Pyrite Gal Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 One of the fun things to watch during draft time is which lies folks are spreading around to try to get other teams to spend an early pick or trade up to get somebody they really don't think that highly of. My guess is that the biggest one going right now is folks pumping up the value of Jay Cutler as an early pick. Sure he is surprisingly good for a Vandy guy, but please, Leinart was such a winner in college and Vince Young pulled off one of the most impressive games by an individual ever that any GM who passed on these two in order to take Cutler while they were still on the board would easily place his career at risk and likely be strung up by the fans if he passed up these two who have provided real world proof they were top talents/ I think folks are pumping up Cutler as the best QB on the board in the hopes that opponents will take him and have one less high pick to use on what they really want. We'll see! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I agree with you 100%. I'm not going to say that Cutler might not be a good QB and I really like the fact that he worked out at the combine. But people are saying he's better than Young and Leinhart is silly to me. He never went to a bowl game and never even had a WINNING season. I know football is a team sport, but I really believe if you are truly a stud qb, you could deliver a winning season. I seriously wonder if JP and Cutler switched the years they were drafted, would JP be the hot prospect at the combine? Point is, people are definitely overthinking things too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 One of the fun things to watch during draft time is which lies folks are spreading around to try to get other teams to spend an early pick or trade up to get somebody they really don't think that highly of. My guess is that the biggest one going right now is folks pumping up the value of Jay Cutler as an early pick. Sure he is surprisingly good for a Vandy guy, but please, Leinart was such a winner in college and Vince Young pulled off one of the most impressive games by an individual ever that any GM who passed on these two in order to take Cutler while they were still on the board would easily place his career at risk and likely be strung up by the fans if he passed up these two who have provided real world proof they were top talents/ I think folks are pumping up Cutler as the best QB on the board in the hopes that opponents will take him and have one less high pick to use on what they really want. We'll see! 613434[/snapback] Good point...He's a QB so it won't be hard... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortured Soul Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 He won in Knoxville. At Vandy, Cutler will be remembered as nothing but a winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 The biggest hype of all is the rankings themselves. You can look at 100 mock drafts or player rankings and they are all the same within a spot of two. You mean to tell me that everyone thinks the same thing? Well, since the vast majority of people don't scout themselves they have to take other people's opinions. And where did these mock draft sites get their lists (that seems to match everyone else's?). They copy and tweak. The draft is about predicting the future. Hit and miss. I like it when teams succeed by doing their research themselves and go against the grain of 300 mock drafts, get criticized by Mel Kiper, and ultimately are vindicated by the player they took "too early". There are many examples of this. On the flip side, how many 3rd, 4th, and 5th rounders turn out to be very good. Whenever someone goes back 5 years and reevaluates that year's draft, it looks nothing like the actual order. The best is when columnists grade the draft the next day by assigning letter grades. What a useless exercise. Although it IS fun reading, it is meaningless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justnzane Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I agreed with webster guy for the most part. I do have to say that i never have thought that Vince Young was one of the top QB's in the draft. If he didn't have a hell of a game in the championship, i believe that no one would be talking about him as a top 10 pick. I also think he would have done better with another year in college Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartyBall4Buffalo Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Reggie Bush- This isn't college anymore reggie. The players are faster, you wont have as great of a line, and you're gonna have to find an inside game. Dont get me wrong I think he'll be a good runningback, but not the superstar everyone is expecting. I keep hearing the marshal faulk comparisons. I just dont see it. He's great when he can get around the corner, but it's much harder to run outside in the nfl, then it is in college. I also think at 201lbs he's too light. I dont really think he'll ever be a premier rb in this league. Given the choice I'd rather have Lendale White. Jay Cutler- way too much hype for this guy. He went from a nice 1st rd prospect to being considered the top qb in this draft? He's gonna have a lot on his shoulders if he gets drafted high. Especially if a disaster team