BUFFALOTONE Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 Ugh! Let's not go there again. Please, Marv......say "no" to the "big dancing bear" type OL like Williams, Leonard Davis, and this year's version, Marcus McNeil. 659774[/snapback] haha, dancing bears are funny. But I agree.
VIVE LA FRANCE, VIVE LA GUERRE Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 One thing about that report though, which I don't think is just one writer's views, there have a lot of scouts at Ourlads. It gives detail and specifics, on how he actually plays. Most of the glowing reports talk in generalities about his physical gifts. Those two things can co-exist. Every great report says he's an amazing specimin and size and speed and burst and strength and potential and words like that. The Ourlads analysis is how they see him actually play. Granted, it's probably somewhere in the middle. But those Ourlads guys are not total morons, they have been doing this for 23 years or something and get paid by the NFL teams for their work. 659847[/snapback] Gentlemen the hermeneuts at Ourlads deserve an encomium for their de-mystification of Mr. Haloti Ngata. Mr. Ngata has been exposed gentlemen, and the Ultra Hooligans can only hope that the wisdom of Mr. Levy mobilizes itself with f*cking relentlessness, and identifies Mr. Ngata as the charlatan he is. Gentlemen we are faced with a dichotomy at the number 8 position: Mr. Huff or Mr. Bunkley. I, for one, am lost in this particular theoretical matrix and hope Mr. Levy with the consultation of Mr. Jauron, Mr. Fewell and the other researchers can make the correct move. Attention Mr. Mike Shoop: you are a greater charlatan than Mr. Ngata
stinky finger Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 Gentlemen the hermeneuts at Ourlads deserve an encomium for their de-mystification of Mr. Haloti Ngata. Mr. Ngata has been exposed gentlemen, and the Ultra Hooligans can only hope that the wisdom of Mr. Levy mobilizes itself with f*cking relentlessness, and identifies Mr. Ngata as the charlatan he is. Gentlemen we are faced with a dichotomy at the number 8 position: Mr. Huff or Mr. Bunkley. I, for one, am lost in this particular theoretical matrix and hope Mr. Levy with the consultation of Mr. Jauron, Mr. Fewell and the other researchers can make the correct move. Attention Mr. Mike Shoop: you are a greater charlatan than Mr. Ngata 659874[/snapback] I THINK you mean you're not a Ngata supporter. Nor am I. Nice to see you post again.
34-78-83 Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 Sorry folks, there is no "scouting service" that is going to accurately be able to predict the translation of a college player's skills to the Pros with any reliable degree of accuracy. Sure some are historically better than others, but this is not an exact science. Some posters here are merely setting themselves up to cry "chicken little" if we end up drafting this guy. Even the former scouts at Ourlads are not privy to all the same resources that active scouting staffs are. We can all pick whose evaluation we want to trust but it's much like picking Super Bowl odds. I have seen the guy (Ngata) play once and was not largely impressed but that certainly doesn't make me an expert either.
R. Rich Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 Sorry folks, there is no "scouting service" that is going to accurately be able to predict the translation of a college player's skills to the Pros with any reliable degree of accuracy. Sure some are historically better than others, but this is not an exact science. Some posters here are merely setting themselves up to cry "chicken little" if we end up drafting this guy. Even the former scouts at Ourlads are not privy to all the same resources that active scouting staffs are. We can all pick whose evaluation we want to trust but it's much like picking Super Bowl odds. I have seen the guy (Ngata) play once and was not largely impressed but that certainly doesn't make me an expert either. 659918[/snapback] I look @ it as another tool to use to measure a player's abilities. I also look @ game tape (gotta love the ESPN Game Plan!), so that I have some idea about what some of these guys can do. In Ngata's case, I've seen about 4 games this year, and he seems to be a pretty solid DT. I don't think he's the greatest DT prospect in a decade nor do I think he's a total bust. Based on what I've seen of him and what I've read about him, I think he's good, but I'd rather see the Bills use the #8 pick elsewhere and get a quailty DT either in the 2nd or w/ the earliest of our 3rd round picks, depending on how the draft plays out.
