Pine Barrens Mafia Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Isn't that what this game is doing??? Taking a stereotype and making it absurdly funny, while actually being an office cubicle time-waster.....Surely you don't think the game is actually advocating all of us to go take shotguns to Arizona, do you? 688224[/snapback] [sarcasm] it's a slippery slope, I tell you, a slippery slope! Soon we'll all be wearing jackboots and armbands!! [/sarcasm]
erynthered Posted May 10, 2006 Author Posted May 10, 2006 Hey, I can take a joke if someone wants to rib on my for my ethnic background. What I'd get pissed at is a game that portrayed all members of my ethnic background as criminals and drains on society, called us an offensive name, portrayed us as stereotypical cartoon characters and encouraged people to have fun shooting us in a video game. 688216[/snapback] You mean all Italians are not in the Mafia? All Irish people are not cops and Priests? All blacks are not Pimps? All Germans are not Nazi's? Ever go to the movies? I posted the game for its entertainment value. But you decided to get all righteous on us. Get a grip.
The Avenger Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Can you?Isn't that what this game is doing??? Taking a stereotype and making it absurdly funny, while actually being an office cubicle time-waster.....Surely you don't think the game is actually advocating all of us to go take shotguns to Arizona, do you? 688224[/snapback] I know it's not actually advocating shooting people, but I do think the underlying message is that these people are subhuman and somehow killing them isn't a big deal. I guess it boils down to what you consider "absurdly funny". I'm Dutch, so absurdly funny to me is drawing me with wooden shoes or with my finger in a dike (that's DIKE, but go ahead and put lesbian joke here). What's not absurdly funny is a black person with nitty hair and gigantic lips eating watermellon and throwing spears at people a la the cartoons of the 30s and 40s. I think the game is closer to this than it is to drawing me with wooden shoes. Does anyone here seriously believe that if the game were about black people and the characters were drawn as I just described and you shot at them that it wouldn't be seriously racist game?
The Avenger Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 It says a lot about you that you're more upset about racially stereotyping Mexicans in a game than you are shooting them. 688217[/snapback] ???? I said "it's NOT OK to have a game where you stereotype Mexicans, call them wetbacks, portray all of them as criminals and enjoy shooting them."
ieatcrayonz Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 You mean all Italians are not in the Mafia? All Irish people are not cops and Priests? All blacks are not Pimps? All Germans are not Nazi's? Ever go to the movies? I posted the game for its entertainment value. But you decided to get all righteous on us. Get a grip. 688238[/snapback] I agree with Avenger that the game is not entertaining at all. Where I part ways with him is whether a similar game with black people would be fun. I don't think so. Evidently, he does. Not only is his opinion offensive, but it is stupid. The last time I checked there was no US/Africa border.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 I guess it boils down to what you consider "absurdly funny". I'm Dutch, so absurdly funny to me is drawing me with wooden shoes or with my finger in a dike (that's DIKE, but go ahead and put lesbian joke here). What's not absurdly funny is a black person with nitty hair and gigantic lips eating watermellon and throwing spears at people a la the cartoons of the 30s and 40s. I think the game is closer to this than it is to drawing me with wooden shoes. Does anyone here seriously believe that if the game were about black people and the characters were drawn as I just described and you shot at them that it wouldn't be seriously racist game? 688242[/snapback] Ah, yes. The fallacy of reverse-racism. If it's socially acceptable to portray Dutch people in a stereotypical and comical way, then it ought to be Ok to do so for blacks and Mexicans or whoever for that matter. Either that, or no humor about culture at all.
ieatcrayonz Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 I know it's not actually advocating shooting people, but I do think the underlying message is that these people are subhuman and somehow killing them isn't a big deal. I guess it boils down to what you consider "absurdly funny". I'm Dutch, so absurdly funny to me is drawing me with wooden shoes or with my finger in a dike (that's DIKE, but go ahead and put lesbian joke here). What's not absurdly funny is a black person with nitty hair and gigantic lips eating watermellon and throwing spears at people a la the cartoons of the 30s and 40s. I think the game is closer to this than it is to drawing me with wooden shoes. Does anyone here seriously believe that if the game were about black people and the characters were drawn as I just described and you shot at them that it wouldn't be seriously racist game? 688242[/snapback] I get it. You hate black people and don't want the country to lose its focus and start hating mexicans too. Take it to the KKK board. Or, if you want the "shoot black people game" so bad, just write one yourself.
MattyT Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Dude, I hate that too. I can't go to Home Depot or even Orchard Supply without having 15 or 20 caballeros yelling at me as I roll in the parking lot. Crap, they even hang out at the gas station across the street to try to solicit work. !@#$ers. 688068[/snapback] Mexicans yell at you in a parking lot? Um...why? Just curious.
Chef Jim Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 I'd LOVE to find that number, because I think it would prove my point. I bet less than 5% of all the tax dollars I spend go to illegal immigrants. 688209[/snapback] Holy fuggin' crap. You're ok with having your tax dollars go to people who are here illegally?? Oh, that's right, can't be too much because it's probably less than 5%..............for now!!
