Catholic Guilt Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 This is about as smart as 'Buffalo Jills - hot or not." We gave away the farm to draft this kid. We yank him in and out of games and basically don't give him a chance. Now its time to trade him away. MEMO!!!! A certain former QB of the Bills who wore #12 wasn't exactly well-liked in his first five years.
stuckincincy Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 I'm happy with the best option between Nall and JP starting, but given the circumstances and upside, Nall would have to be clearly better to get the nod. If they are about the same or the difference is "perceived as a leader", then you stick with JP for 16 starts as should be the goal. Nothing, and I mean nothing nothing nothing, gets this job to Holcomb. He is a different animal, no upside, and a disaster of mediocrity waiting to happen. If we can get value for JP or any other player that can make our team better overall we consider that deal. If someone who knows more about football than I do is really really sure that JP has no chance of being better than Nall, okay. But the best thing that can happen is still improving this team the best we can at other positions, designing a gameplan around smashmouth football with Willis, and start JP as our best option for 16 games, so next off season we can make a more agressive change of direction at QB if needed, or know that JP is our man. 645777[/snapback] Well said.
Ghost of BiB Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 Not sure if you're talking to me soup boy. But, I don't gloat. I wish I was eating crow after the season and he really was the next coming of YA Tittle. Problem is he appears to be more of Jimmy Stewart "Harvey". 645783[/snapback] Yeah, I'm talking to you. I went back and edited to include "Bill". And sh--, now you are going the humble route too? At least I never compared you to a robot from a movie 6 people saw. (Actually 5, but I heard you saw it twice).
mead107 Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 Yeah, I'm talking to you. I went back and edited to include "Bill". And sh--, now you are going the humble route too? At least I never compared you to a robot from a movie 6 people saw. (Actually 5, but I heard you saw it twice). 645788[/snapback] i like soup very good pic of you .
BillsGuyInMalta Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 It begs the question though...say we do end up trading JP. I wont get into compensation or any of that nonsense since it's still waaaay too early to tell (this whole story might be crap anyways.) But say we do trade Losman. And say Vince Young falls to our pick, like I've seen him fall in many of the more recent mocks (in fact, the last 7 mocks I've read, all 7 of them having him falling past us at #8). Do we take Young if we traded Losman? Wouldnt he just add to the competition, or do other needs take precedence? An interesting dilemma to say the least.
Dr. K Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 This has all the earmarks of a total BS report, based on hearsay and speculation. Reporting like this is why yesterday's "journalism" is today's fish wrapping.
Ghost of BiB Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 i like soup very good pic of you . 645789[/snapback] Thank you. My best side, and good lighting for a change.
Dante Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 If the Bills give up on JP this early I will join every single doom and gloom poster on this board and it will show this team is in nothing but shambles and Marv and Ralph need to go. Cause bringing in GB third stringer and expecting him to succeed as the new starter is about as crazy as expecting JP to carry us to the playoffs after not starting and missing most of his first season. I really doubt i will listen to something that has only been reported on by a guy righting for Yahoo sports (I'm sure they are just one notch below NFL.com or the teams official site when it comes to reporting news) 645685[/snapback] Good post. For what they could get for Losman whats the point in dealing him? The guy has raw talent thats why he went in the first round. Since we cant get much for him we should hold onto him and hope he comes around. It would be foolhardy to get rid of him now. But with Ralph at the helm im not sure what to expect.
nonprophet Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 All I can say is JP must have some type of issue if his teammates lost respect for him that fast.....That has been the rumor about him all along though, guys just don't like him. 645626[/snapback] It's probably because he couldn't stop talking about Favre's tight red shorts.
Tasker Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 This is about as smart as 'Buffalo Jills - hot or not." We gave away the farm to draft this kid. We yank him in and out of games and basically don't give him a chance. Now its time to trade him away. MEMO!!!! A certain former QB of the Bills who wore #12 wasn't exactly well-liked in his first five years. 645784[/snapback] Complete agreement. If we decide that JP is not a QB who can lead us to the Super Bowl, we can move on. But I'm very doubtful that anybody can make that call right now, and we don't have anybody clearly more likely to take us to the Super Bowl than JP right now (including possible picks at #8). So we have the luxury of having an "open battle" in camp that JP wins, and gets 16 starts. If he does well he's our guy, if not everyone can agree that we've had a large enough sample to move on without it being a rash decision. Unless Nall clearly outplays him in camp, I don't see any decision better for this football team than playing JP all year. Not because I love JP, but because I love the Bills and want to win a Super Bowl. It took my Red Sox 86 years to change their history. The Bills can make the right moves, play the right football, and be the small market Super Bowl champ that everyone praises like Green Bay, and get Norwood (Buckner) and the ghosts all forgiven. It might take a couple years, and we have to understand that and make the right decisions to make it happen.
