Scout's Inc. Chat

[Rico]

Link

 

Erik (NH): Hey, Keith. Who are the top-10 guys you expect to be cut in June?

 

Keith Kidd: There are no guarantees, these are all possibilities only!!....Troy Vincent, Robaire Smith, Seth Payne, Peter Sirmon, Travis Henry, Duce Staley, Danny Clark, Dan Wilkinson, Charles Rogers, David Patten, Adrian Klemm, Dwight Smith, Jeremy Newberry.

 

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I agree with him about Vincent, as I've said before, there are too many younger veteran DBs (let alone the rookies) on this roster with far more upside... may not be June, but I think he's gone before Week 1.

 

And it's a longer shot, but I wouldn't be surprised to see TH the Prodigal Son return to the Bills, especially if no one else wants him and he has no other options. If frickin' Peerless Price can come back, anything is possible. TH has the football character that Marv is looking for (see 2003)... if he can finally come to terms with Willis being #1, I'd rather see TH here than the A-Train.

[a player to be named later]

I wouldn't mind TH back, but.. There hasn't been enough turnover since he left. Too much is still the same... Plus, I can't believe with his age and his history that he will reserve himself to a back up role.

 

If T Hen gets cut look for him to sign with Indy or a team without a RB. Basically anywhere he has a shot at being number one.

 

Willis is our number one. No reason to bring disruption to a position. Competition is good no doubt, but Travis would be more a disruption than competition.

 

Thats all from me on a Friday night...

[Pyrite Gal]

Link

 

Erik (NH): Hey, Keith. Who are the top-10 guys you expect to be cut in June?

 

Keith Kidd: There are no guarantees, these are all possibilities only!!....Troy Vincent, Robaire Smith, Seth Payne, Peter Sirmon, Travis Henry, Duce Staley, Danny Clark, Dan Wilkinson, Charles Rogers, David Patten, Adrian Klemm, Dwight Smith, Jeremy Newberry.

 

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I agree with him about Vincent, as I've said before, there are too many younger veteran DBs (let alone the rookies) on this roster with far more upside... may not be June, but I think he's gone before Week 1.

 

And it's a longer shot, but I wouldn't be surprised to see TH the Prodigal Son return to the Bills, especially if no one else wants him and he has no other options. If frickin' Peerless Price can come back, anything is possible. TH has the football character that Marv is looking for (see 2003)... if he can finally come to terms with Willis being #1, I'd rather see TH here than the A-Train.

690524[/snapback]

 

I say again that cutting Vincent makes sense if he suddenly hits the wall and cannot produce as happens with older players. However, as he tied for the lead on this team for both INTs and FRs, what are these signs of less production than the other DBs or safeties in particular that folks see beyond the demographic umver of his age.

 

I think the "experts" at Scouts Inc make the same mistake in looking at team building that a lot of people made in judging that the WM draft made no sense because the Bills had former Pro Bowler TH on the roster.

 

Just as having TH to man starting RB duty in the year that WM could not play while rehabbing a major knee injury was essential to having the WM pick make sense, so too does the young retinue of talent the Bills have at DB also increase the value of hanging onto TV as long as his body allows.

 

Particularly with Yobouty where the thought is he should have stayed in school another year, because he is a first round talent with a 3rd round brain who needs a year of training and teaching before he is ready to start. Learning how to be a pro, a teammate and a high chatacter guy from Vincent and former DB turned HC Jauron stikes me as a far better learning opportunity than another year in college.

 

Likewise Simpson and Whitner will benefit from having him around if his body allows for similar production to last year.

 

Beyond this teaching point, the switch from the zone blitz to the cover-2 really plays towards TV's skills. His expertise which won him Pro Bowl berths was as a SB cover guy. In our old zone blitz we employed both of our safeties as hitters as they pinched up on the line.

 

Yhe Cover 2 not only emphasizes pass coverage by the safeties playing centerfielder rather than them playing psuedo-LBs in the zone blitz, in addition, experience will be key as the safeties must read whether the play is a likely pass or a likely run based on down distance and formation.

 

TV certainly has lost a step or two from his youth as we all do. However, if we play more of a Tampa 2 which Fenell is familiar with rather than a classic Cover 2, the field will be divided into 1/3s for the sateties and MLN to cover and thus lessening the need for a bunch of speed if the field were divided in halves.

 

TV could well be cut if the Bills are into retribution and want to get the NFLPA Pres, but such a decision will likely be at a cost to the team as we have to go down the deoth chart in a seatch for a starting FS.

