Holcomb probably earned a lot of PT next week

[Pyrite Gal]

Hear this out and IMHO opinion understand that while I agree with Marv that if you have a battle between two starting QBs, you probably do not have a starting QB. In addition to that last night's performances really intensify the battle for #2 QB and that is likely going to lead to Nall getting some accelerated looks after his injury and Holcomb getting some serious looks to determine whether he can function even adequately as a QB in this system. I think the QB take should be something like this:

 

1. As expected by many JP is clearly the likely starter at QB for this team. He still needs some PT in real games because the rate-limiting factor in his performance is in his head. The 0 completions in his first three throws and a horrendous thow where the pass plowed into the dirt several yards short of an outside reciever in the next series are not physical problams interfering with good work from him but mental problem.

 

The good news for JP is that with some gametime and against the #2 Panthers and lesser players, he began to show some real production with the O and was calm enough to pick his spots and be productive. The best thing I saw from him last night was that he not only showed the escapability which attracted us to him, but in general he hung in there rather than opt-out and go running as if he was behind the Tulane OL too quickly.

 

Sometimes, his hanging in there until the last moment resulted in him getting off a nice pass as it simply took a little time for Aiken or another WR to break free (the play where the Panther DE was right next to him but he stepped up a small amount and got the pass off was great to see). Other times, he did get sacked. Often he pulled off some great escape move where he hung in there and the Panthers even got a paw on him, but he managed to get out ran around and get the ball off.

 

Last year, JP would have flown the coop and been out of there at the first sign of trouble. Yesterday, he hung in there and depended on his teammates. The startubg OL oes not have chemistry yet, so they cannot be fully depended on to do well, but the really good news is that even though we were not initially producive JP did not react by trying to take it on himself alone to produce in some worthless pre-season game, he hung in there and gave the team the practice it needed to learn how to play together.

 

2. Holcomb simply sucked. He showed no command and prodcution with the O against the Panthers starters. His INT was either simply a horrendous throw on his part as he seemed to fail to read that a DB was right there and he never should have tried the ill-conceived play or he saw the DB and made a lousy throw.

 

However, folks need to realize that this is the NFL. Injuries happen way too often and for weird reasons (ex. Losman himself going out a few games as a rookie because TV pushed him). The major QB take from last night was not simply that JP needs some PT to become the starter we want, but that KH was so bad, the #2 role is there for the taking if Nall can come back from injury.

 

Holcomb has played for too long amd demonstrated over the years that he is a pretty good back-up QB though he never has shown the consistency to be a starter. With last night's horrid performance in a new D, we need the answer to the question whether this occured because of a burp in KH's play and that with a week's practice and focus he gets it, or alternately is his production in a new O so problematic and Nall has come back from injury enough that he can take the #2 job.

 

I know that many posters have their panties all up in a wad over the question of who is gonna be our starting QB. However, I think that is an obviously importnt question but is one which A). It really is already decided as it has been for quite a while that JP is the likely guy to be our starter, and B). his getting a few more reps in the 2nd pre-season game is not gonna make a huge difference in how quickly or well he gets to his maximum productivity and potential as a starting QB.

 

JP demonstrated by his play last night that he has the tools to be an adequate NFL QB right now, but it is really doubtful that he will become a great or even very good NFL QB without a year (or more of work).

 

Instead, what is a more important question which hangs in the balance as to what the Bills should do is whether Holcomg has enough problems that he can be surpassed by Nall as our #2. This question is really unclear now as Nall is essentailly an unknown because of his injury and Holcomb's poor production last night and inconsistency in practice last week raise serious questions as to whether he is even good enough to be a #2 in our system.

 

Ironically, I think that the Bill's planned schedule of playing QBs next week fits our needs. it will be interesting to see how players are able to do work in practice this week.

