Albany,n.y. Posted January 24, 2006 Posted January 24, 2006 I'd say it doesn't look good for JP. When Marv was asked what he thought about the QB situation on his WGR show before he was GM, Marv said you play the player who gives you a better chance to win the game, and you develop young players in practice, not on the field on gameday. I'm sure the QB situation came up in the coach interviews & anyone who said they would let JP develop next year at the expense of victories was not given a second thought in the final decision on HC. This leads me to believe Jauron answered winning now is more inportant than developing a QB of the future. The only thing I'm not sure of is if Marv will bring in a 3rd QB to compete for the starting job. He basically called Holcomb's jet game a disaster, which may mean Marv feels "None of the above" might be the answer to the Bills QB situation.
Dan Posted January 24, 2006 Posted January 24, 2006 The QB debate here is really quite simple and its very much tied to the mentality of the team. Right now the Bills are a losing organization. They haven't really been a good, competitive team for quite a few years. Other than Moulds, none of the current players can remember the last time the Bills were a decent team. So how do you change that? I think you look at teams like Cinci, Seatle, San Diego. How did they change that mentality of the organization? Simple you get a good group of young players and stick with them. Give them a few years to develop together as a team and they'll begin to believe in each other and turn things around. And that, most certainly, includes the QB position. Right now the Bills, have some great young players on Offense. Willis, Evans, and JP. If we put together a decent line this year, and let all those guys play they'll begin to develop and perhaps in 07 we'll make a run for the playoffs. But certainly, if you keep them all together and playing together - with a better group of linemen - we'll be in the playoffs in 08. The surest way to continue inconsistent play and a losing mentality is to continually insert new palyers (ala Arizona) and hope that by some miracle you strike gold and find that group that works together and becomes a winning team.
1billsfan Posted January 24, 2006 Author Posted January 24, 2006 I think that given all that happened last year, penciling in Holcomb as the starter going into mini-camps may be best, both for JP and the team. For JP, he's told us he plays better with a chip on his shoulder, and this is supported by his improved performance after his benching. It would also give him the opportunity to win the job, and thus win over his teammates. For the team, this would send the message that jobs are earned, and that the Bills want to win now. 582310[/snapback] I actually agree with this plan of action because I have faith that Losman will beat Holcomb out. I'm also glad to hear that many here on this board haven't given up on the kid. If JP does win it the coaching staff better not pull him during a damn game though. Have faith he can pull it out. They keep telling us there's 60 minutes in a game, well then don't panic and let the kid have the full 60 minutes.
ezbills Posted January 24, 2006 Posted January 24, 2006 I agree that a QB needs to show something by the end of year two...which would mean Losman should be the starter in '06. '05 was basically J.P.'s rookie (half) season because he only took a few snaps during the '04 season (remember the Pats beatdown on national TV?). As for the 6-year playoff drought...Bills fans will never be happy unless/until the Bills win the Super Bowl. I'd love for them to make the playoffs sooner rather than later, but most fans (including me) would rather wait an extra year or two if it means the Bills will have a better shot at being a legitimate SB contender. If we're so desparate to win in '06 that the Bills should do whatever it takes, shouldn't they just trade away all of their '06 and '07 draft picks to pick up some veterans that can help with a one-shot run? I didn't think so either. My point is that the team should take actions based on what gives them the best shot at building a championship-caliber team within the next several seasons, rather than on how they can piece together enough talent to somehow go 9-7 and get a #6 seed.
Campy Posted January 24, 2006 Posted January 24, 2006 If we're so desparate to win in '06 that the Bills should do whatever it takes, shouldn't they just trade away all of their '06 and '07 draft picks to pick up some veterans that can help with a one-shot run? I didn't think so either. 582515[/snapback] If those draft picks play better than the vets, then let 'em play. I not opposed to draft picks sitting while a player who is performing better gets more game action. I'm not suggesting we trade JP, nor am I suggesting we trade away the draft picks. If playing the inferior producer would somehow guarantee future success, I'm all for it. But it doesn't, so I'm not. As was mentioned above, I agree with Marv: Players should develop on the practice field. The need to produce on Sundays.
The Avenger Posted January 24, 2006 Posted January 24, 2006 Or possibly he feels JP won't develop and therefor needs to ride the pine and be a backup. Life in the NFL is to short to allow anyone including a QB 3 years to develop into a below average QB, especially when the average time a player spend in the NFL is 4 years. Sorry but a QB has got to start showing something by year two and be the best QB on the team by year 3, or it's time to find another one. 582485[/snapback] I agree - you can't wait forever for someone to develop. By the same token, you also have to give him enough experience to show whether he's got it or not. In my mind it's not so much about years under contract as it is about games played. JP played nothing in his rookie year, and only saw 8 games last season. In my book he's halfway through his "rookie" year. Give him another 8-16 games and then decide his future, but don't keep the kid on the bench in some silly pursuit of a 6 win season under the guise of "winning now".