[/dev/null]

And it's a longer shot, but I wouldn't be surprised to see TH the Prodigal Son return to the Bills

690524[/snapback]

 

no way TH comes back to the Bills. He grew up a Bills fan and busted his balls for this team only to see them stab him in the back

 

Ralph and Marv could beg TH to return to Buffalo or Meazza could even try to bribe him with 14 year old girls, but the only way TH will ever want to come back to Buffalo is in an opposing uniform

[Dan Gross]

I wouldn't mind TH back, but.. There hasn't been enough turnover since he left. 

690540[/snapback]

 

Heh, nice pun. Unless you meant to say there haven't been enough turnovers since he left...

[Nanker]

Yeah. Let's get Travis back and groom him to take over when Willis and his Agent book a flight out of here next year.

[UConn James]

Particularly with Yobouty where the thought is he should have stayed in school another year, because he is a first round talent with a 3rd round brain who needs a year of training and teaching before he is ready to start.  Learning how to be a  pro, a teammate and a high chatacter guy from Vincent and former DB turned HC Jauron stikes me as a far better learning opportunity than another year in college.

690567[/snapback]

 

You've got the startings of a good point there. But I don't think AY's grooming depends upon Troy Vincent. Also, another year in college most anywhere else would be negligible in terms of development, but it was at Ohio State, which has become DB U. I was pleased with this pick.

 

Yeah. Let's get Travis back and groom him to take over when Willis and his Agent book a flight out of here next year.

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There was no <sarcasm> tag in your post, so I'm just going to ask.... You do know that the average shelf-life of a RB is less than 2 years, don't you? And it's an area where you can put a young player in and they'll do all right. If Willis bolts, we grab a power-rusher in the 2nd.

[Nanker]

You've got the startings of a good point there. But I don't think AY's grooming depends upon Troy Vincent. Also, another year in college most anywhere else would be negligible in terms of development, but it was at Ohio State, which has become DB U. I was pleased with this pick.

There was no <sarcasm> tag in your post, so I'm just going to ask.... You do know that the average shelf-life of a RB is less than 2 years, don't you? And it's an area where you can put a young player in and they'll do all right. If Willis bolts, we grab a power-rusher in the 2nd.

690632[/snapback]

 

[sARCASM]... [/sARCASM]

 

Omitted yes, but implied/intended - absolutely!

Agreed - It's hard to imagine we couldn't find a better pick for our purposes than TH in next year's draft should WM change uniforms.

[BobbyC81]

Link

 

 

And it's a longer shot, but I wouldn't be surprised to see TH the Prodigal Son return to the Bills, especially if no one else wants him and he has no other options. If frickin' Peerless Price can come back, anything is possible. TH has the football character that Marv is looking for (see 2003)... if he can finally come to terms with Willis being #1, I'd rather see TH here than the A-Train.

690524[/snapback]

 

 

I think it's very unlikely TH would return. The GM and coaching staff may have changed but McGahee is still here He was upset because they brought McGahee in and considered it a slap in the face. Why would he want to return to the same situation??

 

And, how can you call TH a charcter guy??

[C.Biscuit97]

Personally, I want Vincent back. We all know he is a class act. Additionally, we have a very young secondary. Vincent is a known leader and could do a lot to help these young guys develop (see McGee for instance). Plus, a Cover 2 plays into Vincent's strengths of coming over the top and ballhawking.

[Nanker]

Personally, I want Vincent back.  We all know he is a class act.  Additionally, we have a very young secondary.  Vincent is a known leader and could do a lot to help these young guys develop (see McGee for instance).  Plus, a Cover 2 plays into Vincent's strengths of coming over the top and ballhawking.

690751[/snapback]

 

I agree that he's a nice guy and has a lot of good to give to others. I'd like to seem him back as a coach. Father Time might have robbed him of his playing days though. He's got big ties to his home town near Philly, so the Iggles might be his first choice if it comes to that.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

Cutting Vincent only saves $490K, which isn't worth it, unless they need his roster spot for one of the younger guys they can't let potentially get away.

[KOKBILLS]

Cutting Vincent only saves $490K, which isn't worth it, unless they need his roster spot for one of the younger guys they can't let potentially get away.

691022[/snapback]

 

Exactly...

 

And I don't think keeping Troy is going result in anyone better getting Cut at this point...We'll see...But obviously Whitner and Simpson are safe...

[MadBuffaloDisease]

Exactly...

 

And I don't think keeping Troy is going result in anyone better getting Cut at this point...We'll see...But obviously Whitner and Simpson are safe...

I'd say Whitner, Simpson, Baker, and Bowen are safe. I think they keep 1 more safety.

[Rico]

Cutting Vincent only saves $490K, which isn't worth it, unless they need his roster spot for one of the younger guys they can't let potentially get away.

