RuntheDamnBall Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 a good discussion on this on the Brian Lehrer show on WNYC with Jean Rohe. He's generally pretty evenhanded with his interviews. It was at the end of the show and I don't see it up on their site as a podcast yet, but it should be soon. Brian Lehrer show Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNRed Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 also, come on and be original. I read that one too. 695719[/snapback] Never seen that website but it rings true. I can't think of one instance where a folk song is a good thing. A folk song? Really? What year is it? And if there's nothing to be afraid of, why are the new school students so afraid of John McCain that they don't even want to hear him speak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 McCain is one of the most disingenuous scumbags in all of national politics. It's made even worse by the fact that all of his political capital was built upon this straight talk and maverick garbage, when he is one of the most weasally and conniving players out there. And this isn't just an outsider observation. I lived in Phoenix for 11 years, and know many people who have worked both for him (even they say he is a total ass) and against him (being screwed over by his me-first decisions not good for his constituents but to make himself look good or take credit). He is a bad guy, and one of the biggest liars around, despite his heroics and bravery 40 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 Never seen that website but it rings true. I can't think of one instance where a folk song is a good thing. A folk song? Really? What year is it? And if there's nothing to be afraid of, why are the new school students so afraid of John McCain that they don't even want to hear him speak? 695763[/snapback] 1) The student has been associated with folk music most of her life and she sings in clubs around the city frequently. She just graduated from Mannes College of Music at the New School. To each his own. Lots of people do like folk music. And there was a time when it was really a way for people to speak the truth to power. Woody Guthrie, Pete Seeger, many lesser known figures, all of them were voices of the people. Sorry it doesn't suit fashion. Thought you were against the American Idol-ization of America. I guess some culture is preferable to other forms. 2) What did McCain have to say that he hadn't already said at two other college graduations? What in his empty rhetoric and mediocre electioneering was of substance? I have to side with the student here. 3) I don't think New School students were afraid to hear McCain speak. They were making it plain that he doesn't speak for them. That's all. He had a good opportunity to prove what kind of maverick he is and to stray from his script to deliver something of substance. He didn't. 4) Some NSU students were out of line. 5) I'm guessing that when Russ Feingold gets invited to deliver Bob Jones U's commencement address, he's going to be showered with polite applause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 actual link to Rohe interview podcast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNRed Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 1) The student has been associated with folk music most of her life and she sings in clubs around the city frequently. She just graduated from Mannes College of Music at the New School. To each his own. Lots of people do like folk music. And there was a time when it was really a way for people to speak the truth to power. Woody Guthrie, Pete Seeger, many lesser known figures, all of them were voices of the people. Sorry it doesn't suit fashion. Thought you were against the American Idol-ization of America. I guess some culture is preferable to other forms. 695770[/snapback] I won't even pretend to like anything about folk music. It's lame. As for American Idol, I actually like the concept. We should be allowed to vote and select our celebrities. Celebrities have a way of showing up and then taking over our TV set for years at a time. If I have to spend years hearing about someone, I want a say in who that is. If we voted for all our celebrities, we wouldn't have to see Paris Hilton's ugly face on TV 24 hours a day. And what a world that would be. 2) What did McCain have to say that he hadn't already said at two other college graduations? What in his empty rhetoric and mediocre electioneering was of substance? I have to side with the student here.Don't know. But it's about respect for people. Not silencing them before you even hear what they say. He's a politician. He's going to say a bunch of empty crap. Just put up with it. It's not a green light to act like a child. 