Troy Vincent...

[Pyrite Gal]

In my (simplistic) view, Vincent sounds like a businessman who used his football talents to generate revenue and establish contacts.  Good for him and I wish more of the players had some of his business acumen.

 

I have had a hard time getting excited about TV - he seems like the consultant a company hires and pays too much money to work beside the full-time staff.  You know the consultant is in it for the short-term and more focussed on himself than the project.

 

On a football team, I don't want "consultants," no matter how experienced they are.  TD was good at hiring consultants; it appears with Marv's first draft that he's more interested in developing his full-timers from within.  Bills are coming back, I can feel it...

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I understand the distinction you are making between players who are Bills for the long term versus players where this is clearly just a stop on the way to another team. Though, I think this is a valid distinction for a a few extreme cases of players (almost all the draftees are hoping to be so good that the team that drafted them will want to pay them big bucks upfront and keep them with the team which picked them for their whole career (many players assume they will become FAs at some point, but when a team offers you by far the biggest check you have ever gotten a couple of seasons before you hit FA, be they Peters, McGee. Crowell or whomever you sign an extension and bind yourself to that team for a period beyond the average career length of an NFL player even here in a little market).

 

There are players on the backside of their career like a Centers, Gash, or even Bledspe who know this is just a stop ortheir last contract and one would rather develop you own and make these players at most the last piece you need in an SB run so the distinction you make is a real one, though it simply does not apply to many cases.

 

The real world of the NFL is actually that all the players are consultants these days and they are well paid enough that they all better be businesmen (or they are going to broke). Whether you want consultants or not, your team is going to have a strong dose of FAs like Reyes, Fowler, Peerless, and Triplett playing critical roles on your team. We cetainly will have the Evans, the Whitner and the other players we drafted as a core of this team, but we gave folks like Triplett and Fowler bonuses such that it is clear we hope they will be Bills for a long time.

 

Sould your team be built around consultants? They have to be in that I would hazard a guess that if you look at the current roster 10 years from now there will only be a handful (if that many) who make their homes in Buffalo. If you trestrict this survey to simply their period as members of the team it is simply the exception to the general rule the player who retires from the team that drafted them.

 

Though I think that football and the "real" business world are quite different from each other. football teams can actually learn some lessons about how a good business gets good value from a consultant. I work as a consultant professionally and have had my own company for 17 years. I feel it is a smart thing for a company to hire me for:

 

1. Short-term work they need done but so not plan to stay in that business beyond a short time.

 

2. Immediate work where they have a need for expertise to produce immediately and do not have time to wait on a learning curve.

 

3. Most important, and when I am really used well is when I am hired not so much to do a specific job, but to build the capacity of the institution to do the work themselves.

 

I am lucky enough that I can tend to avoid the first two types of work because I find it generally unfulfilling. Sometimes I will do it because I am paid googobas of money to do it or the job is in a nifty place I want to go.

 

The best work in #3 is actually the hard part about being a consultant. If I do my job right I work myself out of a job and even worse I am not there for the kill and the fun part of accomplishing things. Still, I have a short attention span so this flitting around suits me.

 

This is relevant because there are football analogies for each of these three needs. Unfortunately, the Bills have not been good enough for a while for the football case where the first two reasons make sense. When your team is one or a couple of players away from going for the SB, it makes perfect sense to bring in a "consultant" typr player who is not part of your history and will not be part of your future.

 

However, if you are good and understand your scheme and make a judgment that a player who can perform a specific role in the immediate can put you over the top git er done.

 

Likewise, forget the draft for meeting an immediate need as it usually only two or even one player who will start immediately for your team and a handul that contribute over the course of a season. You need a "consultant" player ifyou are lucky enough to get the right one.

 

This brings us to Vincent. Actually he seems to fit the highest and best use of a consultant as it applies to football. What TV is all about particularly after going on the IR is building the capacity of several players on this team to perform well. Why are we able to use 2 rookies of all things as starting safeties and have them impress? Why is the rookie Whitner calling plays and changes assignments on thefield as though he we was a vet?

 

I dunno for sure, but i would not be surprised at all if this is in part because of the presnce of TV.

