Really glad Simpson and Williams are signed

[eball]

...compete for serious playing time. I'm very excited about the potential of Simpson paired with Whitner. Imagine the Bills with two playmaking safeties patrolling the backfield for the next 5-6 years (and hopefully longer).

 

Damn, I love football season. Even the negative !@#$s on this board can't keep me down. Go Bills!

[smuvtalker]

...compete for serious playing time.  I'm very excited about the potential of Simpson paired with Whitner.  Imagine the Bills with two playmaking safeties patrolling the backfield for the next 5-6 years (and hopefully longer).

 

Damn, I love football season.  Even the negative !@#$s on this board can't keep me down.  Go Bills!

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I agree. I heard some good things about Ko Simpson, and if he pans out the way the brass at OBD is hoping, he and Whitner will make a nice tandem for years to come.

 

Although many people are predicting a horrible year for us, I'm remaining quietly optimistic. Nothing would make me happier than to prove all the non-believers wrong...

[Dawgg]

Ko Simpson should push Vincent out the door. I would start him immediately and cut TV... but that's just me.

 

...compete for serious playing time.  I'm very excited about the potential of Simpson paired with Whitner.  Imagine the Bills with two playmaking safeties patrolling the backfield for the next 5-6 years (and hopefully longer).

 

Damn, I love football season.  Even the negative !@#$s on this board can't keep me down.  Go Bills!

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[Phlegm Alley]

I want a CHuck Cecil-esque mentality playing centerfield for the Bills

[Pyrite Gal]

Ko Simpson should push Vincent out the door.  I would start him immediately and cut TV... but that's just me.

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WHY?

 

The most important thing is obviously on-field production and if Kos Simpson produces better he should play, but even if he is gonna be great, it is generally quite the accomplishment for a second day draftee to simply be a contributor to the team by the end of his first year. Expecting him to start at all his first year is asking a lot of a player and asking him to start immediately puts the rookied on the same development track we used with first day pick Coy Wire,

 

From the highlights I have seen Simpson looks like a far smarter player than Wire, but having him start before he is ready to perform is actually a good way to retard his growth.

 

Beyond rushing Sinpson being potentially bad for his development, TV has several real world positives to provide to this team:

 

1. He led the team in terms of combined turnovers last year tieing for the team lead in INTs with McGee and with several players in fumbles recovered. As a Bill fan I want him and all players who start to perform even better than they did last year. Don't you?

 

2. The switcch to the Cover 2 from the zone blitz moves his duty away from the primary complaints folks had about TV tackling and toward his strength of pass coverage and using the many plays he has seen over many years to diagnose plays.

 

3. Our young DBs from fellow starter Whitner, to Yobouty who all analysis point to him needing another year of CB schooling and Simpson himself stand to profit a great deal from having TV download his experiences and perspective gained in years of play to these youngsters.

 

The thought that he should be cut seems even more negative toward the Bills as:

 

1. I hope Simpson steps up and plays well and commands a starting role, but if so TV can play the same peer teaching role as a back-up so why on earth cut him.

 

2. There is little cash advantage cap wise for cutting TV.

 

3. If your anti-TV feelings are prompted by his getting the respect from his fellow players of being voted NFLPA President, one hopes the Bills do not act or operate in the same way. If the word were to spread among players that TV got cut when he could contribute to Ws due to his union activity, the retribution by the players on through free coukd be severe. The Bills need to keep their union feelings and their football activities in differet places. If we use the game for retribution against NFLPA leadershp it will only hurt the Bills on the field to mix these two areas,

[Rico]

Ko Simpson should push Vincent out the door.  I would start him immediately and cut TV... but that's just me.

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Absolutely the smart move for a rebuilding team to make. Keeping TV is like starting Holcomb over JP last year, it's just a total waste of time.

[Dawgg]

Perhaps I was being a bit harsh. I have nothing against TV's role as NFLPA president. I do, however, feel that this team needs to stop trying to have it both ways and part ways with players who are over the hill and are on the downside of their career.

 

They did it with Moulds.

They did it with Milloy.

They did it with Adams.

Vincent is no different.

