inkman Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 This should not be a huge sticking point. It's amazing that this has kept him out and behind the eight ball. 732630[/snapback] It is a huge sticking point because the players only leverage is when they can become a free agent. The shorter the contract the sooner the (much bigger) payday, if said player is worthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 It is a huge sticking point because the players only leverage is when they can become a free agent. The shorter the contract the sooner the (much bigger) payday, if said player is worthy. 732634[/snapback] Character baby, it's ALL about the character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 I have to think a kid like donte is pretty broken up about the situation. This kid busted his ass at Ohio State and does seem like a real character guy. Maybe the Bills are the ones at fault here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 I have to think a kid like donte is pretty broken up about the situation. This kid busted his ass at Ohio State and does seem like a real character guy. Maybe the Bills are the ones at fault here. 732639[/snapback] LMAO! The kid's going to get paid MILLIONS to play a game. And yet he's sitting out like a spoiled child because he wants to be a FA earlier? Yeah, that's character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribo Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 I have to think a kid like donte is pretty broken up about the situation. This kid busted his ass at Ohio State and does seem like a real character guy. Maybe the Bills are the ones at fault here. 732639[/snapback] Marv said the number being offered is smack dab in the middle of what Huff and Simms just signed for. If the Bills are holding on to get an extra year in the contract, hell, that is something Whittner should give them for drafting him so high, IMHO. I'm a Bills fan first, and a fan of the players second. In other words, I am more interested in the team getting a fair shake than Whittner. But, as I just said, I think a six-year deal with #8 money is fair to all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 LMAO! The kid's going to get paid MILLIONS to play a game. And yet he's sitting out like a spoiled child because he wants to be a FA earlier? Yeah, that's character. 732640[/snapback] He wants to be on a level with his peers. I would hope that we all can be equally compensated for similar jobs. He didn't create the job market, he just wants to be represented well in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 Marv said the number being offered is smack dab in the middle of what Huff and Simms just signed for. If the Bills are holding on to get an extra year in the contract, hell, that is something Whittner should give them for drafting him so high, IMHO. I'm a Bills fan first, and a fan of the players second. In other words, I am more interested in the team getting a fair shake than Whittner. But, as I just said, I think a six-year deal with #8 money is fair to all. 732641[/snapback] How about an option year at the players discretion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 He wants to be on a level with his peers. I would hope that we all can be equally compensated for similar jobs. He didn't create the job market, he just wants to be represented well in it. 732665[/snapback] If you or I "sat out" of our jobs because we wanted more money, we'd get fired. This kid is indefensible in his position. He's the number 8 pick, the money is right, all the Bills want is a little bit more security on their end from a kid who should NOT have been drafted at 8. Screw Whitner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 I can't say a part of me doesn't feel that way but I like to play devils advocate every now and then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 If you or I "sat out" of our jobs because we wanted more money, we'd get fired. This kid is indefensible in his position. He's the number 8 pick, the money is right, all the Bills want is a little bit more security on their end from a kid who should NOT have been drafted at 8. Screw Whitner. 732680[/snapback] That is so off base I don't know where to start. So far the Bills haven't paid him a cent (except perhaps per diem) and yet he has been busting his balls working out, going to mini-camp when he can, going to all OTAs he's allowed to and reading the playbook and talking about work with the coaches on the phone. How many businesses don't pay their employees anything but ask them to kill themselves and risk their entire careers for you? Second, you have zero idea what the real numbers are. None. Marv said it is between the 7th and the 9th but that means virtually nothing unless you look at what is REALLY being offered, especially guaranteed money, how hard are the incentives to reach, the signing bonus, etc. In today's News it states the Huff contract is very complicated and THE BILLS are the ones saying it doesn't really reflect the numbers. Marv also said in the same interview about what the Bills offered Whitner that "I don't know the figures", so what is it you're supposed to believe? Guess what? He WAS drafted at 8. In fact, the Bills are the one team in the entire league that we know for a fact BELIEVE he was good enough at eight. They picked him and then said he was our highest rated saftey, above Huff. Should they pay him more than Huff because they think he's better? The only thing we know for sure about The Bills and Whitner and the contract is that we know nothing and have no idea who is or isn't being reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gross Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 LMAO! The kid's going to get paid MILLIONS to play a game. And yet he's sitting out like a spoiled child because he wants to be a FA earlier? Yeah, that's character. 732640[/snapback] Yup, you know the situation Joe. You know that he's staying away from camp and it's not the Bills telling him he can't be anywhere near camp until he's under contract. You know that he doesn't want to play, and that he's patiently waiting for the Bills to come up with his terms. The hold up is all his doing and not his agent's...Not saying he isn't complicit in sticking with the agent, but don't you think there's a possibility that this kid just wants to play football, and he happened to pick the wrong agent, and now isn't the time to try to change...? I mean, I don't seem him out there holding Reggie Bush-esque pressers gloating about the possibility of holding out...do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thailog80 Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 Yup, you know the situation Joe. You know that he's staying away from camp and it's not the Bills telling him he can't be anywhere near camp until he's under contract. You know that he doesn't want to play, and that he's patiently waiting for the Bills to come up with his terms. The hold up is all his doing and not his agent's...Not saying he isn't complicit in sticking with the agent, but don't you think there's a possibility that this kid just wants to play football, and he happened to pick the wrong agent, and now isn't the time to try to change...? I mean, I don't seem him out there holding Reggie Bush-esque pressers gloating about