Dante Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 I Do we take Young if we traded Losman? 645790[/snapback] No. We finally get smart and draft O Linemen. If none of quality are available we draft DLinemen. When it comes time we go buy a decent free agent qb.
mead107 Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 It begs the question though...say we do end up trading JP. I wont get into compensation or any of that nonsense since it's still waaaay too early to tell (this whole story might be crap anyways.) But say we do trade Losman. And say Vince Young falls to our pick, like I've seen him fall in many of the more recent mocks (in fact, the last 7 mocks I've read, all 7 of them having him falling past us at #8). Do we take Young if we traded Losman? Wouldnt he just add to the competition, or do other needs take precedence? An interesting dilemma to say the least. 645790[/snapback] i think it would be good to take all 3 QBs in the draft .
nonprophet Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 If JP is not the guy so be it. Then Marv has failed big time by not going out and getting his starter. Right now it looks like it is JP, Holcomb or you run the Wing-T. 645686[/snapback] What's wrong with a Buffalo wing?
zow2 Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 No one knows for sure if JP is a bust or not??? What we do know is that he is clearly not respected in the Bills Lockerroom amongst the very players that he is supposed to lead. I'm not sure if this is from his immature nature?..or his squeaky high voice? I think if his teammates thought he was a great talent, they would buy into him more. Obviously something is wrong here so it's probably best to move him. Even if JP turns out to be pretty good you can see that he will never have the accuracy of a Brady or the field general leadership of a Peyton Manning. I picture him at best to be a Very, very poor man's version of Jake Plummer. That means i doubt he will ever accomplish as much as Jake and Jake really hasn't done all that much in his career.
VABills Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 Yeah, I'm talking to you. I went back and edited to include "Bill". And sh--, now you are going the humble route too? At least I never compared you to a robot from a movie 6 people saw. (Actually 5, but I heard you saw it twice). 645788[/snapback] You guys still don't get it. I do not know what the answer is at QB. I do know that part of our offensive line problem (if not a large part of it) is the fault of the coaching and the QB's. I know that calling the same sequesnce of plays and tipping our calls with "package" with specific personnel also doesn't help. I also know that the ability to hit quick reads is a critical part of what a QB needs to do, and only one of our guys did that last year. Again, I don't know who should be the QB. I also know that if JP is truely a failure and we wait until next year to try and trade him, we will get nothing. If management and coaches are not sold, then get rid of him, before you show him on stage even more and get even less value.
Ghost of BiB Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 What's wrong with a Buffalo wing? 645806[/snapback] They don't come in Campbell's Chunky.
Tom Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 Meetings notebook: Bills looking to deal Losman By Charles Robinson, Yahoo! Sports March 29, 2006 Charles Robinson Yahoo! Sports Exclusive ORLANDO, Fla. – Teams in search of a quarterback on the trade market could be in line for yet another young talent in the coming weeks: J.P. Losman. Two league sources indicated Tuesday that Losman hasn't gained the confidence of the Buffalo Bills' new regime. Both sources expect the team to put the former first-round pick on the trade block before the start of the 2006 season – if he isn't already there. Bills general manager Marv Levy declared the quarterback position an open race last week after signing Craig Nall to a three-year contract, and it was widely believed the former Green Bay Packers reserve QB would compete with Losman for starting duties. But one personnel man familiar with the situation said he expects Levy to put out trade feelers for Losman in the coming weeks. "I think it's going to be something that boils down to Nall as the No. 1 and (Kelly) Holcomb as the backup," he said. "If you went through the locker room and people were honest, (there would be) a lot of people who aren't sold on Losman as a leader." When asked if Losman could still win the support of Levy and teammates in the coming weeks, the source painted the situation as "doubtful." ADVERTISEMENT Travelzoo Get Our Top 20® Newsletter in Your Inbox Each Week! The Most "WOW!" Travel Deals on the Internet - here's a sampling: Released MAR 29, 2006 All-Inclusive Mexico Vacations at Half-Price $549 & up CheapCaribbean.com Hawaii in Spring: 3 Nights & Air $335 Pleasant Holidays London over New Year's: 6 Nights & Air $599 go-today.com Alaska 7-Night Cruise on Top-Rated Ship $449 CruiseDeals.com Click on Any Deal and Check Them Out Today! *Fares listed may not include all taxes, charges and government fees. More information. © 2006 Travelzoo Inc. "The biggest advocates of (Losman as a starter) are gone, but he's still a guy who has trade value," he said. "If Nall ends up being the starter and Holcomb is a solid backup you can rely on, why would you have Losman sitting at the bottom (of the depth chart) when you can still get something out there for him?" The advocates that were mentioned are ex-general manager Tom Donahoe and ex-head coach Mike Mularkey. Interestingly, Mularkey is now the offensive coordinator of the Miami Dolphins – a team that is actively seeking a backup quarterback and exploring a possible