Chef Jim Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Mexicans yell at you in a parking lot? Um...why? Just curious. 688261[/snapback] He pushed a burrito cart on the weekends for beer money.
The Avenger Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Ah, yes. The fallacy of reverse-racism. If it's socially acceptable to portray Dutch people in a stereotypical and comical way, then it ought to be Ok to do so for blacks and Mexicans or whoever for that matter. Either that, or no humor about culture at all. 688249[/snapback] Ah yes, the fallacy of taking a specific statement and generalizing it. I said it was OK with ME to be portrayed in what I consider to be a playful Dutch stereotype. I'm just 1 guy - what I think doesn't make something socially acceptable or not (if it did I'd have a much better shot of ruling the world). I'm sure there are plenty of Dutch people who would NOT find that socially acceptable. There are shades of stereotypes, and some of the lighter forms may be socially accepted by some (i.e. - blonde jokes, Polish jokes, etc.), but it doesn't mean that it is socially acceptable to everyone. The more severe the stereotype, the less socially acceptable it becomes, to a point where I don't think many would accept the pickaninny (sp?) stereotype of black peole. Because illegal immigration is a hotbuton issue right now I think fewer people are able to see a game like what was posted and see that the stereotypes and underlying messages are pretty severe and shouldn't (IMHO) be tolerated. I bring blacks into the argument to illustrate that if the same thing was done to another group of people more people might find the racism repugnant.
The Avenger Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Holy fuggin' crap. You're ok with having your tax dollars go to people who are here illegally?? Oh, that's right, can't be too much because it's probably less than 5%..............for now!! 688267[/snapback] I'm as OK with it as I am paying tax dollars and higher insurance rates for ininsured motorists who get in car crashes and uninsured people who clog up the emergency rooms. It sucks, but it's the way things are. You're never going to be in a place where you aren't paying for someone else, whether its because an illegal immigrant sends their kids to public school or I have to pay more to go to Yellowstone park because the park's budget's been cut at the same time their insurance premiums went up due to crazy liability lawsuits from tourists who got too close to Old Faithful. I'm actually more concerned with the $386B worth of tax dollars going to pay interest on the national debt (and I'm not even saying anything about my tax dollars in Iraq).
Chef Jim Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 I'm as OK with it as I am paying tax dollars and higher insurance rates for ininsured motorists who get in car crashes and uninsured people who clog up the emergency rooms. It sucks, but it's the way things are. You're never going to be in a place where you aren't paying for someone else, whether its because an illegal immigrant sends their kids to public school or I have to pay more to go to Yellowstone park because the park's budget's been cut at the same time their insurance premiums went up due to crazy liability lawsuits from tourists who got too close to Old Faithful. I'm actually more concerned with the $386B worth of tax dollars going to pay interest on the national debt (and I'm not even saying anything about my tax dollars in Iraq). 688281[/snapback] Wow, as LA says you need to come out to CA and see what's happening. And what a lame line "it sucks, but it's the way things are." Things can change and that's why we go to the polls, so we can change things we don't like. I just hope you like lube, because it sounds like you like getting !@#$ed up the azz.
bills_fan Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 There are shades of stereotypes, and some of the lighter forms may be socially accepted by some (i.e. - blonde jokes, Polish jokes, etc.), but it doesn't mean that it is socially acceptable to everyone. The more severe the stereotype, the less socially acceptable it becomes, to a point where I don't think many would accept the pickaninny (sp?) stereotype of black peole. Because illegal immigration is a hotbuton issue right now I think fewer people are able to see a game like what was posted and see that the stereotypes and underlying messages are pretty severe and shouldn't (IMHO) be tolerated. I bring blacks into the argument to illustrate that if the same thing was done to another group of people more people might find the racism repugnant. Again, it depends on context, which is my whole point. Lets say one of our elected "leaders" referred seriously to Mexicans as wetbacks and breeders and advocated citizens taking a shotgun to Arizona. That would be a problem. But a nonsense computer game that gives you a laugh mid-day is a completely different context, and should (IMHO) be treated as such.
The Avenger Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Wow, as LA says you need to come out to CA and see what's happening. And what a lame line "it sucks, but it's the way things are." Things can change and that's why we go to the polls, so we can change things we don't like. I just hope you like lube, because it sounds like you like getting !@#$ed up the azz. 688290[/snapback] There's only so much I can worry about in a day or a lifetime. If anyone seriously believes they can solve all the problems in the world all the power to them - but they're going to get frustrated when they can't. There are lots of things I don't like, but maturity has told me the world isn't always fair and you have to accept some things and chalk it up to "that's life". Knowing that some of my tax dollars go to the undeserving, particularly when I see that as a very small part of where my taxes go, falls into the "that's life" category. If they weren't going there, they'd be going somewhere else I wouldn't be happy about. So, I divide my attention/anger/energy between the issues in order of the importance I assign them. There are lots of things that upset me more about where my tax dollars go (and don't go) than buying a schoolbook for the child of an illegal immigrant. Things like interest on the debt and the defense budget certainly eat more of my tax dollars than aid going to the undeserving. I'm in software, and I'm not worried about an illegal immigrant taking my job nearly as much as my company legally moving my job to a guy in India (and even getting a government subsidy to do it) - that's getting screwed, and it's perfectly legal.