 

It could be that it is simply because Whitner is so great and Simpson is so great and Ellison listens to Whitner and does what he says becaise he knows Whitner is so great. However, what I think may well have happened here was the the young Bills (particularly the DBs and Ss are profiting from having a former multi-time Pro Bowler who clearly has both the on field and off-field respect of the players helping them dissect every piece of film on opponents and also critique and improve their own work.

 

Maybe the rooks are just tremendous players who would do what they are doing even without TV. If so, then we should all really bow down and say we are not worthy to Marv and Modrak because they were smart enough to reach for Whiner and to draft Ellison, Williams and Simpson on the second day.

 

Maybe it is the superior position coaching from Calvados. I think that is actually a big factor, but remember that he not only has the typical responsibility of working with vets like McGee and NC, but also he teaching the two rookie starters, AND needing to also school Youbouty, AND sorting through FA consultants like Bowen and Thomas and making the decision to cut King and keep Wire.

 

My sense is that in the end we are going to feel quite fortunate the way things played out with TV. By going on IR most of the pre-season it gave valuable minutes to the rookies to learn the game, By being respected as both a player and as a person he immediately should have been able to command special respect from the rooks. In addition, a fellow player and peer, TV really can do some things and here some admissions from the rooks and talk to them in a way they simply would not talk to or admit their difficulties to a man who will decide whether they get cut or not.

 

I cannot say for sure what difference TV had made, but given the many things on Calvados plate, the fact all rookies MUST learn the NFL game and it is not the typical thing for a rookie to start and play effectively for NFL teams immeidiately and really rare for a seconf day draftee to even contribute much less start for his team right out the box,

 

What is different about this team:

 

1. The HC is a former DB, once NFL Coach of the Year and a defensive specialist.

2. The Bills players all expected to and are expected to contribute immediately though it was mostly ST where they expected to do this because of Marv's emphasis.

3. TV was there as quite frankly the most respected player you can have (voted NFL Pres and a multi-time former Pro Bowler) but yet because of his injury he did not take any time away from the rooks.

 

I am really pumped about TV offering to stick around for a few weeks though many IR players simply go home if their rehab is set and they can do it remotely. My main hope is that now Youbouty and TV become fast friends and constant companions. Youbouty can oribably use the help since his Mom died and if TV can download to him while Calvados spends his time between the more than full time needs of two rook safety starters. The life may be very good.

[CircleTheWagons]

3.  Most important, and when I am really used well is when I am hired not so much to do a specific job, but to build the capacity of the institution to do the work themselves.

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Consultants defending consultants, there's a surprise I quoted the line above because I know a couple of staff that would have punched me if I used that on a contract

 

Back on topic, I respect TV, and I appreciate that he may be vital to the development of our defense - but I would never spend $100 for his jersey.

[BillnutinHouston]

Vincent plays with the Cajones of Holcomb and the desire of Bledsoe.  He was a good player for a lot of years, but he never seemed to show that tremendous fire for the game during his Bill tenure.  He has amassed a fortune in leveraging his NFL earnings into successful business ventures.  IMO he has been playing just enough to get it done and nothing more.  It's not a knock that "he's well spoken and calculated, he must not like football" rather his actions on the field and his lack of desire to "stick his head in there" show he's playing for life after football.

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Well said. TV is full of character and devoid of any desire. A fine young man, but it's time for him to wear a tie full time.

[Pyrite Gal]

In summary: I think the Bills played this right way. Given our sorry D last year and a critical lack of turnover production, there is no way I cut my leading producer of turnovers last year. He is well into the backside of his career, but since he was able to play in all 16 games last year, I give him the benefit of the doubt unless he clearly hits the wall in pre-season due to injury.

 

Yet his age means I put a high priority on getting talent in the draft and sign an FA if I can because my key back-up Wire contributes only on ST and he will even have to vie for a spot there.

 

Cap $ is alays an issue as I want to maximize profits, Tet the new CBA raises the cap and gives me flexibility not to have to cut players I have any probable need for.

 

The TO situation creates that probable need for TV, plus when you add that my new Cover 2 tends his role toward his coverage skills where he made the Pro Bowl due to his youth and away from the run stopping required of a safety in the zone blitz.