the possibility of holding out...do you? 732709[/snapback] Oh okay Dan Im sure it's all the big bad agents fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 Marv said the number being offered is smack dab in the middle of what Huff and Simms just signed for. If the Bills are holding on to get an extra year in the contract, hell, that is something Whittner should give them for drafting him so high, IMHO. I'm a Bills fan first, and a fan of the players second. In other words, I am more interested in the team getting a fair shake than Whittner. But, as I just said, I think a six-year deal with #8 money is fair to all. 732641[/snapback] Not when the guy above him and the guy below him signed 5 year deals. If the Bills didn't think he was worth the 8th pick, then they shouldn't have taken him with the 8th pick. If the situation were reversed and we got a guy in the second round that "should have" been taken in the first, do you think the Bills would pay more than second round cash? No. Freaking. Way. If the Bills are insisting on a 6 year deal when the guys above and below Whitner got 5 year deals or if the Bills are trying to argue that he wasn't a "true" 8th pick, then I can see why Whitner is holding out. Any player in that situation would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gross Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 Oh okay Dan Im sure it's all the big bad agents fault. 732710[/snapback] Like I said, he's complicit in staying with the agent. But there are three players in this deal and Whitner is only one of them. To say that he's "sitting out like a spoiled child" implies that Joe either knows something we don't or is jumping to conclusions that Whitner is solely responsible for not being at camp, that Whitner doesn't want to go anywhere near the team until the Bills meet "his terms." I'm just saying there are other possibilities....yeah, I went a little overboard in response, but I'm tired of this garbage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWings Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 He wants to be on a level with his peers. I would hope that we all can be equally compensated for similar jobs. He didn't create the job market, he just wants to be represented well in it. 732665[/snapback] I know this is the way it is these days, but Donte hasn't proven a thing yet. Dude...sign the 6-year deal and get into camp. Yeah, you may not be starting on opening day, but show the coaches you're ready to play. If I were Marv, I'd tell him "OK...we'll start the season without you if we have to." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluenews Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 It all goes back to Ralph and his little market. If he falls in line with the other owners and their draft picks (guaranteed money) then he comes down off his position of the CBA. This isn't really about the #8 pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cåblelady Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 I'm just saying there are other possibilities...... 732725[/snapback] Maybe he thinks it's too hot out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 Like I said, he's complicit in staying with the agent. But there are three players in this deal and Whitner is only one of them. To say that he's "sitting out like a spoiled child" implies that Joe either knows something we don't or is jumping to conclusions that Whitner is solely responsible for not being at camp, that Whitner doesn't want to go anywhere near the team until the Bills meet "his terms." I'm just saying there are other possibilities....yeah, I went a little overboard in response, but I'm tired of this garbage... 732725[/snapback] If he REALLY wants to get to camp, he goes to camp. That's the bottom line. If he was REALLY interested in being a team guy, he'd have canned the agent who's getting in the way of his being there and practicing. But you don't see him doing that, do you? No, he's sitting out NOT because his agent is making him. He's doing it because he wants to. You don't need to know all the numbers to see that, DAN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 If you or I "sat out" of our jobs because we wanted more money, we'd get fired. This kid is indefensible in his position. He's the number 8 pick, the money is right, all the Bills want is a little bit more security on their end from a kid who should NOT have been drafted at 8. Screw Whitner. 732680[/snapback] Yes, we would be fired unless we were so valuable to the company that they would put up with us pulling that. Fact is, we aren't. Whitner on the other hand, has a lot more cards to play with because his job talents are more unique than ours. People with special skills get paid more and have more pull than people without special skills in our society. Whitner has special skills, you don't. Don't blame him for our lack of a skill as marketable as his. Another difference, you can quit and work for anyone else you want. Whitner doesn't have that choice. His only bargaining chip is the hold out. As for him not being worthy of the #8 pick, that argument went out the window the second we picked him at #8. We got Ko in the 4th and everyone agrees he should have gone in the 2nd or even the 1st. Should the Bills pay him first or second round green? No way. The market is the market. Huff and Sims got 5 year deals, so should Whitner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted August 1, 2006 Share Posted August 1, 2006 That is so off base I don't know where to start. So far the Bills haven't paid him a cent (except perhaps per diem) and yet he has been busting his balls working out, going to mini-camp when he can, going to all OTAs he's allowed to and reading the playbook and talking about work with the coaches on the phone. How many businesses don't pay their employees anything but ask them to kill themselves and risk their entire careers for you? Second, you have zero idea what the real numbers are. None. Marv said it is between the 7th and the 9th but that means virtually nothing unless you look at what is REALLY being offered, especially guaranteed money, how hard are the incentives to reach, the signing bonus, etc. In today's News it states the Huff contract is very complicated and THE BILLS are the ones saying it doesn't really reflect the numbers. Marv also said in the same interview about what the Bills offered Whitner that "I don't know the figures", so what is it you're supposed to believe? Guess what? He WAS drafted at 8. In fact, the Bills are the one team in the entire league that we know for a fact BELIEVE he was good enough at eight. They picked him and then said he was our highest rated saftey, above Huff. Should they pay him more than Huff because they think he's better? The only thing we know for sure about The Bills and Whitner and the contract is that we know nothing and have no idea who is or isn't being reasonable. 732689[/snapback] Exactly, the only thing for certain here is that we don't know all the facts and thus are unable to reach a reasonble opinion as to who is being pig headed here. Nevertheless, with few exceptions, those who have decided to blame someone anyway are blaming the player, not the team. Why is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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