 

I don't agree with the notion that starting Simpson could slow his development. I think the single best way for a youngster to learn his trade is to play. Will he make mistakes? Sure he will -- but what better year to do that than this year, which is clearly a rebuilding year. This lack of identity cost the team another year of uncertainty at the QB position. Rather than stick with JP all season long, Mularkey wavered and put Holcomb in and now we are left wondering what JP Losman is capable of.

 

 

 

 

WHY?

 

The most important thing is obviously on-field production and if Kos Simpson produces better he should play, but even if he is gonna be great, it is generally quite the accomplishment for a second day draftee to simply be a contributor to the team by the end of his first year.  Expecting him to start at all his first year is asking a lot of a player and asking him to start immediately puts the rookied on the same development track we used with first day pick Coy Wire,

 

From the highlights I have seen Simpson looks like a far smarter player than Wire, but having him start before he is ready to perform is actually a good way to retard his growth.

 

Beyond rushing Sinpson being potentially bad for his development, TV has several real world positives to provide to this team:

 

1. He led the team in terms of combined turnovers last year tieing for the team lead in INTs with McGee and with several players in fumbles recovered.  As a Bill fan I want him and all players who start to perform even better than they did last year. Don't you?

 

2. The switcch to the Cover 2 from the zone blitz moves his duty away from the primary complaints folks had about TV tackling and toward his strength of pass coverage and using the many plays he has seen over many years to diagnose plays.

 

3. Our young DBs from fellow starter Whitner, to Yobouty who all analysis point to him needing another year of CB schooling and Simpson himself stand to profit a great deal from having TV download his experiences and perspective gained in years of play to these youngsters.

 

The thought that he should be cut seems even more negative toward the Bills as:

 

1. I hope Simpson steps up and plays well and commands a starting role, but if so TV can play the same peer teaching role as a back-up so why on earth cut him.

 

2. There is little cash advantage cap wise for cutting TV.

 

3. If your anti-TV feelings are prompted by his getting the respect from his fellow players of being voted NFLPA President, one hopes the Bills do not act or operate in the same way.  If the word were to spread among players that TV got cut when he could contribute to Ws due to his union activity, the retribution by the players on through free coukd be severe.  The Bills need to keep their union feelings and their football activities in differet places. If we use the game for retribution against NFLPA leadershp it will only hurt the Bills on the field to mix these two areas,

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[MadBuffaloDisease]

If TV were a lifelong FS, I'd seriously consider keeping him around to tutor the younger guys. But he's a converted CB still learning FS, so cutting him should be something the Bills seriously consider.

[Rico]

If TV were a lifelong FS, I'd seriously consider keeping him around to tutor the younger guys.  But he's a converted CB still learning FS, so cutting him should be something the Bills seriously consider.

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Plus AFAIK he's played ZERO years as a Cover 2 CB... and definitely ZERO years as a Cover 2 S. All that experience is negligible... Rashad Baker already has played more Cover 2 than him, cause RB showed up for the OTA's

It's like Chris Brown wrote today, TV is one of the players who "will likely have to come up with the best three and a half weeks they've ever had on the practice fields of St. John Fisher to solidify their standing on the 53-man roster.".... no time to coast, Troy.

[eball]

If TV were a lifelong FS, I'd seriously consider keeping him around to tutor the younger guys.  But he's a converted CB still learning FS, so cutting him should be something the Bills seriously consider.

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Good point. Additionally, this "tutor" angle is, I believe, way overplayed in the media and among fans. Notice how you rarely, if ever, hear coaches and players talk about it. Roster spots are too precious to keep old guys who can't play but will "assist" with the development of player X.

 

Bottom line -- if Vincent can play, he'll stay.

[Dawgg]

We have a COACHING STAFF on the payroll to tutor players.

 

I can't wait to see what Simpson can do on the field. He seems like he has all the tools to be successful. He just needs to go out and do it.

 

 

 

Good point.  Additionally, this "tutor" angle is, I believe, way overplayed in the media and among fans.  Notice how you rarely, if ever, hear coaches and players talk about it.  Roster spots are too precious to keep old guys who can't play but will "assist" with the development of player X.

 

Bottom line -- if Vincent can play, he'll stay.

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[Pyrite Gal]

We have a COACHING STAFF on the payroll to tutor players.