 

From what I understand and what I would do if I were Jauron/Fairchild (which I am not fortunately since our chances of winning though small are still much higher under these professional than they would be under me or any fan) is:

 

1. JP remains my likely starter as he always has been all things being equal and the Bills having KH being first on the depth chart. Yet, as before I still talk about this as a n open competition between these three and talk about JP as showing he still needs to develop given his initial poor performance but that he has firnly shown he is on the right track with his performance against the Panthers's back-ups. He gets alot of significant reps same as before at QB and easily the most of any player at QB on the team. However, he does not get all the reps or even a majority of them combined to the combined total of Holcomb and Nall as giving him all the reps this week would not make him a great or even very good player yet and giving no reps with the starters to Holcomb or Nall would really damage the prospects of this team if the unpredictable happens (which it always seems to in the NFL).

 

2. KH is on the hot seat for me now as he is at risk of being designated in my mind certainly if not publicly of being my #3 disaster QB. If I think he can respond I am going to make him my disaster Q, I probably still leave him as #1 on my deopth chart because I want JP to take the #1 spot from him with a great performance and not win the #1 slot because he was simply better than a really bad KH. I also want to motivate Nall that he still has shot at being my $1 because KH is almostt certainly gonna give up the slot and since I have not anointed JP as my starter yet, he needs to know that all things are in play. KH is on the hot seat because despite his lousy play Saturday night he gets a chance this week, but he needs to either show some production with that chance or face the possiblity that Nall performs and he is reduced to the #3 role. I feel great about my plans because last night KH started but JP played the bulk of the game.

 

Against the Bengals, JP will get a chance to play with and against the starters and if he proves to be productive, I sit him most of the game declare him starter after an adequate performance last night and a good short performance against Cincy. This would be great because JP then gets a chance to start and play a bunch in my 3rd pre-season game which traditionally is when the team really works of in season production and the starters all play well into the second half. In the last game the starters start but it is to be hoped are productive in their first series and sit to avoid injuries.

 

KH is planned to get the bulk of the reps in the 2nd game and that is my intent. However, KH should suck or Nall looks good in practice this week, i move quickly to Nall and let him prove himself.

 

The bottomline for me is that JP demonstrated he is the best among the three, but given how badly KH played and Nall's injury this may not be saying much. The key for me and the Bills is now to decide whether Nall has any chance of being a real starter (I doubt it, but given I do not think JP will be a very good starter without a year of work. sitting him to get a good look at Nall or a revived KH is not much of a loss for this team).

 

I think the bottom line is that JP played well enough to not be under pressure of getting demoted by not so well that the Bills can ignore the possibilities that Nall maight be better than we expect or that Holcomb can be simply thrown under the bus at this point. Some might argue that JP simply proved he needs PT against real opponent to improve. I agree, but does anyone out there seriously think that whether JP gets all the reps in practice and in the 2nd pre-seaspn game will make the difference in whether he is an adequate player or a very good player.

 

I think the key for the Bills getting Ws this year is to do this with merely an adequate QB. I simply do not see JP being more than an adequate QB this year and a bunch more reps this week will not make him a very good QB nor will the absence of those reps make him a bad QB.

[roscoeparrishfan]

"Against the Bengals, JP will get a chance to play with and against the starters and if he proves to be productive, I sit him most of the game declare him starter after an adequate performance last night and a good short performance against Cincy. This would be great because JP then gets a chance to start and play a bunch in my 3rd pre-season game which traditionally is when the team really works of in season production and the starters all play well into the second half. In the last game the starters start but it is to be hoped are productive in their first series and sit to avoid injuries."

 

So you don't think nall will get a chance to start a game?

[AJ1]

IMO, KH is earning nothing but a ticket out of town. If this is JP's competition, there's no real competition. I agree that the coaches would like to see what Nall can do but only to see if he can supplant Kelly for #2. Holcomb as a number 3 means his career as a perennial backup is over. Then the question is whether or not to give KH is walking papers.

 

I say he survives this year but that's the extent of it.

 

I wouldn't waste pre-season playing time on him unless Juaron announces JP as the starter this week.

[Risin]

If Kelly continues to look like this, I see no reason to keep him around.

 

I haven't seen Nall take a preseason snap yet, and I'm ready to declare him the backup by default.

 

Keep Cliff as #3, and develop both Losman and Nall.

 

Holcomb looked scary bad last night, and for all his experience, that INT was unforgivable last night.

[Cripes]

Hear this out

 

Make it less than 1,764 words, and I will.

