Bush administration takes on the free press

[ch19079]

the safest country in the world would be the one where every citizen was continually monitored and watched to make sure noone was breaking the law.

 

the only problem is that, that would only result from the complete removal of freedom.

 

In a free society we are free, but we are not completly safe. That freedom comes at a price. The price is that the criminals can hide behind the same freedoms regualr citizens would fight and die to protect. Some people want to take some of those freedoms away so they can expose a few criminals and become "more safe". While others fight to keep those same freedoms in place, even if it means the criminals will have more places to hide.

 

If you keep giving up your freedoms, eventually you will have no freedoms left. What is the point of security if you are not free. Sounds more like a prison than a society.

[GG]

The basis of the argument is predicated on the assumption that if a young man chooses to follow a career in the Bush administration he's a defender of a megalomaniacal move to remove our basic rights, while if his dorm roommate chooses the altruistic life of a journalist, he's a defender of those rights.

 

Nice theory, if human nature didn't interfere with that basic premise. There's just as strong a possibility that journalists are a bunch of weasely, lying, greedy suck-ups, as the members of the administration.

 

Carry on.

[Wacka]

the safest country in the world would be the one where every citizen was continually monitored and watched to make sure noone was breaking the law.

 

the only problem is that, that would only result from the complete removal of freedom.

 

In a free society we are free, but we are not completly safe. That freedom comes at a price. The price is that the criminals can hide behind the same freedoms regualr citizens would fight and die to protect. Some people want to take some of those freedoms away so they can expose a few criminals and become "more safe". While others fight to keep those same freedoms in place, even if it means the criminals will have more places to hide.

 

If you keep giving up your freedoms, eventually you will have no freedoms left. What is the point of security if you are not free. Sounds more like a prison than a society.

714836[/snapback]

 

Did you know that for years (since at least the 80s)any transaction over10 K was reported to the government?

Did you know that you can't take more than 10K out of the country?

 

 

For years, the NY Slimes has been one of the lowest amoral members of the press.

If they had the same attitude during WWII, they would have blabbed anything they might have found out about the A-bomb program to the Germans and the Japanese. As it is, I wouldn't have put it past them to tell the Russians, but the USSR files show that it was the Rosenbergs.

[cromagnum]

Give me liberty or give me death.

 

live free or die.

 

Present day.. those above statements do not apply, they should be changed.

Let freedom ring somewhat.

 

Janice was right, freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose.

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

Give me liberty or give me death.

 

live free or die.

 

Present day.. those above statements do not apply, they should be changed.

Let freedom ring somewhat.

 

Janice was right, freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose.

714859[/snapback]

 

Nowadays it's:

 

"Give me liberty or give me American Idol!"

 

and

 

"Live free or...oooh, look, 24's on!"

[cromagnum]

Nowadays it's:

 

"Give me liberty or give me American Idol!"

 

and

 

"Live free or...oooh, look, 24's on!"

714863[/snapback]

That's funny. I have'nt watched either of those show's once, although I remember the she bang song, for some reason they played it on the news.

I watch quite a bit of the history channel, yet they have programs on ufo's, the secret weapons of germany and other art bell topics of interest. I gotta go back to reading book's

[GG]

I gotta go back to reading book's

714872[/snapback]

 

I would suggest starting with the grammar ones.

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

That's funny. I have'nt watched either of those show's once, although I remember the she bang song, for some reason they played it on the news.

I watch quite a bit of the history channel, yet they have programs on ufo's, the secret weapons of germany and other  art bell topics of interest. I gotta go back to reading book's

714872[/snapback]

 

The secret weapons of Germany episodes aren't entirely inaccurate...just a little sensationalized. Why they talk about UFO's, I have no idea.

[blzrul]

Nowadays it's:

 

"Give me liberty or give me American Idol!"

 

and

 

"Live free or...oooh, look, 24's on!"

714863[/snapback]

It IS amazing that people who can take the time to keep up with "Brangelina" and "Bennifer" and all that @#$@$ don't have time to read the world section of a newspaper....

[PastaJoe]

Ya know, I'm not even going to touch this.  If you cant be mature enough to get beyond "Bush = Bad" and have an intellegent comment on the merits of the discussion, I am sorry for you.

714547[/snapback]

 

Why bother going through a long discussion when in the end the facts boil down to how bad Bush has been for America. Everything he's done for the past couple of weeks has been about getting the conservative base energized to vote, including attacking the "liberal" press. Bush himself said shortly after 9/11 that the gov't was setting up a program to track terrorist finances. Quite a short memory there.

[Johnny Coli]

Great article in the Boston Globe this morning, outlining why all the bluster and shouts of treason coming from this Administration regarding the NYT story are just that, a lot of bluster and faux-anger.

Terrorist funds-tracking no secret

But a search of public records -- government documents posted on the Internet, congressional testimony, guidelines for bank examiners, and even an executive order President Bush signed in September 2001 -- describe how US authorities have openly sought new tools to track terrorist financing since 2001. That includes getting access to information about terrorist-linked wire transfers and other transactions, including those that travel through SWIFT.

 

``There have been public references to SWIFT before," said Roger Cressey, a senior White House counterterrorism official until 2003. ``The White House is overreaching when they say [The New York Times committed] a crime against the war on terror. It has been in the public domain before."

 

The article mentions an Executive Order signed by Bush in September 2001, authorizing the Treasury Department to track international funds. Here it is.

National Archives link to EOs for 2001

Executive Order 13224—Blocking Property and Prohibiting Transactions With Persons Who Commit, Threaten To Commit, or Support Terrorism [pdf]

Sec. 6. The Secretary of State, the Secretary of the Treasury, and other

appropriate agencies shall make all relevant efforts to cooperate and coordinate

with other countries, including through technical assistance, as well

as bilateral and multilateral agreements and arrangements, to achieve the

objectives of this order, including the prevention and suppression of acts

of terrorism, the denial of financing and financial services to terrorists and

terrorist organizations, and the sharing of intelligence about funding activities

in support of terrorism.

Sec. 7. The Secretary of the Treasury, in consultation with the Secretary

of State and the Attorney General, is hereby authorized to take such actions,

including the promulgation of rules and regulations, and to employ all

powers granted to the President by IEEPA and UNPA as may be necessary

to carry out the purposes of this order. The Secretary of the Treasury

may redelegate any of these functions to other officers and agencies of

the United States Government. All agencies of the United States Government

are hereby directed to take all appropriate measures within their authority

to carry out the provisions of this order.

 

One would think the terrorists would have figured this out anyway. From the Globe article:

"Unless they were pretty dumb, they had to assume" their transactions were being monitored, [Victor D.] Comras [former US diplomat who oversaw efforts at the United Nations to improve international measures to combat terror financing] said of terrorist groups. "We have spent the last four years bragging how effective we have been in tracking terrorist financing."

 

Indeed, a report that Comras co-authored in 2002 for the UN Security Council specifically mentioned SWIFT as a source of financial information that the United States had tapped into. The system, which handles trillions of dollars in worldwide transactions each day, serves as a main hub for banks and other financial institutions that move money around the world. According to The New York Times, SWIFT executives agreed to give the Treasury Department and the CIA broad access to its database.

 

Hell of a week for this Administration and the GOP "leadership." Flag-burning amendment sham, a pay raise, denying a minimum wage increase, voting against a resolution on discussing an Iraq withdrawl timeline, repealing taxes for the uber-wealthy, falsly demonize the press. Quite a productive use of their time.