA not to nick a pit.....but Does Losman get credit for turning something into nothing on botched snaps too? How about the shotgun snap that flew over his head (or at least was uncatchable...I dont remember which) He chases down the ball...scrambles..and throws for a first down...this all happend VERY close to inside the 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 VA not to nick a pit.....but Does Losman get credit for turning something into nothing on botched snaps too? How about the shotgun snap that flew over his head (or at least was uncatchable...I dont remember which) He chases down the ball...scrambles..and throws for a first down...this all happend VERY close to inside the 20. 788665[/snapback] You need to go back to week 1 and 2 to see my comments. I was focusing on a single glaring concern. One doesn't deny that Losman has a strong arm, some mobility. But in this cas he has shown a propensity for fumblitis caused primarily by his lack of awareness of the pass rush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 You need to go back to week 1 and 2 to see my comments. I was focusing on a single glaring concern. One doesn't deny that Losman has a strong arm, some mobility. But in this cas he has shown a propensity for fumblitis caused primarily by his lack of awareness of the pass rush. 788681[/snapback] 2 lost fumbles. 3 total turnovers for the team over 3 games. What's your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syhuang Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 2 lost fumbles. 3 total turnovers for the team over 3 games. What's your point? 788686[/snapback] Furthermore, on the 32 quarterbacks who at least attempt 30 passes this season, 19 of them have at least 3 turnovers. Also, Losman ranks 18th among the quarterbacks on both DPAR (Defense-adjusted Points Above Replacement) and DVOA (Defense-adjusted Value Over Average). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 I was focusing on a single glaring concern. Careful VA! If you express too many concerns about Losman, your name will appear on the next idiot of the week poll. After all, only an idiot would have any doubts whatsoever about Losman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 2 lost fumbles. 3 total turnovers for the team over 3 games. What's your point? 788686[/snapback] Again 4 fumbles in 3 games. Lost or not is luck of the draw. Again this is the same arguement that folks used to say that Henry wasn't bad because while he fumbled a lot they weren't lost. Well the problem is you lose down and yards, and you are offering the defense an opportunity. The first stalls drives the second gives up points which leads to loses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syhuang Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Again 4 fumbles in 3 games. Lost or not is luck of the draw. Again this is the same arguement that folks used to say that Henry wasn't bad because while he fumbled a lot they weren't lost. Well the problem is you lose down and yards, and you are offering the defense an opportunity. The first stalls drives the second gives up points which leads to loses. 788722[/snapback] First, please check the official box score. Losman only had 3 fumbles and lost 2. One fumble in week 1 was charged to Fowler. Second, even if we count non-lost fumble as a turnover, there're still 15 quarterbacks having at least 4 turnovers through week 3. Third, as I mentioned earlier, Losman ranks 18th on both DPAR and DVOA among all quarterbacks. "Fumble lost" and "Fumble kept" are included in DPAR and DVOA evaluation. Losman is not a top quarterback yet, but he certainly is not in the bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 First, please check the official box score. Losman only had 3 fumbles and lost 2. One fumble in week 1 was charged to Fowler. Second, even if we count non-lost fumble as a turnover, there're still 15 quarterbacks have more than 4 turnovers through week 3. Third, as I mentioned earlier. Losman ranks 18th on both DPAR and DVOA among all quarterbacks. Fumble lost and Fumble kept are included in both DPAR and DVOA. Losman is not a top quarterback yet, but he certainly is not in the bottom. 788727[/snapback] Where did I ever say he was the bottom? I said it was an area of concern. Secondly stats suck. Right now David Carr is the best Qb in the league based on stats. Would you really want him over Brady, Manning, Mcnabb? You know who's second , Philip rivers. Also in front of JP for you since you want to go by stats is , Huard, Alex Smith, Kitna. and others.... Again stats suck. But based on that then where you one of the haters who said Smith, Rivers, etc.. will amount to nothing. Well right now by the stats they are a lot better than our QB. Are they, I don't know, I haven't seen them. But to say these other QB's are better or worse based on "stats" is BS. But I can say that I have seen all three games, and even Kelly the F&R Dog has expressed "concern" at his awareness and ball handling skills so far this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syhuang Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Please understand what DPAR and DVOA are before you make any arguments against these advanced stats. Based on DPAR and DVOA, David Carr ranks behind Brady, Manning, and McNabb. Where did I ever say he was the bottom? I said it was an area of concern. Secondly stats suck. Right now David Carr is the best Qb in the league based on stats. Would you really want him over Brady, Manning, Mcnabb? You know who's second , Philip rivers. Also in front of JP for you since you want to go by stats is , Huard, Alex Smith, Kitna. and others.... Again stats suck. But based on that then where you one of the haters who said Smith, Rivers, etc.. will amount to nothing. Well right now by the stats they are a lot better than our QB. Are they, I don't know, I haven't seen them. But to say these other QB's are better or worse based on "stats" is BS. But I can say that I have seen all three games, and even Kelly the F&R Dog has expressed "concern" at his awareness and ball handling skills so far this year. 788729[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Please understand what DPAR and DVOA are before you make any arguments against these advanced stats. Based on DPAR and DVOA, David Carr ranks behind Brady, Manning, and McNabb. 788731[/snapback] What about the other guys? Oh and according to that Carson Palmer is way behin dLosman. Yeah, even most of the idiots here wouldn't take Losman over Palmer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syhuang Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 What about the other guys? 788733[/snapback] Again, please understand what DPAR and DVOA are and know what sabermetrics is. And Rivers only ranks 9th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Again, please understand what DPAR and DVOA are. And Rivers only ranks 9th. 788735[/snapback] I don't care what they are. They are some guys interpretaion of the stats. Stats can be changed to show anything you want. I could probably come up with stats that proves Ed gives heads and really is a lesbian transvestite. Is it true. Probably, but that's not the point. The point is there is an area of concern that others have expressed. Has nothing to do with his "stats". Sometimes actually watching a game and not going to a "fantasy" stat sheet can do some much more for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 And by the way, according to that, Lidell Betts is the best RB in the league. Okay..... Yeah I would take him over Mcgahee, LT, Barber, Portis, Johnson, Parker, mccallister, Lewis, droughns, etc..... NOT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraith Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 I don't care what they are. They are some guys interpretaion of the stats. Stats can be changed to show anything you want. I could probably come up with stats that proves Ed gives heads and really is a lesbian transvestite. Is it true. Probably, but that's not the point. The point is there is an area of concern that others have expressed. Has nothing to do with his "stats". Sometimes actually watching a game and not going to a "fantasy" stat sheet can do some much more for you. 788737[/snapback] This post makes you sound ignorant. Incredibly so. Statistics can only be used to lie to people who don't understand them. Sick of being misled? Educate yourself. And why the hell do you put stats in quotation marks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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