 

I cut his fellow safety Milloy which saves me far more money than cutting TV and fits the switch to a Cover 2.

 

Further I fet the immediate starter at SS in the 1st round, luck into getting a CB in the 3rd with 1st round physical talent but 3rd round experience. Finally I get another safety who savvy I like early on the second day, This fuirther enhances TVs value as my DN position coach is gonna have his hands full with all this draft talent.

 

Further, I get Bowen who definitely has the ST talent we want and I think can actually challenge as a position player. In addition I get K. Thomas who I think can challenge for the nickel slot and will compete with draft pick King from last year.

 

In the final equation, my lucj with TV runs out as a nagging hamstring costs him the pre-season and eventually means he will need to sit for roughly 4 weeks with no gurantee he can come back. The good news is that Simpson is a player and the late signing Whitner also looks good.

 

The TV injury may well be a blessing in disguise as his injury in pre-season gave the rooks more PT. Even better if IR'ed he will hang around and provide Pro Bol quality peer coaching to the youngsters. The CB coach xan devote full time to keeping good players on the field and well coached and TV can give time to Youbouty who is vehind anyway due to a death in the family and Calvado's job has to be to win on Sunday rather than train for next year.

 

I think the Bills made the right move to keep him and bad luck cost them. However, the bad luck of injury provides some nice training side effects. The money issue is always there but simply means that the Bills instead of making outrageous profits with a growing TV payment with costs fixed by the CBA, simply means the Bills make less outrageous profit rather than more outrageous profit.

 

No one chooses injury but, I think the whole thing works for us.

[rogerkochman]

Maybe Troy Vincent is thinking about purchasing the Buffalo Bills.

[keepthefaith]

Maybe Troy Vincent is thinking about purchasing the Buffalo Bills.

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You read my mind. The league supports minority ownership and Troy appears to have a great deal of business sense.

[OCinBuffalo]

This sounds a little to cynical to me.  I have listened to TV on many occasions through the years and have always gotten the impression that he is a stand up guy.  I've never thought that he might be trying to portray himself as anything other than.......well, himself.  Just my 2 cents.

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Yeah after further review I see what you are saying, I meant to show how good the guy is at being an NFL person, in general, in his play, press interactions, team building, etc. - it didn't come out right.

[OCinBuffalo]

In my (simplistic) view, Vincent sounds like a businessman who used his football talents to generate revenue and establish contacts.  Good for him and I wish more of the players had some of his business acumen.

 

I have had a hard time getting excited about TV - he seems like the consultant a company hires and pays too much money to work beside the full-time staff.  You know the consultant is in it for the short-term and more focussed on himself than the project.

 

On a football team, I don't want "consultants," no matter how experienced they are.  TD was good at hiring consultants; it appears with Marv's first draft that he's more interested in developing his full-timers from within.  Bills are coming back, I can feel it...

782926[/snapback]

Hey I resemble that remark. If your company is doing what you say then shame on them. We are what we are, it's the same as guns. You know what a gun can do the same as you know what a consultant can do. Therefore there can be just as many bad uses for both as good ones. Using a "real" consultant in a staff augmentation role is just as bad as you say it is. That's what they have companies like Ajilon, Manpower, CTG, or Jim's Toolbox MCSEs for Hire for.

[Nanker]

Cheers to Marv and Jauron who found a way to cut an aging player with diminished skills who was a darling of the owner, and at the same time avoiding a controversy like the RJ/DF debacle.

 

Of course, Marv doesn't know what he's doing and we're 5 million under the cap. If only Marv never came back. We could of had a 50 year old starting Safety in about 10 years.

[Kelly the Dog]

Cheers to Marv and Jauron who found a way to cut an aging player with diminished skills who was a darling of the owner, and at the same time avoiding a controversy like the RJ/DF debacle.

 

Of course, Marv doesn't know what he's doing and we're 5 million under the cap. If only Marv never came back. We could of had a 50 year old starting Safety in about 10 years. 

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Oh, c'mon. The guy got injured. Marv and Jauron started him and wanted to start him and likely would have started him the entire year if he didn't get hurt. And this was the only way to do it unless they wanted to cut a player they didnt want to cut. It just happened.