C.Biscuit97 Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 The problem is that Americans do not watch the NHL. I know there are some regions that have a big fanbase, but if you look at the overall perception of the NHL, it does not seem as a sport that dominates in attendance and ratings. On the other hand, are baseball players tough athletes. I have seen baseball games where two players bump into each other and they make it look even worse than soccer players do. In the end, it does not matter. I would much rather the NHL gained popularity in the US than soccer. Soccer does fine without the US involvement and is not struggling to survive as the NHL is. Although capturing the US market for soccer would be a big accomplishment and would bring a lot more revenue. 706483[/snapback] You're right. Baseball players aren't known for their toughness. However, it's a sport (or pastime) that is ingrained in our country. As for hockey, I grew up playing the sport and love it. But when I watch the game with friends who didn't play and are causal sports fans, they have a hard time following along. It is a sport that you need to see in person to truly appreciate. Hopefully, it will catch on here because it is a great sport. As far as soccer goes, it just think it will never catch on here. Too many other sports and no scoring. Even the NHL and NBA change their rules to allow for more scoring. Perhaps, if soccer could find ways to do something to this affect, it will become more popular. That said, watching the World Cup, it does seem like the US is missing out on something.
ajzepp Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 In the end, it does not matter. I would much rather the NHL gained popularity in the US than soccer. Soccer does fine without the US involvement and is not struggling to survive as the NHL is. Although capturing the US market for soccer would be a big accomplishment and would bring a lot more revenue. 706483[/snapback] I agree....in fact, as much as I'm glad that the MLS is having success in terms of maintaining viability, a professional American soccer league is ALMOST irrelevant to me. I'm happy with it being a niche sport in this country, but with increasing access to the European league matches. Now that I have Fox Soccer Channel I feel much more connected to what's going on in the world of soccer, and being that that's where the best players are anyway, I'm good to go. I will always support the US national team first and foremost, but when it comes to club soccer I don't see them ever being anything more than a farm system for the Euro leagues. I love watching the best of the best, and when we develop a strong American player I just assume watch him do his thing in the Premiership anyway (or one of the other National leagues over there). My feelings would change quite a bit if the Rhinos ended up in the MLS, though, cause then I'd have a "home" team that I could root for. I watch the MLS games in HD from time to time, but I don't really have any strong attachment to any particular club. I'd much rather watch replays of old Man. U matches. So the bottom line is that while I don't really care how many people become fans of American professional soccer, I love to see people become more interested in soccer in general, cause the more interest there is, the greater the amt of programming available to watch
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 That actually really pisses me off, too. I'm okay with a little bit of acting here and there to try and get an advantage, but I saw that stretcher gimmick today by some kitty Swede and it was pathetic! The four little medic guys come in, carry him off while he's gyrating in apparent agony, then I hear the announcers talk about who is going to sub in for him. Like you said, the SECOND the guy got off the field, he was ready to go back in....wtf??? If I see any US players doing that I'm going to vomit.....have some friggin self respect for gosh sakes! I'm glad to hear that you're enjoying it so far, though. I was listening to them talk about some of the African teams that were in the cup, and how so many of them had fought through all the adversity of civil conflicts and such that were going on in their respective countries, and how many of them were hoping for peace back home at the same time they were trying to compete in the largest sporting event in the world. That is some serious sh--. I was also really interested hearing about how Trinidad and Tobago was the smallest country to EVER qualify for the World Cup, and how they had such a strong fan base who came to support them even though nobody had any expectations of winning. I love stuff like that. 706496[/snapback] Yeah, I just can't stand that. I mean I understand if someone hits you the wrong way in the back of the leg, you could get seriously hurt. But these guys take it to another level. As a fan of the Bills, who is probably the most respected Bill? Jim Kelly because he played through pain. And the World Cup is such an amazing event. I mean just because it isn't big here doesn't mean you can't appreciate it. To most every country but here, this is their Super Bowl. And you're dead on about some of these poorer countries qualifying. How can you not feel good about some of their citizens forgetting their problems for a little while and becoming united rooting for their team. That is effing beautiful. Personally, since the World Cup is so big, the US get all of the athletes from our "major" sports and just dominate one time. You're telling me if we rolled out Kobe Bryant and Brian Urlacher (with proper training) out there, we wouldn't dominate?