Buftex Posted January 24, 2006 Posted January 24, 2006 I want Holcomb cut. 582008[/snapback] This typifies the insanity that the 2005 season has braught us...because Losman didn't pan out (his fault or not) Losman fan-boys are blaming Holcomb? When did Bills fans become so over-reactive? Losman will, hopefully, prove to be better than Holcomb ever will be, but don't act like Holcomb was the problem with this team this year. It may not be saying much, but he was one of the few bright spots, at times, noodle arm or not....
Campy Posted January 24, 2006 Posted January 24, 2006 This typifies the insanity that the 2005 season has braught us...because Losman didn't pan out (his fault or not) Losman fan-boys are blaming Holcomb? When did Bills fans become so over-reactive? Losman will, hopefully, prove to be better than Holcomb ever will be, but don't act like Holcomb was the problem with this team this year. It may not be saying much, but he was one of the few bright spots, at times, noodle arm or not.... 582529[/snapback] Well said buftex, well said.
BillsWatch Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 This kid has talent and skills, before we see him in the playoffs in another team's uniform for the next 10 seasons the Bills organization needs to give him the chance in 2006 to show he's the man. 581960[/snapback] As long as the bag heads are going to DEMAND that Jauron have a winning season than the Bills coaching staff is going to try to win next year even if the idol of the bag heads is not starting. You can only support developing a QB when fans will support the team; unlike other cities the Bills do not have lots of revenue streams other than ticket, concession (they need to cut back on beer sales due to the idiots) and jersey sales. A new QB would increase jersey sales.
Fan in Chicago Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 As long as the bag heads are going to DEMAND that Jauron have a winning season than the Bills coaching staff is going to try to win next year even if the idol of the bag heads is not starting. You can only support developing a QB when fans will support the team; unlike other cities the Bills do not have lots of revenue streams other than ticket, concession (they need to cut back on beer sales due to the idiots) and jersey sales. A new QB would increase jersey sales. 582608[/snapback] Well considering ML did not really 'listen' to the clamouring for Mike Sherman, I doubt the decision for or against JP will be made by fans' choice. Maybe, just maybe, the open competition really happens. That would be the best way to go anyway 'cos then pretentious old-timers like Moulds will have nothing to complain about.
respk Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 JP is at least two years of clip board duty away from being competitive. ML and DJ and RW don't have that kind of time to waste on grooming a QB who may not make it. I expect they will find a FA QB that can take of things the next 2-3 years while they build a better team. Hopefully do well enough to make the team playoff caliber and then insert JP if needed. I also think is at least 50-50, maybe higher, that he gets cut after next year. ML, DJ don't have to worry about the 1st round draft pick setting on the bench they didn't draft him. They can right him off to the TD era and find someone else to play QB. Wouldn't surprise me that the starting QB in 2007-08 and beyond is drafted or signed as a FA this year
bobblehead Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 unlike other cities the Bills do not have lots of revenue streams other than ticket, concession (they need to cut back on beer sales due to the idiots) and jersey sales. 582608[/snapback] Other than the lack of season-ticket sell-outs for years in advance like other cities have, I would say that Buffalo is doing quite well comparatively with the rest of the league. I'm quite confident that the bag heads will have squat for say in the matter.
Lori Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 A new QB would increase jersey sales. 582608[/snapback] Damn, Glenn, you just figured out Tom Donahoe's entire five-year plan!
SlamnSam Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 I'd like to believe that JP will be a better QB than Holcomb. Right now, that's not the case. And the 4 INT game you cited is a bit misleading, is it not? He had two balls bounce off receivers hands and get picked, another was a desperation toss at the end of the game. But since you're into stats, take a peak at JP's numbers. Then take a peak at Holcomb's. Same players, different results. Personally, I hope they are true to their word and open it up to competition this summer. I think that JP would perform better if he's being pushed. A better performance out of JP is something that all Bills fans should want to see. Whether JP's the real deal, I don't think so. I don't think he has "it." I'm hoping like hell that he proves me wrong. 581991[/snapback] JP does have it, and the 4 ints are what they are.
