SoCal Pat Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 I don't care that neither McCargo or Whitner have played yet, and that we should wait to judge them until then. I don't care that (allegedly) Marv and Modrak have forgotten more about football than the board collectively knows. What I do know is this: Even if both are locks for Canton in 10 years, our current staff has ZERO clue about value in the draft. We reached for Whitner, and we gave up too much to get McCargo. The first point is mildly debatable -- maybe there was a team that would've snapped up Whitner ahead of us if we move down. But the trade for McCargo is hands down one of the three worst decisions ever in franchise history. We could've had him in the early second, and we gave up an additional pick in the third (not to mention the added cap hit we're taking by having an additional first-rounder) to get him. It makes absolutely zero sense. And the scary thing is this: What's not to say that we shouldn't expect similar fleecings when we try and make a trade? "The art of the deal" -- our staff is clearly lacking in this regard. When you make such wildly speculative moves such as this, they HAVE to be grand slam home runs, because your margin of error is gone. And that's not something a first-year GM needs to have none of entering his first season. What a !@#$ing disaster of a day this has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 What I do know is this: Even if both are locks for Canton in 10 years, our current staff has ZERO clue about value in the draft. We reached for Whitner, and we gave up too much to get McCargo. 675715[/snapback] its posts like this that really shows how ridiculous people are around here. so if our two picks end up being hall of fame material youll still be mad??? its the want of sexy picks that allowed TD to consistently make us (the fans) look stupid time and time again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 11 September 2001 was a 'disaster of a day.' Today is a day when you just have to shrug and grab a beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rnmac Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 Why? Because Mel Kiper told you so? You do not know that we could have had him later. You are guessing. If they wanted him and thought he was a player that can start and help us, then go get him. Everyone knows that draft day is a gamble. There are no sure things. They needed to improve the defense and they have. JMHO. I don't care that neither McCargo or Whitner have played yet, and that we should wait to judge them until then. I don't care that (allegedly) Marv and Modrak have forgotten more about football than the board collectively knows. What I do know is this: Even if both are locks for Canton in 10 years, our current staff has ZERO clue about value in the draft. We reached for Whitner, and we gave up too much to get McCargo. The first point is mildly debatable -- maybe there was a team that would've snapped up Whitner ahead of us if we move down. But the trade for McCargo is hands down one of the three worst decisions ever in franchise history. We could've had him in the early second, and we gave up an additional pick in the third (not to mention the added cap hit we're taking by having an additional first-rounder) to get him. It makes absolutely zero sense. And the scary thing is this: What's not to say that we shouldn't expect similar fleecings when we try and make a trade? "The art of the deal" -- our staff is clearly lacking in this regard. When you make such wildly speculative moves such as this, they HAVE to be grand slam home runs, because your margin of error is gone. And that's not something a first-year GM needs to have none of entering his first season. What a !@#$ing disaster of a day this has been. 675715[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nodnarb Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 More drivel from somebody who thinks he knows what the other team's draft boards looked like cuz he watched ESPN. Go have a few more beers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayFinkle Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 More drivel from somebody who thinks he knows what the other team's draft boards looked like cuz he watched ESPN. Go have a few more beers... 675751[/snapback] So do you an opinion other than everybody who is critical of the Bills draft are morons? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 I don't care that neither McCargo or Whitner have played yet, and that we should wait to judge them until then. I don't care that (allegedly) Marv and Modrak have forgotten more about football than the board collectively knows. What I do know is this: Even if both are locks for Canton in 10 years, our current staff has ZERO clue about value in the draft. We reached for Whitner, and we gave up too much to get McCargo. The first point is mildly debatable -- maybe there was a team that would've snapped up Whitner ahead of us if we move down. But the trade for McCargo is hands down one of the three worst decisions ever in franchise history. We could've had him in the early second, and we gave up an additional pick in the third (not to mention the added cap hit we're taking by having an additional first-rounder) to get him. It makes absolutely zero sense. And the scary thing is this: What's not to say that we shouldn't expect similar fleecings when we try and make a trade? "The art of the deal" -- our staff is clearly lacking in this regard. When you make such wildly speculative moves such as this, they HAVE to be grand slam home runs, because your margin of error is gone. And that's not something a first-year GM needs to have none of entering his first season. What a !@#$ing disaster of a day this has been. 675715[/snapback] do you realize how dumb you sound? just wondering Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nodnarb Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 So do you an opinion other than everybody who is critical of the Bills draft are morons? 675762[/snapback] Huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in San Diego Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 its posts like this that really shows how ridiculous people are around here. so if our two picks end up being hall of fame material youll still be mad??? its the want of sexy picks that allowed TD to consistently make us (the fans) look stupid time and time again... 