ajzepp Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 Yeah, I just can't stand that. I mean I understand if someone hits you the wrong way in the back of the leg, you could get seriously hurt. But these guys take it to another level. As a fan of the Bills, who is probably the most respected Bill? Jim Kelly because he played through pain. And the World Cup is such an amazing event. I mean just because it isn't big here doesn't mean you can't appreciate it. To most every country but here, this is their Super Bowl. And you're dead on about some of these poorer countries qualifying. How can you not feel good about some of their citizens forgetting their problems for a little while and becoming united rooting for their team. That is effing beautiful. Personally, since the World Cup is so big, the US get all of the athletes from our "major" sports and just dominate one time. You're telling me if we rolled out Kobe Bryant and Brian Urlacher (with proper training) out there, we wouldn't dominate? 706505[/snapback] Yep, I agree. If I had a son who was talented in both soccer and baseball, it would not be a hard decision for me to sort of "ease" him in one direction over the other. I'd much rather see him end up in baseball earning millions and being a huge fan of soccer than to be squeaking by in the MLS and love watching baseball. That's definitely a valid point, and it only further ensures that pro soccer will never be on par with the other major league sports we have here. That's why it's the best of both worlds, cause it won't have any impact on the fact that there are great players in other countries. And yep, it's really heart-warming to hear the stories about the other countries. I forget who it was, but one of Pele's former teammates was interviewed today. He said that back in the day he and Pele were playing a match against the Nigerians while there was civil war going on in that country. He said that the war was literally put on hold for THREE DAYS just so that the people could come and watch Pele play soccer. Now THAT is some sh--! I think it's easy for a lot of people to just dismiss soccer because of it's lack of support in this country. But I can't help but want to always remember how fortunate we are to be Americans, and to always be empathetic to those in other countries who are less fortunate. I didn't know a damn thing about Trinidad and Tobago before today....but now I find myself rooting for them to win their next game, cause I'd love to see all those fans who traveled to Germany to support their team have something to cheer about
meazza Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 You're right. Baseball players aren't known for their toughness. However, it's a sport (or pastime) that is ingrained in our country. As for hockey, I grew up playing the sport and love it. But when I watch the game with friends who didn't play and are causal sports fans, they have a hard time following along. It is a sport that you need to see in person to truly appreciate. Hopefully, it will catch on here because it is a great sport. As far as soccer goes, it just think it will never catch on here. Too many other sports and no scoring. Even the NHL and NBA change their rules to allow for more scoring. Perhaps, if soccer could find ways to do something to this affect, it will become more popular. That said, watching the World Cup, it does seem like the US is missing out on something. 706501[/snapback] That is what i am trying to say. They do not have to change the rules. They still are extremely profitable. Sort of like Formula 1. They tried to cater to the Americans by having an F1 in Indy ( Dont know if it still is in Indianapolis), they changed the rules to attract more fans, but in the end, they still pull in massive amounts of profits without these fans. Same goes with soccer. Most soccer fans do not complain about the low scoring. I dont. If Fifa were to change the rules to attract more North American fans, it would ruin the game. I understand if they are losing money and desperately need new fans, but they dont. Hockey had no choice. They were only getting big contracts from a few sports markets in the states and definately cannot survive on just Canadian interest.
meazza Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 And yep, it's really heart-warming to hear the stories about the other countries. I forget who it was, but one of Pele's former teammates was interviewed today. He said that back in the day he and Pele were playing a match against the Nigerians while there was civil war going on in that country. He said that the war was literally put on hold for THREE DAYS just so that the people could come and watch Pele play soccer. Now THAT is some sh--! I think it's easy for a lot of people to just dismiss soccer because of it's lack of support in this country. But I can't help but want to always remember how fortunate we are to be Americans, and to always be empathetic to those in other countries who are less fortunate. I didn't know a damn thing about Trinidad and Tobago before today....but now I find myself rooting for them to win their next game, cause I'd love to see all those fans who traveled to Germany to support their team have something to cheer about 706509[/snapback] Ha, Trinidad. A friend of mine from school is a foreign student from Trinidad and Tobago, but he is wealthy. Takes like 3-4 vacations per year and never worked a day in his life. They remind me of Senegal from 2002.