The Avenger Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Again, it depends on context, which is my whole point. Lets say one of our elected "leaders" referred seriously to Mexicans as wetbacks and breeders and advocated citizens taking a shotgun to Arizona. That would be a problem. But a nonsense computer game that gives you a laugh mid-day is a completely different context, and should (IMHO) be treated as such. 688293[/snapback] Interesting point. I guess I don't draw the line based on context as much as I do severity. You can make the silliest games, songs, etc. you want, but if the racism/stereotyping is serious enough I don't think it matters. I don't think I'd get upset if someone told a blonde joke at a large dinner gathering in a restaurant (just my opinion), but I wouldn't be OK with making ni**ar jokes in a silly game or cartoon.
Chef Jim Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 I'm in software, and I'm not worried about an illegal immigrant taking my job nearly as much as my company legally moving my job to a guy in India (and even getting a government subsidy to do it) - that's getting screwed, and it's perfectly legal. 688325[/snapback] Yeah, I get it. It's all about you isn't it. They can't take my job so let 'em on in. Jesus...do you have kids that can no longer get spending money by mowing lawns because all the illegals are doing it? You don't care about the poor American citizens who can't get jobs because the illegals are doing them for peanuts? Hospitals in poor neighborhoods closing because the illegals go there for the sniffles because they know they'll get care there. I could go on and on...but it would be a waste because they don't affect you in your software job.
The Avenger Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 Yeah, I get it. It's all about you isn't it. They can't take my job so let 'em on in. Jesus...do you have kids that can no longer get spending money by mowing lawns because all the illegals are doing it? You don't care about the poor American citizens who can't get jobs because the illegals are doing them for peanuts? Hospitals in poor neighborhoods closing because the illegals go there for the sniffles because they know they'll get care there. I could go on and on...but it would be a waste because they don't affect you in your software job. 688341[/snapback] When did I ever say let them in? I said don't sterotype them and call racism racism. I then went on to explain that illegal immigration isn't at the top of my list of worries. It's funny how everyone wants to but the blame on the supply side of this thing and not the demand. The reason citizens can't get jobs mowing lawns is that the demand is there to have your lawn mowed for $20 rather than $60. How many people railing about illegals are stepping up saying they only want citizens cutting their lawns, price be damned? I bow to your superiority and altruism - how selfish of me to be concerned that my job might LEGALLY get shipped elsewhere - I should be worried about your kids not getting their movie money because the Mexican mafia has a stranglehold on cutting grass in the neighborhood. Wish we could all put our own interests aside to combat the evils of the world the way you do </sarcasam> Funny thing is that while people complain about illegal immigrants taking their jobs (landscaping, meat packing, carpentry, etc.) they take jobs that can't logistically be outsourced. If you could ship your lawn out to India or Mexico to be groomed for $5 it would be legal, but it can't. Because the demand is there you have the illegal immigrant issue.
Chef Jim Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 When did I ever say let them in? Your apathy and resigning to the fact that that there was nothing we could do implied that. I then went on to explain that illegal immigration isn't at the top of my list of worries. Your apathy sucks and by the way you're in the minority then. Americans are fed up The reason citizens can't get jobs mowing lawns is that the demand is there to have your lawn mowed for $20 rather than $60 I bet there are plenty of teenagers willing to do it for $10 or $15 or even the $20 the illegals are doing it for. Better them than illegals I say. I bow to your superiority and altruism - how selfish of me to be concerned that my job might LEGALLY get shipped elsewhere - I should be worried about your kids not getting their movie money because the Mexican mafia has a stranglehold on cutting grass in the neighborhood. Wish we could all put our own interests aside to combat the evils of the world the way you do If you have problems with something that is legal, do something about it. I'm doing something about the illegal immigration problem, it's called voting. And don't worry about my kids........I don't (and never will) have any. See I worry about people I don't even know having their job stolen, unlike you just worried about your own. Because the demand is there you have the illegal immigrant issue. I don't hire illegals..do you. That is why my wife and I now clean our own house, until we can find a company that hires only legals to do it. Once again your apathy sucks.
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted May 10, 2006 Posted May 10, 2006 ???? I said "it's NOT OK to have a game where you stereotype Mexicans, call them wetbacks, portray all of them as criminals and enjoy shooting them." 688245[/snapback] Oh. My apologies. You mentioned violence once. And harped for two pages on how wrong it was to call them "wetbacks". Spin it however you like, anyone who looks at a game that involves shooting people and bitches about how horrible it is that said targets would be racially stereotyped is severely !@#$ed in the head. I mean, how do you look at a mother and two children being shot - even in a game - and say "Dammit, that's not right! They called her a breeder!"
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