like the jets take him at 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrite Gal Posted February 28, 2006 Author Share Posted February 28, 2006 The biggest hype of all is the rankings themselves. You can look at 100 mock drafts or player rankings and they are all the same within a spot of two. You mean to tell me that everyone thinks the same thing? Well, since the vast majority of people don't scout themselves they have to take other people's opinions. And where did these mock draft sites get their lists (that seems to match everyone else's?). They copy and tweak. The draft is about predicting the future. Hit and miss. I like it when teams succeed by doing their research themselves and go against the grain of 300 mock drafts, get criticized by Mel Kiper, and ultimately are vindicated by the player they took "too early". There are many examples of this. On the flip side, how many 3rd, 4th, and 5th rounders turn out to be very good. Whenever someone goes back 5 years and reevaluates that year's draft, it looks nothing like the actual order. The best is when columnists grade the draft the next day by assigning letter grades. What a useless exercise. Although it IS fun reading, it is meaningless. 613464[/snapback] The draft is certainly one of the great examples of "groupthink" in sports and our society and the internet has made this even worse. An idea can with rapid speed become a self generating prophecy. If the initial ideas are simply hype we can be well on our way to pulling a "Bode Miller" on issues and predictions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1gap2gap Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 He won in Knoxville. At Vandy, Cutler will be remembered as nothing but a winner. 613458[/snapback] That's funny since he never had a winning season at Vandy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like A Mofo Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I think before the Rose Bowl...if you asked a lot of "experts" what they thought of Vince Young as an NFL player...there were many skeptics....but after his legendary performance in the Rose Bowl...his stock shot through the roof....now that time has gone by and scouts and "experts" remove themselves from the Rose Bowl performance and look at Vince Young HIMSELF and succeeding in the NFL, you are starting to see the potential pitfalls that a lot of people saw in Young before the Rose Bowl. Point is, sure Cutler is shooting up now, but who is to say his stock does not fall between now and April? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnTheRocks Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 What do you think are the biggest draft hype lies, being told? Lie #1. Vince Young will be a top 3 pick. Just my opinion but I will suprised if he goes in the top 10. Lie #2. D'Brickashaw Ferguson is a franchise changing LT. He is a very good LT. He is not in the class of Ogden, Pace or Boselli when they came out. Lie #3. Vernon Davis is the next Antonio Gates. He has to go to the right team. He isn't going to go to just any team and be the next great TE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 The biggest hype of all is the rankings themselves. You can look at 100 mock drafts or player rankings and they are all the same within a spot of two. You mean to tell me that everyone thinks the same thing? Well, since the vast majority of people don't scout themselves they have to take other people's opinions. And where did these mock draft sites get their lists (that seems to match everyone else's?). They copy and tweak. I dont see this one, a lot of sites are similar, but a lot of sites are different. If you get past the first 5 picks you will see that most mock drafts are not the same. I know on the site that i use, the guy that does the profiles will tell you wether the guy is garbage or not, it doesnt matter what everybody else said (he hated philip rivers). Since you dont run a draft site yourself, it isnt your position to say what they do and how they do it behind the scenes. On the flip side, how many 3rd, 4th, and 5th rounders turn out to be very good. I dont know which argument you are taking, whether or not you mean that a lot of players in those rounds dont turn out to be very good, or that you cant find gems every once in a while. But if you're indicating that you can find gems, that doesnt mean that the team that drafted them knew they were going to be stars, if they did they would have drafted them in the 1st or 2nd. The best is when columnists grade the draft the next day by assigning letter grades. What a useless exercise. Although it IS fun reading, it is meaningless. most of the time they dont grade the teams based on the actual players they took, they grade based on what the team needed going into the draft, and how those needs were or were not fulfilled at the end. But the ones that do grade based on what they, not anybody else, thinks about the players is quite stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justnzane Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Point is, sure Cutler is shooting up now, but who is to say that Ricky Williams isn't with him. 613632[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 One of the fun things to watch during draft time is which lies folks are spreading around