 

I can't wait to see what Simpson can do on the field.  He seems like he has all the tools to be successful. He just needs to go out and do it.

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I agree that if Ko Simpson is a better player than TV then Ko Simpson should start.

 

However, if folks have never heard about older players teaching younger players about things from the details of playing the game to the broader issues of handling yourself as a pro and supporting upur teammates then folks have not been listening very hard.

 

From stories like when Milloy first came to this team and basically called his teammates out at one of this first team gatherings when the boys laughed and made fun of a fellow player when he got bowled over on film and Milloy was pretty pissed about making the point that such displays were one of the things which made unsuccessful teams different from the support which the Pats showed each other that made them a TEAM capable of winning an SB. Players were chastened and it was noted that their was a apa;pab;e difference in attitude that led to our Bills simply beating the crap out of a much better Pats' team 31-0 in the opener.

 

For those who think the game is all about physical ability and how fast does someone run a 40, simply note that the Pats team at that point was in disarray over Belichek completely screwing up the Milloy negotiations. The gut check came when Colvin and a few other supposed central guys to their getting Ws went down and this team faced a gut check and had the internal leadership (One of BB's key contibutions was

he seemed to gave them all something in common to hate) to act like professionals and back each other up. Good vets teach rooks these lessons.

 

Brady also talks about and seems to be sincere and truthful about it what a help it was for him as a young QB to have fellow player Bledsoe to talk with about Ds and how to lead the team. Bledsoe often had brain farts when he had to make a quick decision or improvise, but he could give Brady a perspective as a fellow player and communicate things with him in a way a coach could not.

 

Also on the QB front, one of the main problems with Flutie which made him not the player to be the #1 for a youngster like RJ and which was an issue for him with SB was wether he was going to relate to Brees as a competitor or as a student. TV is clearly on borrowed time due to his age and he is likely to be all about passing things on to up and comers like Simpson.

 

The focus of some that TV never was a safety or never played Cover 2 seems somewhat limited and even misguided about what is going on here. One of our main concerns about TV is that he is so old that he may hit some physical wall. However one thing that comes along with that age is he has seen a ton of plays and formation from a DBs point of view. The safety role in the Cover or Tampa 2 is all about playing centerfield and making reads.

 

The notion that TV knows nothing about the safety role because he was a CB simply igmores the fact that if one is playing any position effectively then you had better know exactly what your fellow teammates are supposed to do and where they are supposed to be. Over the years. TV was required generally to cover the best WR of the other team, but in any game when the situation called for it, the coverage scheme was a zone rather than a man to man. The notion that TV or any multi-teim Pro Bowler who played CB does not know what a safety is supposed to do and how zone coverages work is simply wrong.

 

Tje coaching staff does have the primary teaching duty, but believe me there are weaknesses or problems that any employee has which it is great to get the bosses help, there are simply weaknesses or problems one needs to be very careful about how you make the boss aware of them or bring them up at all. This is one of the advantages of having a fellow player who has been around whom you can talk to and get pointers from as to how pros deal with these plays and schemes.

 

Finally, I agree that when one is investing your own money getting rich slowly and building things to last is by far the best way to deal with building assets. However, the situation if you are Ralph, Marv or Jauron is a different market situation. Rather than thinking about the future or the long-term, they are running a business and selling tickets now. As Marv said in his book, coaches who build for a future payoff are simply building for the next coach.

 

Particularly after 6 years of no playoffs, the timescale of the Golden Boys who have no control over when the Grim Reaper will come is to win and win now. My sense is that if they have any belief at all that the guy who led the team in combined INTs and FRs can repeat or come close to doing this in 06 or instead they can give the player they environ as their future FS getting valuable time to make mistakes and learn, their choice is gonna be to go with the team leader in these categories and look to have the youngster learn by watching rather than learn by doing.

 

I think folks who are looking to produce a winner next year or the year after simply have different goals than Ralph, Marv and Jauron.

[generaLee83]

Ko Simpson should push Vincent out the door.  I would start him immediately and cut TV... but that's just me.

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I would not cut Vincent this season. I would work Simpson into the position slowly, over the course of the first 6-10 games. He should definitely see action immediately, but feel him out a little bit. Put him in for a few plays when called for and then spend time analyzing his play with him. I think Vincent still has some great play left in him, especially with the cover 2.