trade for the Detroit Lions' Joey Harrington. However, the Dolphins also are looking for a veteran backup who has a generous amount of starting experience, and Losman doesn't seem to fit the profile. If there is any inclination to move Losman, the Bills haven't shown it publicly – outside of bringing Nall in to vie for starting honors. New head coach Dick Jauron has been supportive and complimentary of Losman so far, and said Tuesday he's hoping Nall's acquisition will spur some healthy competition. "(Losman has) had two years now to develop," Jauron said. "He had to play a lot last year. It was thrown on him early. It was a difficult situation to be in for a young guy. So he's got a real chance (to improve in his third year). He's got all that physical talent. He can run. He's got a strong arm. He's a smart guy. He's not afraid to work. He's got a lot of upside to him. We've got to give him a chance to get it out. Hopefully those other guys competing will force the hand a little bit and make them all better." "(Nall) obviously doesn't have a lot of playing time. But when he's played he's performed well. He's been accurate with the football. He's a good decision maker. He's got experience. We're not teaching the guy how to play. All he has to do is transfer information. He should be able to step up and compete. He's got good size (6-foot-3, 230 pounds). I like his size – his height in the pocket. I like his demeanor. I like the way he handled himself in interviews. He's a very competitive guy. He believes he can be a starter and should be a starter." OTHER MEETINGS CHATTER # Speaking of Buffalo, word in scouting circles is that the Bills are not targeting Oregon defensive tackle Haloti Ngata with the No. 8 selection in the draft. That's a surprise for those who thought he was a natural fit for Buffalo's pick (including yours truly). Apparently, Ngata doesn't fit Buffalo's plans in the Cover 2 defense. One scouting source indicated Tuesday that USC offensive tackle Winston Justice could be the Bills' true target in the first round. # Frank assessments of the top-three quarterback prospects have been scarce. All three – Texas' Vince Young, USC's Matt Leinart and Vanderbilt's Jay Cutler – have drawn praise and criticism at various points in the last two months, particularly Young and Cutler, but it's been rare to hear any on-the-record concerns about the trio from head coaches. Until Tuesday, that is. Baltimore Ravens head coach Brian Billick had interesting things to say about all three – a surprising development considering the Ravens have scheduled a personal workout with Young and could end up having Cutler still on the board at the 13th overall pick. At one point, Billick likened Cutler's evaluation to that of Kyle Boller – the big-armed Cal product who saw his stock jump during predraft evaluations, but has since struggled to take command of Baltimore's offense. Interestingly, the Boller comparison is one you hear often from Cutler's critics. Billick's overall thoughts on the trio: "You knew Leinart is a given in terms of the evaluation," he said. "Is he going to be a great NFL quarterback? He'll be a roll of the dice. It's a pretty good roll. You like what you see. I can't imagine why he wouldn't do well. "Cutler is kind of like Kyle. There is some apprehension in some of the things around him. You admire him for doing things with less than a stellar cast around him. But are you giving him too much dispensation for things that didn't go well? You dismiss some of those losses (in college) by saying, 'It's just Vanderbilt. What a great kid – he overcame all of these things.' "With Young, you knew we were going to beat him up (in evaluations). He was just too good to be true. The problem that I see personally is I don't know who you compare him to. I think that makes people uncomfortable. Leinart looks like a lot of good pocket quarterbacks. … Young is a different breed. He really doesn't fit into that (Michael) Vick category. He has the size, the accuracy and the throwing action. He's a spectacular talent but he doesn't look like anybody. So that tends to make us all nervous. He gets downgraded for that. "What Leinart and Young have experienced (in college) is totally different than Cutler. That's why I would be concerned with Cutler. He's a good, young man who is intelligent, but he's not really been under the spotlight on a consistent basis. He might not know how this all works." # You have to wonder how long before the San Diego Chargers' situation gets explosive between coach Marty Schottenheimer and general manager A.J. Smith. The two sniped at each other in the press shortly after the season ended – gripes that came to a conclusion when team president Dean Spanos had a meeting with the pair and essentially told them to shut their yaps. But after listening to Schottenheimer, it seems like the fuse is still burning on the relationship. "It was a helluva meeting," he said of the summit with Smith and Spanos. Asked what he learned from it, Schottenheimer reiterated what Spanos told the media about San Diego's feuding coach and general manager: "Exactly what (Spanos) said – I don't pay these guys to like one another. I pay them to do their jobs and that's exactly what we're doing." So has there been any change in the relationship? "(Smith) has been on the road and I haven't had the occasion to see him except on a couple of occasions." In other words – no. Which officially makes the Chargers the league's most interesting war room on draft day. # The Kansas City Chiefs' situation with Priest Holmes continues to look ominous. Clearly, Holmes has seen his days as the Chiefs' dominant runner come to a close. Coach Herman Edwards has officially backed Larry Johnson as his centerpiece