3) I don't think New School students were afraid to hear McCain speak. They were making it plain that he doesn't speak for them. That's all. He had a good opportunity to prove what kind of maverick he is and to stray from his script to deliver something of substance. He didn't.Why would anyone assume the commencement speaker speaks for them. He speaks to them. I had no idea that the person talking to you automatically is speaking for you. Does this mean I am speaking for you right now and you were speaking for me in the previous post? 4) Some NSU students were out of line.The ones acting like little kids were. Same goes for the faculty. Grow up. 5) I'm guessing that when Russ Feingold gets invited to deliver Bob Jones U's commencement address, he's going to be showered with polite applause.Bad behavior is bad behavior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 I won't even pretend to like anything about folk music. It's lame. As for American Idol, I actually like the concept. We should be allowed to vote and select our celebrities. Celebrities have a way of showing up and then taking over our TV set for years at a time. If I have to spend years hearing about someone, I want a say in who that is. If we voted for all our celebrities, we wouldn't have to see Paris Hilton's ugly face on TV 24 hours a day. And what a world that would be. 695837[/snapback] Your interpretation of folk music as lame doesn't have much to do with the fact that this music student was invited by her student body to sing and speak. And your implied interpretation of folk music as simply the hippie garbage of the 60s is pretty narrow. Without folk musics, we wouldn't have some of the finest classical music ever written. But dude, I know, it's lame compared to meaningful art like the new Brand New record or something. Don't know. But it's about respect for people. Not silencing them before you even hear what they say. He's a politician. He's going to say a bunch of empty crap. Just put up with it. It's not a green light to act like a child. 695837[/snapback] I offered that some NSU students (particularly the one who called Pres. Kerrey a war criminal) were out of line. Regardless, politicians in general, and McCain here in particular, show little respect for their audiences by talking to them like children (as I said, many there were PhD and Master's candidates), by bringing up his Iraq war vote (this has what to do with graduation?) and by bringing a canned speech, the contents of which were available on his website days prior. What does that say for what he thinks of his audience that he can't tailor some meaningful words for them when paid to do so, when he expects their vote in two years? Why would anyone assume the commencement speaker speaks for them. He speaks to them. I had no idea that the person talking to you automatically is speaking for you. Does this mean I am speaking for you right now and you were speaking for me in the previous post? 695837[/snapback] I didn't hire you to speak to me. I didn't spend years of private school money to have the culmination of my work honored with a political appearance. Ask the students there. Students at Liberty wouldn't have appreciated Clinton, or Hillary for that matter, coming to talk to them. I guarantee it. The ones acting like little kids were. Same goes for the faculty. Grow up.Bad behavior is bad behavior. 695837[/snapback] My point was, someone like McCain is about as polarizing a figure that gets invited to Liberty or BJU. Not the case here. McCain had the chance at the New School to silence the protests, and make the rudest protestors appear particularly foolish, by offering something of substance, some straight talk, something that says he isn't just someone making power plays left and right. Again, he didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 "McCain, a conservative Republican" This is all the farther I have to read to know this article is complete horseshit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 "McCain, a conservative Republican" This is all the farther I have to read to know this article is complete horseshit. 695887[/snapback] What issues is he not conservative enough on? Abortion? the war? Gun control? Gay marriage? I'm curious here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 What issues is he not conservative enough on? Abortion? the war? Gun control? Gay marriage? I'm curious here. 695889[/snapback] He's no fiscal conservative, and last I checked he wasn't exactly with the right on gay marraige either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 He's no fiscal conservative, and last I checked he wasn't exactly with the right on gay marraige either. 695893[/snapback] You need to look no further than the President, the number one representative of McCain's party, to see that fiscal conservativism on the part of the Republicans is dead. *Note to you know who, yes, I know, the other side sucks pretty much just as much* As for the latter issue, if McCain's not with the right on gay marriage, it's only because their new position strays from another core Republican principle, that of states' rights: "The constitutional amendment we're debating today strikes me as antithetical in every way to the core philosophy of Republicans," McCain said. "It usurps from the states a fundamental authority they have always possessed and imposes a federal remedy for a problem that most states do not believe confronts them."