[Dan]

There's no way you cut Vincent this year. I'd be pretty well shocked if he doesn't make the team.

 

On a slightly different note.... "I'm glad we went ahead and got the contract out of the way," said Simpson. "I told my agent to go and get it done and I'm ready to come in and help the team any way I can."

 

So, if he can tell his agent to get the deal done, then why can't Reggie Bush? I'll take players like Simpson over Bush any day of the week.

[generaLee83]

There's no way you cut Vincent this year.  I'd be pretty well shocked if he doesn't make the team. 

 

On a slightly different note....  "I'm glad we went ahead and got the contract out of the way," said Simpson. "I told my agent to go and get it done and I'm ready to come in and help the team any way I can." 

 

So, if he can tell his agent to get the deal done, then why can't Reggie Bush?  I'll take players like Simpson over Bush any day of the week.

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I couldn't agree more. A guy who wanted to get the deal done so that he could PLAY and help out this TEAM. F Reggie Bush right in his ear.

[Dawgg]

Reggie Bush vs. Ko Simpson

 

Let that be the last time we make that comparison.

 

So, if he can tell his agent to get the deal done, then why can't Reggie Bush?  I'll take players like Simpson over Bush any day of the week.

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[Dan]

Reggie Bush vs. Ko Simpson

 

Let that be the last time we make that comparison.

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Say what you want. But I'd rather cheer for guys like Ko than Reggie Bush. As good as he MAY be, his attitude of late blows. Same goes for players like TO and Michael Irving. NEver would I want guys like that on the Bills.

[Dawgg]

If Ko Simpson was as good as Reggie Bush, he'd do the exact same thing. NFL players, on average, have very short careers. To make matters worse, unlike their MLB and NBA counterparts, their contracts are not guaranteed. So when a player has an opportunity to max out on what he can get, he simply should. All it takes is one blow to the knee to end his career.

 

Comparing Bush to TO is simply not valid or fair.

 

Say what you want.  But I'd rather cheer for guys like Ko than Reggie Bush.  As good as he MAY be, his attitude of late blows.  Same goes for players like TO and Michael Irving.  NEver would I want guys like that on the Bills.

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[Dibs]

If Ko Simpson was as good as Reggie Bush, he'd do the exact same thing.  NFL players, on average, have very short careers.  To make matters worse, unlike their MLB and NBA counterparts, their contracts are not guaranteed.  So when a player has an opportunity to max out on what he can get, he simply should.  All it takes is one blow to the knee to end his career. 

 

Comparing Bush to TO is simply not valid or fair.

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I think the thing to remember is rookies like Bush are still very young. Not many people throughout their entire lives have to make decisions of such magnitude let alone at such a young age.

With rookies especially, it is a rare occasion where I do not totally blame the agent. The difference between club & player are most likely going to be at most 15%. If you add onto that the automatic huge endorsements the player will get, it becomes even less. The amounts either way are retire-for-life type levels. A good agent....one who looks after his client...IMO, will see that set-for-life deal secured rather than encourage his charge to go for every cent he can. Too many times the player loses out through slow production due to a hold-out. One day, an unsigned star(i.e. Bush) will have some sort of freak accident while holding out and end up with nothing.

[C.Biscuit97]

If Ko Simpson was as good as Reggie Bush, he'd do the exact same thing.  NFL players, on average, have very short careers.  To make matters worse, unlike their MLB and NBA counterparts, their contracts are not guaranteed.  So when a player has an opportunity to max out on what he can get, he simply should.  All it takes is one blow to the knee to end his career. 

 

Comparing Bush to TO is simply not valid or fair.

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Yeah, I don't get this Bush bashing lately. He hasn't missed anytime yet and probably is using the media for some leverage. I will never bash any NFL player not under contract for trying to get the most possible money they can. Football is a violent sport and careers end in the blink of an eye. How many people will care about Bush if he blows out his knee and his career is ended? Probably not many fans and definitely not his team.

 

As for Simpson & Williams, I'm glad they are in as well. I think they definitely can have an impact on this team this year, especially Williams (who I think will be a better player than Tim Anderson). As for Simpson, in a year or two, he will be one of the steals of the draft.