Spiderweb Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 I'm embarrassed at how many fans here have already given up on this kid. Post after post I read how it's Kelly Holcombs job or another journeymen veteran's yet to be acquired. Kelly Holcomb sucks, he's had 10 years in this league to put it all together and he finishes with 4 turnovers against the Jets to close out our miserable season. I have no doubts that Losman will surpass Holcomb in training camp. What I find amazing is the amount of weak-kneed hand wringers here who can't stomach the development of a young QB. Y'all must be from the Mike Malarkey School of QB Handling. Suck it up and deal with it, this team is not going to the Superbowl next season. I know it may come as a shock to some of you but it had to be put out there. None of us know if JP Losman is the next Brett Favre/Matt Hasselback or if he's a genuine first round flop. However with that said, the last thing this team should do right now is to not give him the chance next season. Fans and players need to put down their Superbowl pipe dreams for the coming season and get behind Losman. This kid has talent and skills, before we see him in the playoffs in another team's uniform for the next 10 seasons the Bills organization needs to give him the chance in 2006 to show he's the man. 581960[/snapback] Actually, the board seemed more in favor for JP than Holcomb, at least that s how I saw it. Many thought Holcomb did give us a better chance to win right now, but majority of those also agreed he's not the answer for the Bills at QB. JP lost valuable playing time the last 3 games while TD & MM were frantically trying to save their "butts".
jarthur31 Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 I'm embarrassed at how many fans here have already given up on this kid. Post after post I read how it's Kelly Holcombs job or another journeymen veteran's yet to be acquired. Kelly Holcomb sucks, he's had 10 years in this league to put it all together and he finishes with 4 turnovers against the Jets to close out our miserable season. I have no doubts that Losman will surpass Holcomb in training camp. What I find amazing is the amount of weak-kneed hand wringers here who can't stomach the development of a young QB. Y'all must be from the Mike Malarkey School of QB Handling. Suck it up and deal with it, this team is not going to the Superbowl next season. I know it may come as a shock to some of you but it had to be put out there. None of us know if JP Losman is the next Brett Favre/Matt Hasselback or if he's a genuine first round flop. However with that said, the last thing this team should do right now is to not give him the chance next season. Fans and players need to put down their Superbowl pipe dreams for the coming season and get behind Losman. This kid has talent and skills, before we see him in the playoffs in another team's uniform for the next 10 seasons the Bills organization needs to give him the chance in 2006 to show he's the man. 581960[/snapback] These are the same geniuses who threw DB under the bus w/o regard to the real problems the team had on offense. You can't please them or try to hold rationale conversation with them because you'll never win.
BuffOrange Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 I'd like to believe that JP will be a better QB than Holcomb. Right now, that's not the case. And the 4 INT game you cited is a bit misleading, is it not? He had two balls bounce off receivers hands and get picked, another was a desperation toss at the end of the game. But since you're into stats, take a peak at JP's numbers. Then take a peak at Holcomb's. Same players, different results. Personally, I hope they are true to their word and open it up to competition this summer. I think that JP would perform better if he's being pushed. A better performance out of JP is something that all Bills fans should want to see. Whether JP's the real deal, I don't think so. I don't think he has "it." I'm hoping like hell that he proves me wrong. 581991[/snapback] I agree with all this. I hope he plays every game next year and I hope he does well but I just don't see it. Yes he's young and yes he has a lousy supporting cast -- how does that make him different than Todd Collins and RJ after their first 8 games? Those guys had Antowain Smith, Derrick Holmes and a washed up Thurman Thomas to hand the ball off to, and an OL that sucked just the same. I'm not saying JP can't or won't be better than these guys, but I can't believe how he gets a free pass on EVERYTHING, and it's hard to believe he gets the benefit of the doubt having been drafted by a GM whom everybody agrees sucked at drafting players & finding QB's.
bobblehead Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 Damn, Glenn, you just figured out Tom Donahoe's entire five-year plan! 582912[/snapback] I think the Bills should wear Carhartt uniforms. That would be tough as sh--.
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 Or possibly he feels JP won't develop and therefor needs to ride the pine and be a backup. Life in the NFL is to short to allow anyone including a QB 3 years to develop into a below average QB, especially when the average time a player spend in the NFL is 4 years. Sorry but a QB has got to start showing something by year two and be the best QB on the team by year 3, or it's time to find another one. 582485[/snapback] Yeah, because Drew Brees was AWESOME those first 3 years. You're truly amazing. You'll go to any length to criticize JP. Look, his record and stats are what they are -- the record of a rookie. If the coaches think he shows no / not enough improvement in camp to win the job, fine. But giving the job to anyone outright at this point is ludicrous. No one's job should be safe. And that should be a motivating factor for EVERYONE.
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 25, 2006 Posted January 25, 2006 These are the same geniuses who threw DB under the bus w/o regard to the real problems the team had on offense. You can't please them or try to hold rationale conversation with them because you'll never win. 582962[/snapback] Drew deserved to be thrown under the bus. He is the platinum version of Kelly Holcomb. He couldn't win when we needed him to, and when the linemen were actually playing their best. He could beat all the paper tigers in the world but he couldn't seal the deal, just as he couldn't in Dallas this year. It was how the whole situation was handled afterwards that was messed up. JP (and the teammates he was going to lead) needed a competition for him to prove he was going to be their leader.
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