ajzepp Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 Same goes with soccer. Most soccer fans do not complain about the low scoring. I dont. If Fifa were to change the rules to attract more North American fans, it would ruin the game. 706510[/snapback] Yep, the lack of scoring can lend itself to criticism on paper, but most people who really love the game aren't bothered by it. I've said a few times on here that, to me, a near-goal can be every bit as exciting as an actual goal....a great save can be electrifying. The only thing I get sick of is what C. Biscuit pointed out....the dives and the acting. I wanted to kick that swede in the nuts today for making a mockery of himself like that today. I'd rather see a team win on talent and playmaking ability as opposed to having to pussify himself in order to get a cheap call.
meazza Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 Yep, the lack of scoring can lend itself to criticism on paper, but most people who really love the game aren't bothered by it. I've said a few times on here that, to me, a near-goal can be every bit as exciting as an actual goal....a great save can be electrifying. The only thing I get sick of is what C. Biscuit pointed out....the dives and the acting. I wanted to kick that swede in the nuts today for making a mockery of himself like that today. I'd rather see a team win on talent and playmaking ability as opposed to having to pussify himself in order to get a cheap call. 706514[/snapback] I agree, but it is a part of the game. The only way they can make it change is if they penalize it more, (they already give yellow cards for it). Please do not be upset if you see Totti whining and falling, it is his speciality
ajzepp Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 I agree, but it is a part of the game. The only way they can make it change is if they penalize it more, (they already give yellow cards for it). Please do not be upset if you see Totti whining and falling, it is his speciality 706515[/snapback] lol, yeah, it does seem like it happens every match. Thankfully today was the first time in a long time that I remember something as ridiculous as that one guy, though....Totti isn't THAT pathetic, is he? lol
meazza Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 lol, yeah, it does seem like it happens every match. Thankfully today was the first time in a long time that I remember something as ridiculous as that one guy, though....Totti isn't THAT pathetic, is he? lol 706517[/snapback] Italians are known for being divers.
ajzepp Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 Italians are known for being divers. 706521[/snapback] lmao....well, at least I've been warned
Alaska Darin Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 Yep, the lack of scoring can lend itself to criticism on paper, but most people who really love the game aren't bothered by it. I've said a few times on here that, to me, a near-goal can be every bit as exciting as an actual goal....a great save can be electrifying. The only thing I get sick of is what C. Biscuit pointed out....the dives and the acting. I wanted to kick that swede in the nuts today for making a mockery of himself like that today. I'd rather see a team win on talent and playmaking ability as opposed to having to pussify himself in order to get a cheap call. 706514[/snapback] The reason the diving and whining is so prevalent has everything to do with the lack of scoring. Just food for thought.
ajzepp Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 The reason the diving and whining is so prevalent has everything to do with the lack of scoring. Just food for thought. 706526[/snapback] I agree, but I think I'd qualify that a little more. Goals in soccer are, typically, very challenging. You have your occasional "own goal" and things break down that allow "easy" goals, but for the most part you've really got to work your arse off to score. I can accept the justification for the diving and whining as being an effort to gain an advantage in this endeavor.....but I still don't like it. I'm also not entirely convinced that getting away with the bull sh-- really offers any sort of tangible advantage anyway, which basically just makes it all the more annoying. But yeah, that's the one part of the game that really bugs me.
kegtapr Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 lol, yeah, it does seem like it happens every match. Thankfully today was the first time in a long time that I remember something as ridiculous as that one guy, though....Totti isn't THAT pathetic, is he? lol 706517[/snapback] One guy from Paraguay tried to pull that crap like 4 times today. Never took it to the stretcher extreme but he was trying his best for a card. That part of the sport pisses me off. Too many whiney bitches. High school athletes are tougher than those guys. The only guy ever taken of the field on my HS team had internal bleeding and a busted spleen. Had to be airlifted to Strong and walked with a cane for like 6 months after. He tried to get back up and play too before falling to the ground.