BUFFALOTONE Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 I look @ it as another tool to use to measure a player's abilities. I also look @ game tape (gotta love the ESPN Game Plan!), so that I have some idea about what some of these guys can do. In Ngata's case, I've seen about 4 games this year, and he seems to be a pretty solid DT. I don't think he's the greatest DT prospect in a decade nor do I think he's a total bust. Based on what I've seen of him and what I've read about him, I think he's good, but I'd rather see the Bills use the #8 pick elsewhere and get a quailty DT either in the 2nd or w/ the earliest of our 3rd round picks, depending on how the draft plays out. 659932[/snapback] I agree. I like his build and potential. But potential only means you havent done s--- yet, direct quote from my high scool coach. Anyway I think we can get DT later in the draft that can have just as much impact. But I think we need a game changer on either side of the ball and I dont think this kid is it.
Orton's Arm Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 Clearly, this is a profile of a late-round draft choice at all. I have not seen one mock draft that has him falling out of the first round, let alone out of the top-15. Ourlads puts its creditability in question with this profile. 659761[/snapback] Consider that A) many first-round picks end up being busts, and B) most draft sites had glowing profiles of these players in the year they were drafted. Think of all the glowing reviews you read about Mike Williams back when he was drafted. Obviously, what Ourlads is trying to do is to predict first round busts will be in advance of the draft. If they're right more often than not, they'll have increased their credibility in my eyes.
stinky finger Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 But potential only means you havent done s--- yet, direct quote from my high scool coach. 659946[/snapback] WOW!! You played for Knute Rockne?!?!?
PortlandBillsFan Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 Hey guys, first time poster out here in Oregon. I'm a huge Oregon fan and saw pretty much every game Haloti played in college. That Ourlads report makes me think they never saw him play. They are wrong on so many points IMHO. G Fred Matua dominated him the whole game. First, one guy did not dominate him in the USC game. They had 2 or 3 guys on him every play, just like every other team he went against. No inside pressure when he's single blocked. Rarely makes a play. Wrong again. He was often unguardable when left one on one. Go watch the Cal game and you'll see what I mean. Takes too many plays off. This was a problem his 1st 2 years at UO. This problem seemed to go away his junior year. Not an impressive pass rusher ( 3 sacks ). Is this really what you need a 340+lb DT to be? Also, 3 sacks isn't too shabby for a supposed run stuffer at the next level. I think Haloti would be a real nice pick for the Bills at 8. He should be a solid starter for years. I could've pointed out more issues I had with Ourlads, but this post is way too long as it is.
stuckincincy Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 Hey guys, first time poster out here in Oregon. I'm a huge Oregon fan and saw pretty much every game Haloti played in college. That Ourlads report makes me think they never saw him play. They are wrong on so many points IMHO. G Fred Matua dominated him the whole game. First, one guy did not dominate him in the USC game. They had 2 or 3 guys on him every play, just like every other team he went against. No inside pressure when he's single blocked. Rarely makes a play. Wrong again. He was often unguardable when left one on one. Go watch the Cal game and you'll see what I mean. Takes too many plays off. This was a problem his 1st 2 years at UO. This problem seemed to go away his junior year. Not an impressive pass rusher ( 3 sacks ). Is this really what you need a 340+lb DT to be? Also, 3 sacks isn't too shabby for a supposed run stuffer at the next level. I think Haloti would be a real nice pick for the Bills at 8. He should be a solid starter for years. I could've pointed out more issues I had with Ourlads, but this post is way too long as it is. 660389[/snapback] Welcome to the forum! That Ourlads post seemed odd...I can't say he's a #8, but OTOH I wouldn't paint him as a bum. One concern is the history of knee injury...
Shamrock Posted April 12, 2006 Posted April 12, 2006 Slow twitch player. Doesn't push the pocket with strength. Questionable functional strength. Gets pinned by a single block. Stands on the line of scrimmage. Jogs in pursuit. Gets driven off the ball in goal line defense. Some weeks ago i posted his Olympic weightlifting totals, which for a man of his size and in particular, his potential draft position (#8 Buffalo) were quite poor. Good on him for doing those lifts though. These comments, particularly about "slow twitch" bare that out (...and yes i do know he's a footballer first and formost and thta some folk have No idea how Olympic lifters train). I'd hope to take someone with more power than strength- thus more ability to penetrate and push their ground. The description is pretty negative stuff. We'll see...
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