in the backfield, but he added that Holmes has been medically cleared to play in 2006. The interesting part of the whole affair? Edwards has no idea what Holmes' future with the team is – because he hasn't spoken to him since their first conversation when Edwards took the job in January. "At that point, he anticipated coming back," Edwards said of Holmes. "I don't know where it stands at this point. I don't know him as well as other guys. He's kind of that way. We call him the ghost. He's kind of in and out. He kind of reminds me of Curtis Martin in that way. He's taking his time in figuring out what to do. There's no rush. There's no deadline when he has to make a decision, but it's his decision to make." Asked what kind of role Holmes would have if he did return to the Chiefs, Edwards said he would be a good "change-of-pace" back. "It would help him because he wouldn't have to carry the load like he has in the past. It's always hard to do, to try to play two running backs. That was the problem we kind of ran into (with the New York Jets) when we had LaMont (Jordan) and Curtis. Curtis was a guy that needed 22, 23 (carries) before he got going. And then you get the question they always ask is why you didn't get the guy in the game. You don't have enough plays. You try to work it out. "What we started doing with LaMont, the third series, he's going in the game regardless of what happens. We haven't talked about it as a staff but if that comes about, that's what we'd have to do – make a decision that (Holmes is) going into the game in (a specific) part of the game. # One of the more interesting moments on Tuesday was hearing Miami's Nick Saban talk about wearing a University of Texas sweater at Vince Young's pro day last week. Saban didn't realize his former college team – LSU – was slated to play the Longhorns in the NCAA tournament's Elite Eight only three days later. When someone posted a photo of Saban in the Texas gear on the university's website, some of the Tiger alums didn't take it too well. "There were a few a people in Louisiana that weren't very happy with me having a Texas sweatshirt on, but I just want to make it clear right now that I was cold," Saban said. "I was trying to get warm. I went (in short sleeves) and it wasn't quite as warm (in Austin) as it was in Miami. I should have had better anticipation. "(I heard from) some LSU people – not directly to me, but through the grapevine. I predicted that, though. I told them when they gave it to me, 'I'll catch some hell in Louisiana.' I didn't know they were going to play in basketball at the time, either. I guess I didn't anticipate a lot of things." # Odds and ends: Saban said Daunte Culpepper officially started his on-field rehabilitation Monday, doing some straight-line running and simulated drops in the pocket. Saban said the Dolphins still haven't set a timetable for when Culpepper will be ready to go full-bore. … Indianapolis Colts coach Tony Dungy downplayed the loss of Edgerrin James, noting "You always find the next person. I just think back to when Marshall (Faulk) left. I know it was the same thing in the city, 'How are we going to replace this guy?' " Added Dungy: "We found Edge and we'll find someone else. It may be a combination of guys. I don't know that just one guy can do all that." Charles Robinson is the national NFL writer for Yahoo! Sports. Send him a question or comment for potential use in a future column or webcast.
BUFFALOTONE Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 We all know he had a terrible showing last year, but we all know this kid has the tools to be a solid QB. His decision making needs to get alot better but that only comes from game time experience. And NO 8 games is not enough, if he doesnt beat out Nall or Kelly for that matter than he does not belong as the starter and you deal him away. But at least let the kid get outworked. I have never heard of drafting a QB in the first round and then realeasing him 2 years later. Especially when one of those years he was injured. I am in agreeance with all of you on the fact that he was ineffective last year, but you cant tell me that where Bledsoe would have had a 7 yard loss, JP made a 4 yard gain. 3rd and 3 is alot different than 3rd and12. If the kid doesn't produce-cut your losses. I think he will be ok, look at Eli his first year.GO BILLS!
Rico Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 Well, I hope there's nothing to all this cause I'd like to see JP make it BUT IF Marv and co. truly believe that JP is not, can not, and will not be the answer, then (as always), it's best to cut your losses ASAP and move on.... especially when it's TD's mistake & not Marv's.
Bill from NYC Posted March 29, 2006 Posted March 29, 2006 There was a reason. The reason was that this team couldn't win with Bledsoe. That was proven. JP happened to be the young QB on the roster and they gave him a shot. It happens more often then you think. Look at what the Chargers are doing. JP was hit with a bad injury at the worst time. Then he was thown to the lions without one decent lineman to protect him. People are going to hate on JP because that's what Bills fans do. The Bills are going nowhere this season so it'a a perfect time to build a line and give the kid his shot. The only problem I have is when will Marv start to address the O-line? 645704[/snapback] Bledsoe had 9 wins and was replaced by a second year player who was hurt for the better part of his first season, and showed nothing to indicate that he didn't suck. As for the Chargers....guess what? Rivers sat for 2 full seasons, and is probably getting a shot now only because Brees may very well be damaged goods, and was a UFA.
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