meazza Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 I agree, but I think I'd qualify that a little more. Goals in soccer are, typically, very challenging. You have your occasional "own goal" and things break down that allow "easy" goals, but for the most part you've really got to work your arse off to score. I can accept the justification for the diving and whining as being an effort to gain an advantage in this endeavor.....but I still don't like it. I'm also not entirely convinced that getting away with the bull sh-- really offers any sort of tangible advantage anyway, which basically just makes it all the more annoying. But yeah, that's the one part of the game that really bugs me. 706530[/snapback] One thing you have to look at is the amount of frustration a player may have which leads to a dive. A common strategy in soccer, especially in the tougher leagues is to foul the superstar. Frustrate the guy to the point that he goes off his game. That is what happened to Totti in the Euro. The Danish player kept cracking him everytime he even looked at the ball and at one point lost it and spit at the player. By doing this Denmark took out Italys best player and managed to get a favourable result. I do not use this as an excuse though. Maradona was the most fouled player in soccer history and yet he managed to do just fine.
meazza Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 One guy from Paraguay tried to pull that crap like 4 times today. Never took it to the stretcher extreme but he was trying his best for a card. That part of the sport pisses me off. Too many whiney bitches. High school athletes are tougher than those guys. The only guy ever taken of the field on my HS team had internal bleeding and a busted spleen. Had to be airlifted to Strong and walked with a cane for like 6 months after. He tried to get back up and play too before falling to the ground. 706531[/snapback] One thing you have to realize is that, even if they are whining in pain, often they do play in pain. They just try to bring out the foul to get themselves an advantage. It does not mean that these players are not playing injured already. Most of the time they are. It is just the mentality. If a player gets tackled in the NFL, it does not change the outcome if he is crying in pain or not showing any pain at all. It does in soccer and that is why they do it. One thing though, referees remember this and sometimes do not award fouls to players who constantly dive.
kegtapr Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 One thing you have to realize is that, even if they are whining in pain, often they do play in pain. They just try to bring out the foul to get themselves an advantage. It does not mean that these players are not playing injured already. Most of the time they are. It is just the mentality. If a player gets tackled in the NFL, it does not change the outcome if he is crying in pain or not showing any pain at all. It does in soccer and that is why they do it. One thing though, referees remember this and sometimes do not award fouls to players who constantly dive. 706533[/snapback] I know they play in pain, I played in pain many times. I never thought to be a drama queen and go for an advantage though. It's become too prevelant in the game.
meazza Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 I know they play in pain, I played in pain many times. I never thought to be a drama queen and go for an advantage though. It's become too prevelant in the game. 706537[/snapback] I agree. It shouldn't be that way. Probably will never change though.
ajzepp Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 One guy from Paraguay tried to pull that crap like 4 times today. Never took it to the stretcher extreme but he was trying his best for a card. That part of the sport pisses me off. Too many whiney bitches. High school athletes are tougher than those guys. The only guy ever taken of the field on my HS team had internal bleeding and a busted spleen. Had to be airlifted to Strong and walked with a cane for like 6 months after. He tried to get back up and play too before falling to the ground. 706531[/snapback] I know what you mean. I used to play indoor soccer and we got scuffed up every game. Not one of us ever even though about coming off the field or whining about the cuts and bruises. It took a buddy of mine - and our top scorer - to basically have his leg snapped in two before anyone ever complained, and considering the severity of his injury he still took it like a man. Soccer isn't hockey or football obviously, but it's a lot more physical than people realize....but these fuggers who B word and whine don't really contribute to garnering any more respect for that aspect of the game.
ajzepp Posted June 11, 2006 Posted June 11, 2006 One thing you have to realize is that, even if they are whining in pain, often they do play in pain. They just try to bring out the foul to get themselves an advantage. It does not mean that these players are not playing injured already. Most of the time they are. It is just the mentality. If a player gets tackled in the NFL, it does not change the outcome if he is crying in pain or not showing any pain at all. It does in soccer and that is why they do it. One thing though, referees remember this and sometimes do not award fouls to players who constantly dive. 706533[/snapback] I think it's somewhat analogous to a WR in the NFL who tries to get a flag when there was no pass interference. It's just that in the NFL it's not nearly as pathetic.
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