to try to get other teams to spend an early pick or trade up to get somebody they really don't think that highly of. My guess is that the biggest one going right now is folks pumping up the value of Jay Cutler as an early pick. Sure he is surprisingly good for a Vandy guy, but please, Leinart was such a winner in college and Vince Young pulled off one of the most impressive games by an individual ever that any GM who passed on these two in order to take Cutler while they were still on the board would easily place his career at risk and likely be strung up by the fans if he passed up these two who have provided real world proof they were top talents/ I think folks are pumping up Cutler as the best QB on the board in the hopes that opponents will take him and have one less high pick to use on what they really want. We'll see! 613434[/snapback] I have my doubts about Bush. Guys who survive on speed in college often struggle in the pros where everyone is a step faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Biggest Draft Lie - Any team with a Top 10 pick is guaranteed to get a quality player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevbeau Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Yeah, Cutler did play at Vandy, but in this case it helps him. His W-L record doesn't reflect it, but he did well in a bad football program, playing a tough SEC schedule. Who knows, but I would propose Leinhart may be more of a system product and Cutler more of a gamer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I dont see this one, a lot of sites are similar, but a lot of sites are different. If you get past the first 5 picks you will see that most mock drafts are not the same. I know on the site that i use, the guy that does the profiles will tell you wether the guy is garbage or not, it doesnt matter what everybody else said (he hated philip rivers). Since you dont run a draft site yourself, it isnt your position to say what they do and how they do it behind the scenes. 613808[/snapback] Fair enough. You are right, I don't run a draft site. I subscribed to www.nfldraftscout.com and they do their own work and have a substantially different list than others I have seen. With the 8th pick in the NFL draft, they have the Bills taking the DT from Florida State: Brodrick Bunkley DT Florida State That the Bills need help along the defensive interior is obvious. What might not appear as obvious, however, is that Bunkley actually fits the profile of the type of defensive tackle new coordinator Perry Fewell better than the higher profile Haloti Ngata. Fewell, formerly with Chicago, is expected to bring a similar strategy of quicker, pass rushing defensive tackles to Buffalo, something that fits Bunkley perfectly. My point is that most sites have very similiar rankings and that DOES turn into a "groupthink" and people's initial reactions ("we drafted great" or "we drafted badly") is based on the hype created by many draft sites which say the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimBob2232 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 One of the fun things to watch during draft time is which lies folks are spreading around to try to get other teams to spend an early pick or trade up to get somebody they really don't think that highly of. My guess is that the biggest one going right now is folks pumping up the value of Jay Cutler as an early pick. Sure he is surprisingly good for a Vandy guy, but please, Leinart was such a winner in college and Vince Young pulled off one of the most impressive games by an individual ever that any GM who passed on these two in order to take Cutler while they were still on the board would easily place his career at risk and likely be strung up by the fans if he passed up these two who have provided real world proof they were top talents/ I think folks are pumping up Cutler as the best QB on the board in the hopes that opponents will take him and have one less high pick to use on what they really want. We'll see! 613434[/snapback] Yeah...using the same logic, I guess Ben Roeth was also a bad early pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Fair enough. You are right, I don't run a draft site. I subscribed to www.nfldraftscout.com and they do their own work and have a substantially different list than others I have seen. With the 8th pick in the NFL draft, they have the Bills taking the DT from Florida State: Brodrick Bunkley DT Florida State That the Bills need help along the defensive interior is obvious. What might not appear as obvious, however, is that Bunkley actually fits the profile of the type of defensive tackle new coordinator Perry Fewell better than the higher profile Haloti Ngata. Fewell, formerly with Chicago, is expected to bring a similar strategy of quicker, pass rushing defensive tackles to Buffalo, something that fits Bunkley perfectly. My point is that most sites have very similiar rankings and that DOES turn into a "groupthink" and people's initial reactions ("we drafted great" or "we drafted badly") is based on the hype created by many draft sites which say the same thing. 614302[/snapback] thats interesting, what do you think about that pick? was ngata already gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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