691022[/snapback]

Exactly... I think before the draft, he was safe. Now, he may get caught up in numbers... I've got no true agenda against him (other than his horrible arm-tackling last year )... there's just too many young players back there that I'd hate to see go just to keep him around for another year, a rebuilding year at that.

 

I'd say Whitner, Simpson, Baker, and Bowen are safe. I think they keep 1 more safety

Agreed with the bold. I think Bowen and Wire are fighting for 1 spot. I don't know if Baker is safe yet for sure, but I do think you've nailed the pecking order for making the team.

 

Looking at the entire unit, I think McGee, Clements, and Youboty are also safe... and I'd hate to see either King or Greer go just yet... others have maligned them, but I think they both have potential...

that's a lot of DBs ahead of TV IMO, maybe he can contribute on ST.

[The Dean]

no way TH comes back to the Bills.  He grew up a Bills fan and busted his balls for this team only to see them stab him in the back

 

Ralph and Marv could beg TH to return to Buffalo or Meazza could even try to bribe him with 14 year old girls, but the only way TH will ever want to come back to Buffalo is in an opposing uniform

690569[/snapback]

 

 

I really liked TH, but i don't see how the Bills "stab[bed] him in the back". What am I missing?

 

What they did to Cribbs was far worse, IMO.

[C.Biscuit97]

I really liked TH, but i don't see how the Bills "stab[bed] him in the back".  What am I missing?

 

What they did to Cribbs was far worse, IMO.

691169[/snapback]

 

TH was coming off a 1,300 yard season and was the MVP of our offense. So how do the Bills reward him? They draft his replacement with a 1st round pick. Seems pretty harsh to me. It seems that TD could have used the pick on something to actually help a playoff caliber team. Obviously, if Willis becomes the back we all believe he can be, then it will be a good pick. Right now, it looks like another one of TD's questionable moves.

 

Just curious, what did the Bills do to Cribbs?

[Bill from NYC]

TH was coming off a 1,300 yard season and was the MVP of our offense.  So how do the Bills reward him?  They draft his replacement with a 1st round pick.   Seems pretty harsh to me.  It seems that TD could have used the pick on something to actually help a playoff caliber team.  Obviously, if Willis becomes the back we all believe he can be, then it will be a good pick.  Right now, it looks like another one of TD's questionable moves.

 

Just curious, what did the Bills do to Cribbs?

691248[/snapback]

 

You are forgetting that Travis was a fumbling, bumbling literal idiot with a drug problem to boot.

This is not to say that I was in support of selecting MaGahee. I wanted Steinbach to play LG in that draft. No such luck.

 

Travis was a the back in a "Run and Shoot" offense, with no blocking.

On almost every play, opposing defenses let loose with an all out rush on our helpless quarterbacks. They were smart to do so, because they were ever so frequently successful at blowing past our inept line and sacking said QBs.

When handed the football, Travis had the luxury of rushing past deffenders who literally were running past him. That said, Travis was a good slashing runner (although he lacked breakaway speed) and was able to make some decent gains, although they were frequently negated by his fumbles; along with his inability to block, run correct pass routes, or probably even spell his name.

 

The fact that this idiot is listed as a possible cut surprises me little. His drug problem, child sex antics, and propensity to coughing up the football to opponents of the Buffalo Bills made him a liability to our football team, let alone society. Do you think that the Titans are glad that they coughed up a 3rd round pick for this miscreant?

 

As for this jackass being "screwed" by the Bills, I am guessing that nobody at 1BD asked him to squander away his money. He asked to renegotiate his contract. He probably needed more money to purchase narcotics.

He screwed himself.

The only ones screwed imo were the Titans, who were dumb enough to give away a good pick for this loser.

One must give TD a ton of credit for this swindle.

[scribo]

Troy absoultely must remain with the Bills for at least one more year. Thin about it: The Bills just drafted practically a whole new secondary. How many vets are on that secondary? Well, Lawyer is goen, Nate and Terrance are both pretty young but qualify. Troy is the one pretty much only really experienced guy back there. The value of having a guy like that is priceless. And the Bills have plenty of room under the cap. Troy is a character-type, and he is damn smart. He will help the rookies and young vets.

 

Why cut him anyway? To take the full brunt of his cap hit this year thus saving that much more space next year? Well, that makes some sense, but I think he is well worth his price. Troy is going to realize mentoring these guys could be a real way to leave a legacy. I see him stepping p big time, playing well and hopefully staying healthy.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

Troy isn't all that experienced at FS. I'd rather the Bills went with the youth movement if it otherwise meant having to cut a promising youngster in order to keep Vincent.