675744[/snapback] Sorry but this day is a black eye in the history of Bills drafts ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajzepp Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 11 September 2001 was a 'disaster of a day.' Today is a day when you just have to shrug and grab a beer. 675746[/snapback] Ain't that the friggin truth.....thank you for the perspective Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 He is right. The picks themselves, while solid and fill needs, do not reflect the value of the positions in which they were taken -- and that is a fact. It is no coincidence that the talking heads on ESPN have a strong handle on teams' draft boards during all the other selections in the first round. They generally can say who it will be among 3 players -- with the Bills, it seems like they are operating on a completely different value system -- which is perfectly legit. But if they are so different, they should take advantage of that and turn that into extra picks. More drivel from somebody who thinks he knows what the other team's draft boards looked like cuz he watched ESPN. Go have a few more beers... 675751[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Pat Posted April 29, 2006 Author Share Posted April 29, 2006 its posts like this that really shows how ridiculous people are around here. so if our two picks end up being hall of fame material youll still be mad??? its the want of sexy picks that allowed TD to consistently make us (the fans) look stupid time and time again... 675744[/snapback] You don't get it. I never said that our picks were lousy players, or that they'll never amount to anything, or that I'll be pissed if they do turn out to be great players. We do not have people in the front office that are capable of making the most out of a one-time deal, ie, the draft. I don't want to be picking eighth every year. But if we're going to have to pick that high, I want value for our picks. There's enough known quantities out there with regard to what other teams are doing. It seems highly unlikely that anyone would've taken McCargo before we were up in the 2nd round. Trading up for such a reach is something straight out of Arizona or Cincinnati in their "heyday" as the NFL's laughingstock. We could've easily had an extra pick or two from this draft -- and STILL had Whitner and McCargo. And are we going to overspend for other players in the league when it comes time for a trade? If you can't see why this draft has been a disaster, I can't do anything about that. But it doesn't speak well for our decision makers that we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayFinkle Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 Huh? 675766[/snapback] nice edit..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Island Phil Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 McCargo Pros: On the snap, he gains a fast advantage, relying on his very quick first step and strong hands to gain penetration into the backfield. Despite his lack of height, he has long arms that keep blockers off his body and allow him to use his fine quickness to pursue the play. He is best suited for the three-technique position and isolated in single matchups that he mainly wins early on the down. Cons: There are real concerns about his level of development, conditioning and durability. He will get a good push off the ball and can collapse the pocket, though he needs work on that maneuver. He can struggle to separate to make plays late and relies on his initial quickness to win on the down. He can get wired to blockers if his initial move is thwarted and can struggle shedding at times. Numbers: At the Combine, he ran the 40-yard dash in 5.19 seconds with 30.5-inch vertical jump, 9-2 broad jump and did 25 reps in the 225-pound bench press. During the 2005 season, he played in seven games with 24 tackles, nine tackles for loss and a sack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 you have no possible way of knowing that those guys would be there when it was our pick. we knew what we needed, we knew what we wanted. and we went out and got it without giving anything up really. we still have 3 first day picks (2 in the top 30). i call that knowing/getting value Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Pat Posted April 29, 2006 Author Share Posted April 29, 2006 you have no possible way of knowing that those guys would be there when it was our pick. we knew what we needed, we knew what we wanted. and we went out and got it without giving anything up really. we still have 3 first day picks (2 in the top 30). i call that knowing/getting value 675801[/snapback] "Without giving anything up"? ROGLMFAO. We draft eighth, and we draft a player at a low-demand position 5-10 spots higher than anyone had him going? Then, we give up two picks to move up a dozen spots to take a player that would've been there with our pick at 40? You can be a fan without being a lapjockey for everything the front office do. We did NOT get value for these picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in San Diego Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 "Without giving anything up"? ROGLMFAO. We draft eighth, and we draft a player at a low-demand position 5-10 spots higher than anyone had him going? Then, we give up two picks to move up a dozen spots to take a player that would've been there with our pick at 40? You can be a fan without being a lapjockey for everything the front office do. We did NOT get value for these picks. 675828[/snapback] Thank you sir for saying better than what I have been saying ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 im not a lapjockey, i too knew what we needed. and we went out and got the best safety and the best available dt (who happens to fit into our defense better than the other guys) i really could care less what secret awesome formula you guys use to assign a certain amount of points to this draft position or that draft pick. that stuff doesnt mean jack. we did what was needed to gaurantee we would get the guys we wanted to fill holes. i dont see why its so bad, other than you guys havent heard these player's names enough... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad1 Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 you have no possible way of knowing that those guys would be there when it was our pick. we knew what we needed, we knew what we wanted. and we went out and got it without giving anything up really. we still have 3 first day picks (2 in the top 30). i call that knowing/getting value 675801[/snapback] Marv could have had traded down and had 6 picks in the first 3 rounds. Instead they locked on two players and gave up two 3rd rounders. Obviously, the Bills brass chose not to have the draft fall to them, and decided to be more proactive. The problem is that they now have fewer 1st day picks to continue to rebuild the offensive line. So Marv and company definitely knew who they wanted, and paid the price to get them. He's really decreased his margain of error, which might be seen as too risky at this time. Many saw this as a quantity over quantity type draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhitnerIsAGod Posted April 29, 2006 Share Posted April 29, 2006 So do you an opinion other than everybody who is critical of the Bills draft are morons? 675762[/snapback] No, he doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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