... But McCain argued on the Senate floor that there are "far less draconian" remedies, including the 1996 Defense of Marriage Act -- which defined marriage for purposes of federal law as a union between a man and a woman and allowed states to refuse to recognize same-sex marriages legally performed in other states -- and state constitutional amendments limiting marriage to heterosexual couples. He said if the U.S. Supreme Court strikes down the Defense of Marriage Act or "state remedies to judicial activism fail," then amending the federal Constitution might be "appropriate." It sounds like a policy difference and not one rooted in moral advocacy for gay marriage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNRed Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 Your interpretation of folk music as lame doesn't have much to do with the fact that this music student was invited by her student body to sing and speak. And your implied interpretation of folk music as simply the hippie garbage of the 60s is pretty narrow. Without folk musics, we wouldn't have some of the finest classical music ever written. But dude, I know, it's lame compared to meaningful art like the new Brand New record or something. 695856[/snapback] Do you know anything about Brand New? It'd be cool if you did. They're still a fairly obscure band so it's not often you meet people who know they exist. It's more likely you just know them from my signatures and assume they aren't all that great because the band members are in their 20's. I would consider their last album meaningful, dude. And, yeah, I know folk songs can be songs passed down from generation to generation but that doesn't mean I want to listen to that all the time any more than I want to listen to the hippie drivel version (which apparently was my "implied interpretation" although I had no idea). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 Do you know anything about Brand New? It'd be cool if you did. They're still a fairly obscure band so it's not often you meet people who know they exist. It's more likely you just know them from my signatures and assume they aren't all that great because the band members are in their 20's. I would consider their last album meaningful, dude. And, yeah, I know folk songs can be songs passed down from generation to generation but that doesn't mean I want to listen to that all the time any more than I want to listen to the hippie drivel version (which apparently was my "implied interpretation" although I had no idea). 695928[/snapback] No? What's this mean? A folk song? Really? What year is it? BTW, I'm in my 20s and play in bands and I've pretty much devoted my life to music, so yes, I do know of Brand New and they're fine. I don't really listen to them as I'm kind of burned out on the punk/emo thing that I thought got most interesting with groups like Fugazi and At the Drive In. And I don't think punk provokes like it used to -- J. Coli might disagree, dunno. There were some really wild people making that music back in the day. Now it's all so introverted and self-reflexive and it just doesn't speak to anything larger for me. Music can mean a lot of different things to different people and I didn't mean to pick on your boys. I'm glad you've found some music that means something for you. Honest. On the other hand, I'm just trying to impart that folk music isn't all "We Shall Overcome" and "John Henry"; it's also full of bloody tales of weird people and weirder times (for a good survey of this, the American Anthology of Folk Music, compiled by Harry Smith, and The Old Weird America, by Greil Marcus, are a great window in). Folk and blues were once inextricably linked before they faded into the polished sheen and hokum we know them for today. I'm just saying, history, my friend, is good, in music as in everything. I like getting to know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNRed Posted May 22, 2006 Share Posted May 22, 2006 BTW, I'm in my 20s and play in bands and I've pretty much devoted my life to music, so yes, I do know of Brand New and they're fine. I don't really listen to them as I'm kind of burned out on the punk/emo thing that I thought got most interesting with groups like Fugazi and At the Drive In. And I don't think punk provokes like it used to -- J. Coli might disagree, dunno. There were some really wild people making that music back in the day. Now it's all so introverted and self-reflexive and it just doesn't speak to anything larger for me. Music can mean a lot of different things to different people and I didn't mean to pick on your boys. I'm glad you've found some music that means something for you. Honest.695940[/snapback] I don't think they're punk or emo, not anymore anyway. Their first album was pop punk but it was probably the best pop punk I've ever heard so after doing everything they could with that genre, they left it behind. The second album, Deja Entendu, I can't even put in a category. And the leaked demoes and live songs from their next album indicate they're still getting better. Emo may be the worst genre in music. The success rate in that genre is comparable to rap - very few bands/people stick out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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