[LabattBlue]

I'll sum it up in one sentence like I did in another thread...JP is more than likely going to start and if Nall can show anything before the final cutdown, Holcomb may not even make the roster.

[Pyrite Gal]

"Against the Bengals, JP will get a chance to play with and against the starters and if he proves to be productive, I sit him most of the game declare him starter after an adequate performance last night and a good short performance against Cincy. This would be great because JP then gets a chance to start and play a bunch in my 3rd pre-season game which traditionally is when the team really works of in season production and the starters all play well into the second half. In the last game the starters start but it is to be hoped are productive in their first series and sit to avoid injuries."

 

So you don't think nall will get a chance to start a game?

742267[/snapback]

 

I doubt it because I think that JP definitely starts against the Bengals as stated.

 

I hope (and actually expect) that he will move the teams well enough to nail down the starting QB job and as soon as he gives that performance that Jauron is smart enough to sit him down and allow Nall and KH to have an open competition for the #2 slot.

 

If this occurs like I hope and expect, JP starts game 3 and gets extended time with the starters as the Bills really try to work on getting our offense regular season ready (it simply remains to be seen whether everything can come together to make this so).

 

However, being optimistic, they do and in game 4 JP starts again but plays only as long as it takes for him to end pre-season on a good note and then the final pre-season game sees serious competition between the back-ups to remain on this team and between Holcomb and Nall over who will be the #2.

 

I think the big mistake that some folks will make is of thinking that last night's performance means that JP now gets all the reps and that Holcomb is simply thrown under the bus.

 

I would disagree with both these moves as though I think JP is the starting QB, I do not think that additional reps in practice this week or beyond a start of similar length to Holcomb's start will make any difference in JP's QB performance for the Bills this year. He will probably be an adequate QB but it is doubtful he will even reach the level of being a very good NFL QB. A weeks worth of reps will not change this outcome.

 

However, we can take a serious look at how well Nall has recovered and whether the has the stuff to be our #2 and to judge whether KH has enough trouble with this O given his career long history of inconsistent play that he either worthy of being our back-up or Nall shows something an relegats KH to the disaster job.

[Pyrite Gal]

I'll sum it up in one sentence like I did in another thread...JP is more than likely going to start and if Nall can show anything before the final cutdown, Holcomb may not even make the roster.

742296[/snapback]

 

I agree with this summary since as usual I did a long-winded post as I thought this out. I'm glad that my musings were cogent enough and I thank you for taking the time to slog through them to be able to briefly summarize the result of that thinking.

[LabattBlue]

I agree with this summary since as usual I did a long-winded post as I thought this out.  I'm glad that my musings were cogent enough and I thank you for taking the time to slog through them to be able to briefly summarize the result of that thinking.

742309[/snapback]

Glad to help!

[jarthur31]

I think JP plays most of the first half next week and maybe more depending on how well he does. He will be pulled if he plays badly like Kelly did.

[Fixxxer]

From the information I gathered since TC began up to this game is that Losman is improving. Not at a fast pace, mind you, but improving nontheless.

 

We would all hope there's a QB switch we can turn on so that we can finally have some stability from the QB position but unfortunately that's not the case.

 

First four games Losman was horrid.

He was benched and when he was named the starter again he was a totally different QB from his first 4 experiences.

He would still have accuracy problems and would take off at the first sign of pressure.

 

Now I'm hearing/reading that he's being more patient and going threw his progressions (Lee Evans said so at BB.com) He's hanging in the pocket waiting for the play to develop. He's still is incosistent with accuracy but he'll eventually get there with playing time.

If he would have hit Aikens on that long pass we would feel a lot better about his performance. He has to hit those with consistency because those are the kind of passes that can make a difference in a game.

 

I think he'll be named the starter for the opener against the NE because I think he's shown progression in his game everytime he steps on the field.

 

Will that be enough to have a great season? I'm not sure, I think he'll struggle at times but that can be masked with a good gameplan and a soild running game.

Hopefully Fairchild does what MM and TC couldn't do and that is put Losman in position to manage a game and make plays here and then.

 

Go BILLS!!!